Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

Notices

Beginners Questions Poker beginner? Ask your (possibly) naive question here and our community will attempt to help you.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-13-2018, 06:25 PM   #1
Knittle
grinder
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 429
Turbo SnG's

Hi guys,

I've recently stopped playing MTT's (not completely) because of the WPN drama, so I decided to start dabbling in SnG's on BOL as they have a leaderboard.

My questions:
1) Is ICMizer/HRC the best tools for studying these spots? I thought they were only for pre-flop decisions/push fold? I'm not talking basic spots, I'm talking tough turn/river spots vs exploitable fish.

2) Looked up the biggest/most high volume regs and even in Turbo's they're playing soooo tight. I'm used to running something similar to 25/17/7 for MTT's.. but these regs are insanely tight.. I'm talking 10/8/1 type of numbers..

Is this a norm for SnG's? I get preserving your stacks in the early stages of SnG's.. but it seems a little abnormal to be running this insanely tight. Obviously they are loosening up as BB's get shorter.. but lord oh lord.. is really playing this tight optimal for mass-tabling $1.50-$3 SnG's?


Thanks.. probably not a beginner question but not sure where else to ask these things.

Thanks.
Knittle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2018, 06:27 PM   #2
sixfour
should be called sevenfour
 
sixfour's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Fire Rod Harrington
Posts: 59,340
Re: Turbo SnG's

Dunno what is normal now as this seems to be a dead genre, but yeah, tight is correct early
sixfour is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2018, 06:35 PM   #3
Knittle
grinder
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 429
Re: Turbo SnG's

Quote:
Originally Posted by sixfour View Post
Dunno what is normal now as this seems to be a dead genre, but yeah, tight is correct early
Number 1 grinder on BOL ($250 for first on leaderboard for SnG's under $7) has 9k games played since November on BOL.

They run pretty constant on this site for some reason.. guy is bringing in $500 weekly (MTT leaderboard under $7 as well).. not counting points/profits. Seems pretty solid ;p $2k just in freebies.

That tight though? Like what's the reasoning for me not opening 100% of my buttons vs a guy running 10/6/2 in the BB?
Knittle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2018, 07:24 PM   #4
sixfour
should be called sevenfour
 
sixfour's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Fire Rod Harrington
Posts: 59,340
Re: Turbo SnG's

because there's no value in stealing worthless chips early because of icm
sixfour is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2018, 07:35 PM   #5
Knittle
grinder
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 429
Re: Turbo SnG's

Quote:
Originally Posted by sixfour View Post
because there's no value in stealing worthless chips early because of icm
I'm confused..
1) Any chips gained raise your % to cash right?
2) Worthless chips? How can any chips be worthless? Seems as though you'd be printing chips against a villain that tight?

Sorry, don't mean to come off aggressive or whatever just genuinely curious.
Knittle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2018, 04:22 AM   #6
sixfour
should be called sevenfour
 
sixfour's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Fire Rod Harrington
Posts: 59,340
Re: Turbo SnG's

1) because of ICM the value of chips won is worth less than the value of chips lost. if it's folded round to your SB first hand, you jam, get called, and win, your expectation does not double. as such, the gains from stealing in the first couple of levels aren't worth risking the potential downside if you get played back at. we're not actually interested in % to cash, or % to win, we're interested in making +$EV decisions
2) basically the same question. if they're tight because they're mass tabling it's because they're needing to make lots of simple decisions quickly and passing up on marginal spots isn't going to cost them much. also, if you're tracking them, they're going to be tracking you, and if they notice you're getting out of line then they will probably start playing back at you with nothing
sixfour is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2018, 12:22 PM   #7
Knittle
grinder
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 429
Re: Turbo SnG's

Quote:
Originally Posted by sixfour View Post
1) because of ICM the value of chips won is worth less than the value of chips lost. if it's folded round to your SB first hand, you jam, get called, and win, your expectation does not double. as such, the gains from stealing in the first couple of levels aren't worth risking the potential downside if you get played back at. we're not actually interested in % to cash, or % to win, we're interested in making +$EV decisions
2) basically the same question. if they're tight because they're mass tabling it's because they're needing to make lots of simple decisions quickly and passing up on marginal spots isn't going to cost them much. also, if you're tracking them, they're going to be tracking you, and if they notice you're getting out of line then they will probably start playing back at you with nothing

Thanks man, appreciated.
Knittle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2018, 03:05 PM   #8
madlex
Custom User Title
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 7,747
Re: Turbo SnG's

I have no idea how good the regulars at those super low stakes are, but the reason for higher stakes on sites like Stars being basically non-existant anymore is that almost everybody has solved the game to a degree that beating high rake is almost impossible.

So if you look at stats from those players, the perfect numbers shouldn't be that different. There's a chance that (slightly) less tight is actually maximizing EV for a single game, but that gain isn't worth playing less tables.
madlex is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2018, 07:48 PM   #9
Knittle
grinder
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 429
Re: Turbo SnG's

Quote:
Originally Posted by madlex View Post
I have no idea how good the regulars at those super low stakes are, but the reason for higher stakes on sites like Stars being basically non-existant anymore is that almost everybody has solved the game to a degree that beating high rake is almost impossible.

So if you look at stats from those players, the perfect numbers shouldn't be that different. There's a chance that (slightly) less tight is actually maximizing EV for a single game, but that gain isn't worth playing less tables.
Makes sense. Ya these games are highly beatable though, I'd say at the $1.50 and 3's you get one average reg at MOST. Most people running insane numbers like 60/0/0 etc.

Thanks for replying Madlex.


Edit: I'd like to see some of those numbers that good solid regs on Stars run.. and see where I'm at in comparison and see their ranges (if you have a resource for this).
Knittle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2018, 09:34 PM   #10
Freedom101
newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Vancouver BC
Posts: 24
Re: Turbo SnG's

Hey guys - n00b question but what does 60/0/0 and 10/8/1 mean?

Thanka
Freedom101 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2018, 11:09 PM   #11
King Spew
Antici
 
King Spew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: pation
Posts: 10,887
Re: Turbo SnG's

See the question #2....under the Read Me First thread at the top of the BQ page?
King Spew is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:38 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2017, Two Plus Two Interactive
 
 
Poker Players - Streaming Live Online