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Old 06-15-2010, 06:01 PM   #1276
SomeGuy82
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

For some unknwo reason, I did not manage to post pics. Maybe I should resize them ?
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Old 06-15-2010, 06:52 PM   #1277
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

franco:
Move down. You are a loose-passive fish that will just get killed at NL25 and up.
Why are you a fish?
First, I can't be entirely sure, but it looks like you play full-ring (9-handed or 10-handed).
Your VP$IP is 25.6%, yet your PFR is only 6.6%. This means you are limping/calling most of the time you decide to play a hand preflop. This is very wrong.
Most of the time you want to play a hand preflop, is because you think you have the best hand (or at least, are the favorite to win the hand, which is not the same thing).
If you are the favorite to win the hand, you should raise to get money into the pot.
You shouldn't limp "to see a flop cheap", you should raise TO PREVENT THE OTHER PLAYERS FROM SEEING A CHEAP FLOP. CHarge them for seeing the flop.
If you don't think you have the best hand preflop, fold.

25% VPIP at full-ring is just way too loose, and 6% PFR is ridiculously low. There are no hard figures for what is best, but at fullring I think your VPIP should be anywhere between 12% and 20%, with your PFR about 3/4 of that. SO 3 out of 4 times you enter a pot, do so by raising. The only exceptions are cheap limps in the SB, and limps in position with speculative hands (small suited connectors and pocket pairs).

Postflop, you are also way too much of a calling station. Your Aggression Frequency is OK (in the 40s), yet your aggression factor is very low, because you are calling WAY TOO MUCH. Again, most of the time, either you are way behind and you should fold, or you are way ahead and you should raise bets. Calling just doesnt happen very often, just in some cases when you are getting good enough odds to draw, or in some Way Ahead/Way Behind situations when you decide to just call down.

By calling instead of raising/folding, you lose in 2 ways:
(1) You are calling down losing hands too often
(2) You are not getting enough value out of hands that you are winning.

With your current stats, I'd advise you to move down to the lowest level (NL2) until you can beat that, and take it from there.
I haven't even touched on position here, because your stats don't show the play by position, but I'd bet you aren't psotionally aware enough.
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Old 06-15-2010, 07:02 PM   #1278
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

SomeGuy82:
You aren't just weak tight, you are a super nitty weak-tight rock. VPIP of 10 and PFR of 6 is just super tight. If I were at your table, and you raise a hand, I'd just fold anything except QQ+, probably even AK. YOur preflop range on the BUTTON is only 16%!
AT least you are positionally aware, but in today's poker world you cannot just play the top 5% of hands and expect people not to notice.

The postflop, you somehow manage to win only 30% of hands when you see the flop, even though with your supertight range, you should be winning more than 50%. So you mist be folding an astonishing amount of winners.
Of course, with your auper-tight range, it isn't exactly hard for opponents to read your hand: you always have a premium hand, and when you get it in big, you are almost sure to have a set, because that's all there is in your range.

I'm not sure where to begin with advice for you. You should basically start to play poker, rather than just waiting for premium hands to see a flop with and then continue when you hit monsters.
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Old 06-16-2010, 04:16 AM   #1279
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

I am not too surprised... Always felt like I was playing "fit or fold", or "looking for excuses to fold".

All this means I should :
- try to play more pots preflop, raising more preferably ? I hate raising in EP preflop... And I already raise so much more in the button than UTG. That will be hard, but I'll try. In truth I believe I give a lot of credit to early raisers. Maybe too much ?
- not give up so easily on the flop ? Maybe I should analyse if I give up pots when I raise or when I call. If it is when I call, then raise more instead of calling pf, even with small pps.

Last edited by SomeGuy82; 06-16-2010 at 04:24 AM.
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Old 06-16-2010, 04:33 AM   #1280
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

SomeGuy82: You can't be far wrong if you never ever open-limp a hand, even in EP. It's certainly good to keep a tight range in EP, but it should be a bit more than just premium hands. In later positions you can iso-raise or steal so often (maybe less in fullring, I don't know). I honestly think you could be playing twice as many hands on the button and still have them all be +EV.

Postflop: yes, don't forget that not only do you miss the flop 2/3 of the time, so do your opponents. And given your tight preflop ranges, that means you still have the best hand if you both miss.
Of course, this does make your play harder, but if I get a lot of folds to c-bets playing 25/20, I think you should be getting them too, playing as tight as you do.
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Old 06-16-2010, 04:47 AM   #1281
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

Thanks for your time.

32% in the button seems huge to me. FWIW, I tried 6 max recently, and I have loosened to something like 23/16 pf. 32%... wann give me a heart attack ? Ill try and do better than 16% if you think it is too tight.

Is my C-Bet stat available on the pics i uploaded ? is it any good (expecting a no ^^) ?

Last edited by SomeGuy82; 06-16-2010 at 04:56 AM.
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Old 06-16-2010, 05:05 AM   #1282
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

Hi guys im new here, looking to improve my game. Please tell me what i need to work on. This is filtered .01c/.02c cos i played .02c/.05c for a bit, but lost about $25 or so, so i felt i needed to grind a lower stake and improve more. Your help is much appreciated!

