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Old 09-17-2018, 10:00 PM   #1
TeckTonic13
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Math books when it comes to playing live?

Hi

Does anyone know any good books? On doing math mentally at the table. I'm having trouble figuring out. What the pot is playing live. Just getting started playing live. Things are moving fast. And it can be very confusing. I want to know. What it was like learning poker math. In real time at the table. Any tricks or anything that has helped you guys. People say it becomes second nature.

Any books or advice?
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Old 09-17-2018, 10:06 PM   #2
Quadstriker
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Re: Math books when it comes to playing live?

One thing I would suggest is practice doing calculations on hands you're not in, and it will help to make it 2nd nature. Just because you fold preflop doesn't mean you have to mentally checkout of the hand.

So if you're watching 6 players call a 35 dollar raise preflop and then there's a bet of 70 and a call on the turn and the third player is tanking, put yourself in the 3rd player's shoes and do your calculations. That way you'll get the practice without the stress of also figuring out how to play your cards.
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Old 09-18-2018, 12:08 AM   #3
SpewingIsMyMove
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Re: Math books when it comes to playing live?

It would be helpful to know specifically what type of calculations you are trying to do. Quad is correct, though, that the best way to learn is to always track the action in hands you aren't in. Track the pot, track the bets as percentages of the pot, calculate what a pot sized raise would be, calculate pot odds on calls, etc. Do this enough, it becomes second nature. You will honestly get to the point where you can tell, within about 10%, what the pot is even without consciously tracking it.

Some poker math cannot be done at the table. You aren't going to be able to figure your equity, for example, against a range with a board that has multiple draws in your head (it is doable, but would take a fair amount of time). For calculations like that, best to work with an equity calculator away from the table and just memorize common scenarios.
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Old 09-18-2018, 01:31 AM   #4
Mason Malmuth
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Re: Math books when it comes to playing live?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TeckTonic13 View Post
Hi

Does anyone know any good books? On doing math mentally at the table. I'm having trouble figuring out. What the pot is playing live. Just getting started playing live. Things are moving fast. And it can be very confusing. I want to know. What it was like learning poker math. In real time at the table. Any tricks or anything that has helped you guys. People say it becomes second nature.

Any books or advice?
Getting the Best of It by David Sklansky.

Best wishes,
Mason
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Old 09-18-2018, 06:06 AM   #5
TeckTonic13
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Re: Math books when it comes to playing live?

Ok

I was referring to things like what the pot is? Or whats a pot sized bet? I feel like I haven't been making bets or calls that have positive exception. For years things like c betting frequency? I like the idea of staying balanced and not getting exploited especially now of days. Where players are so good.
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Old 09-18-2018, 08:32 AM   #6
SpewingIsMyMove
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Re: Math books when it comes to playing live?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TeckTonic13 View Post
Ok

I was referring to things like what the pot is? Or whats a pot sized bet? I feel like I haven't been making bets or calls that have positive exception. For years things like c betting frequency? I like the idea of staying balanced and not getting exploited especially now of days. Where players are so good.
OK, tracking the pot is pretty straight forward. Just multiply the number of players by the size of the bet, and that is your total for the round. Add that to the previous round.

To calculate a pot sized bet, take the pot total from the previous round. For a pot size raise, take the pot from the previous round, add the 3 times the current bet amount, and that would be the amount you raise too if you wanted to raise pot sized (You add his bet and your call to the pot to get the amount of the pot, then you calculate the size of the total bet by adding that amount to the size of the call, that is why it is previous pot+3x the call amount)

For tracking frequencies, my open frequency, cbet frequency, 3b frequency, I just try to be aware of what I have been doing for a couple of orbits. I do know players who keep a notepad and a tally sheet, but I just try to ask myself 'How many times have I opened in the last two orbits'. Yes, small sample size and all that, but it helps me stay aware. I am not looking for an exact number, just trying to keep myself from skewing too far in one direction of the other.

Making +EV decisions is a bit more complex, and is basically the heart of poker. This involves putting your opponents on ranges. As mentioned before, it is too difficult to calculate equity against a range in your head. Download equilab, and then run all the common scenarios you run into (like mid-high pair versus 3B range preflop, TPTK versus flush draw, etc) and memorize them, then use them to calculate if a bet or call is + or - EV.

Balancing your ranges (this is one of the topics involved in GTO play) to become not exploitable is a whole different animal, is debateable as to whether or not it is the best approach at lower limits(most lower limit live players are unbalanced, and it is usually best to play a style that exploits them)
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