EDIT: Sorry I dont have 10k hands, i just read, my bad :S

.01c/.02c FR

http://fuznic.com/images/JRMZiDetails.png
http://fuznic.com/images/jrmzi.jpg
http://fuznic.com/images/JRMZigraph.png

Last edited by JermzX; 06-16-2010 at 05:13 AM. Reason: Not within Criteria
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Old 06-16-2010, 05:36 AM   #1283
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeGuy82 View Post
Is my C-Bet stat available on the pics i uploaded ? is it any good (expecting a no ^^) ?
It is not, but I see your flop Agbr Freq is only 35%, which means you are basically only betting the flop when you hit it. That's more or less the definition of fit or fold play.
What you have to do is consider the situation from your opponent's persepctive too:
(1) Did he hit the flop? You must have an idea of his range and how likely it is he hit. If he didn't, will he call a bet from you? If he is like you, he won't.
Example: you have AKo on the button and isolation raise an early limper. HU to the flop. Flop is 862r. He Checks, you bet. Will he call with, say, JTo? Great!! Will he fold? You win the pot.
(2) Do you have position?
(3) Are you ahead of his range (see 1)?

BTW, 23/16 is quite OK for 6-max. If you play the exact same style at fullring, you should playing something like 17/13 or so, which is much looser than your current style.

As an aside, when it is folded to me on the button, I open-raise as a steal about 60% of hands. Against some opponents I'll raise nearly any two cards (because they fold the blinds > 80%).
That's a bit extreme, but stealing 50% on the button is quite easy. Just raise 3 x BB on the button. If you get called, just c-bet the flop with good hands. If people fold a lot to your open-raises, just winning the blinds 75% of the time make the play +EV, even if you lose all hands where the blinds don't fold.
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Old 06-16-2010, 05:40 AM   #1284
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

JermzX: it's only 3k hands, so I just had a quick look.
Your preflop play is reasonable, but totally non position aware. It looks like you play roughly the same range in all positions. This means you are way too loose in early position, and too tight in late position. Button VPIP should be at least twice the UTG VPIP, and probably more.

Postflop you are very aggressive, and folding to most resistance. That's a fairly good strategy, certainly at NL2. You may need to develop this a bit more later, but it's OK for mow.
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Old 06-16-2010, 07:27 AM   #1285
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

Ill try to get my cbet and fold to cbets stats in PT. Might be useful.

Regarding my stats in 6 max, I forgot to mention it is NL10. Not the same level than 10 handed NL 50 in my opinion. They call with anything. I will probably get tighter if I manage to move up ? We'll see...

AS for loosening my game in full ring, do you know where I could find a good starting hands chart for 10-handed ?

Thanks in advance,

SG
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Old 06-16-2010, 07:53 AM   #1286
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

SomeGuy: No idea. Have a look at the microstakes full-ring forum here, there's probably something there.
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Old 06-16-2010, 11:11 AM   #1287
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

Thanks for the advice. I will follow it.
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Old 06-16-2010, 11:31 AM   #1288
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

Greetings - I started to post this in the uNL forum and realized this would be a better place to start. I am a recreational player looking to just start breaking even. I play about 100 hands\day, two tabling 10NL.

My stats are mixed 5nl\10nl, and all track very closely which is why I included them, to give a larger sample size. Over my first 7200 hands I played 19/6/2.2 and had a winrate of -5.89 BB/100. Than I started reading and looking at hand histories and researching. The next 8700 hands have been 12/9/2.76 but the winrate only improved to -5.04 so there has to be something still going on that I need to address.





I can't really explain the spike in VPIP in MP, or that it has my highest winrate, unless it's because of the small sample size. Any advice is greatly appreciated.

Nub
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Old 06-17-2010, 01:38 AM   #1289
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

nubxxx: Preflop you are insufficiently position aware. Your VPIP/PFR ranges are nearly identical in all positions, while you should be much more loose and aggressive as you get nearer to the button. As it is, you are too loose in the first few positions, and much too tight on button and CO.

Postflop you are playing very weak tight, you make an occasional stab on the flop, but then just give up always unless you have a very strong hand.
It looks like you should specifically try to become more position aware, and also postflop try to hand read better, because I'm sure you are giving up with the best hand a lot.
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Old 06-17-2010, 09:44 AM   #1290
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

Thank you Fab - good stuff.
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Old 06-18-2010, 09:21 AM   #1291
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

Hello everyone,
I'm a bit of a beginner, but have read a lot of material and dedicated myself to learning on a daily basis. Really looking to improve, I generally feel I have the edge at 5NL over most players, yet my winrate is pretty poor and I'm not really happy that at 17k hands I've won $6.50. I've looked through this thread and found some leaks, but I attribute it the poor winrate to some absolutely horrendous calls I've made to All-in bets, something which will never happen again (unless I have the nuts or second nuts or a very strong read)

I know my wtsd is probably a little bit too high and my w$sd% is a bit low, I also understand my PFR is low compared to my VPIP, something that I will increase ; something I've heard is that it is profitably at such low stakes to limp sometimes, instead of bloating the pot with small pocket pairs (dependent on position), particularly if you're against looser aggressive players. Again, I'll be looking to increase my PFR.








Any insight is really appreciated. Thank you
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Old 06-18-2010, 02:40 PM   #1292
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

Player1205:
Yes, you are limping too much preflop. You're right that it's OK to limp speculative hands in family pots at this level. However, if there are just one or two limpers, I would still prefer to raise in late position. You just win so many hands with a preflop raise and a continuation bet, even at NL2.

Also, you have done right to analyze your bug hands, and yes, river all-ins (or any huge bet) at these levels usually mean the better has a monster, so you should fold everything except monsters.

Your WTSD/W$SD in itself are not exceptional by the way, and also these have limited reliability even for largish samples (your 17% VPIP and 27% WTSD over 17k hands means about 500 or 600 showdowns, so that's not enough for a really reliable figure.)

Preflop, you should also become more position aware. You can play way more hands in late position because you are in position. Just try it, by slightly widening your (iso-)raising range to hands like QT, J9, 87s, etc. You will have to learn to play poker there, but that's also sort of the goal.

Postflop, you seem too passive -- your aggression frequencies are quite, even below 30% on the flop. Considering your tight preflop range you are very likely to have the best hand on the flop unless you miss in a 4-way or more pot. SO just bet your AQo on a 752 board. If you have raised preflop, opponents will have a hard time continuing unless they have a pair, and even then it's tricky for them (since you are repping an overpair). These bets are a sort of value bluff -- you are likely to have the best hand, but even if you don't, opponents with low pairs have a hard time continuing.

Final remark, not so important buit still: it looks like you are calling too many 3-bets (nearly 50%). Most players at this level dont 3-bet light', so you should fold most 3-bets (70% or so).
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Old 06-19-2010, 04:04 AM   #1293
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Angry Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

2NL 6-Max, Poker Stars

This is for the month of June.

This is my attempt at playing online poker, I've read Phil Gordon books and TTOP and many other books. I understand all the different kind of bets, (value,floating,checkraise,semibluff) I've become a bit pissed at all of this. Enough bitching...


These are my stats, It seems that i've become more of a nit playing the low stakes for some reason. I drew lines in my graph to represent the sessions. It seems that when I started I was attacking it like 1/2 at a casino and it worked good, then when people told me to Value bet and such I began to play an exploitable game...

BTW, I seem to not be able to trust myself, even if I think 100% a foe has a full house or such, I can't lay down my flush or straight.




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Old 06-19-2010, 05:44 AM   #1294
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

SAmmyLC: I think overall, you are mostly not being aggressive enough.
You are fairly tight preflop, but limp a lot, with apparently even quite a lot of open-limping, which you should simply never ever do in 6-max.
The only times you limp/call preflop is when you have a speculative hand with a bunch of limpers in front of you, or when you get to complete the small blind getting huge odds.

Then postflop, you say you are just value betting, but your stats show you hardly ever bet at all -- your aggression frequency is under 30% on all streets. This means you are not nearly value betting enough. You have a tight preflop range, and reasinable position awareness, so more often than not, you are going to be ahead on the flop -- so bet!
You raise one limper with AQo, get called and the flop is J72r: bet!
You are only betting 25% of flops, that is crazy with your stats. You could probably profitably bet about 50%, possibly even more.
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Old 06-21-2010, 02:29 PM   #1295
Aidan
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

I'd love to have some input on my stats after 32K hands:



Please let me know if there is anything else that would be useful.
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Old 06-22-2010, 03:29 AM   #1296
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

Aidan: this chart doesnt show whether it's fullring or 6max. It also doesnt show positional stats, which are quite important.
If it's fullring you are on the loose side (but OK). If it's 6max you're on the nitty side (but also OK). Overall your stats seem sort of OK. The only thing possibly wrong is gthat you don't fold a lot to river bets and raises.
You won't find many leaks by looking at your stats though; you're gonna have to look at specific hands.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:30 AM   #1297
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

Yes, I apologise, it is partly 2NL and 5NL all full ring.

Position statistics:



Thank you for the input, i'll try to find and post some hands that have troubled me.
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Old 06-26-2010, 01:32 PM   #1298
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Re: ** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

been breaking even at 10NL 6max and FR for 30k hands now... did have a bad run but plz help me find some leak.

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Old 06-26-2010, 08:03 PM   #1299
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.05nl graph

Hi
moved up from .02nl.
I know it s difficult to tell from a graph but anyway here it is, my .05nl graph.

[IMG] Uploaded with ImageShack.us[/IMG]
does it look like I m running bad?
I started running like jesus in the middle of it but I m still well under EV.Will this even out? any thoughts please..
I guess i m posting this for motivation
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Old 06-26-2010, 08:10 PM   #1300
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Re: .05nl graph

First off this is 5NL, not 0.5.
But you seem to be doing just fine, I guess you're referring to the fact that it's been pretty break even lately. But those streaks happen and it's always better for you to simply break even during these downswings than to lose money. Your graph is steadily going up so all is good if you ask me
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