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Old 03-20-2019, 09:08 AM   #1
cw8
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Heart Winrate required to beat the play money poker rake?

A couple of years ago I was experiencing cognitive and memory issues. I studied poker and played it at the play money tables for a couple of months and eventually I got my brain back and a wondrous outlook towards life.

I started playing again a few days ago and the 9% rake I'm often seeing is scary. It was 5% when I played before.

From Stars website:
Quote:
In Play Money cash games and Zoom games, the rake rate ranges from 5.5% to 9% (depending on the game format and stakes).
The new rake appears to have massively changed things for the worst.

The highest stakes population don't appear to be having fun anymore. I'm concerned they are spending hours grinding like autonomous rocks instead of having fun like they used to be able to do.

When I played before I had learned to play a crushing style of poker and mostly it was entertaining for everyone at the table. I created action tables based on solid poker principles and I got people chatting and trying to get better at poker because they could see I was successfully doing just that. Even the usually grumpy people couldn't help but enjoy themselves when my river bluff overbets failed spectacularly.

I'm wondering if I have to tone it down because of the high rake and maybe I need to try to play perfectly just to be able to eke out a profit in the long run.

Another quote from Stars website regarding play money poker:
Quote:
Play Money chips are designed for entertainment, as well as to help beginners and intermediate players get familiar with poker rules, tournaments and cash games.
Has the rake increase contributed towards play money poker becoming an unhealthy form of entertainment?

Lets start with what winrate is required to beat the rake?
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Old 03-20-2019, 09:11 AM   #2
sixfour
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Re: Winrate required to beat the play money poker rake?

You're always breakeven, ducy?
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Old 03-20-2019, 09:33 AM   #3
cw8
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Re: Winrate required to beat the play money poker rake?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sixfour View Post
You're always breakeven, ducy?
Not yet.
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Old 03-20-2019, 10:08 AM   #4
SpinMeRightRound
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Re: Winrate required to beat the play money poker rake?

Who honestly cares about play money?

Whether the rake is 5% or 9%, play money players are so laughably awful, you should be comfortably crushing. Play money players are literally atrocious, far worse than anything in even the lowest of real money games.
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Old 03-20-2019, 10:43 AM   #5
kvnd
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Re: Winrate required to beat the play money poker rake?

You should be crushing play money for dozens of bb/100 so a difference of like 5bb/100 in rake or whatever is pretty much nothing
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Old 03-20-2019, 02:55 PM   #6
cw8
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Re: Winrate required to beat the play money poker rake?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sixfour View Post
You're always breakeven, ducy?
I'd appreciate any help you can provide.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpinMeRightRound View Post
Who honestly cares about play money?

Whether the rake is 5% or 9%, play money players are so laughably awful, you should be comfortably crushing. Play money players are literally atrocious, far worse than anything in even the lowest of real money games.
Perhaps you would think more about it if you focused on more than a lack of ability.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kvnd View Post
You should be crushing play money for dozens of bb/100 so a difference of like 5bb/100 in rake or whatever is pretty much nothing
Evidently I was over-dramatic regarding the eking out a profit and my potential winrate.

It's more about the rake increase appears to have resulted in an unhealthy form of entertainment for the apparently laughably awful/literally atrocious play money poker players.

What would real money players think about having to pay 9% rake to play in your games?
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Old 03-20-2019, 03:21 PM   #7
WereBeer
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Re: Winrate required to beat the play money poker rake?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kvnd View Post
You should be crushing play money for dozens of bb/100 so a difference of like 5bb/100 in rake or whatever is pretty much nothing
this

Any large difference in the enjoyment you experience is almost certainly not down to the rake change and perceived huge change in the paradigm.

I never played at 'the highest levels' of play money but I guess it's possible that people there have become good enough that you personally can't automatically crush. Maybe you need to move down where they enjoy your river overbets?
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Old 03-20-2019, 03:30 PM   #8
hyperknit
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Re: Winrate required to beat the play money poker rake?

People who donít grind play money tables all day obv donít know how negative this rake increase has been on players like us who multi-table for 4-6 hours a day the play money nose bleeds.
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Old 03-20-2019, 03:53 PM   #9
WereBeer
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Re: Winrate required to beat the play money poker rake?

True. Tougher than ever to be a pretend end boss.
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Old 03-20-2019, 05:20 PM   #10
cw8
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Re: Winrate required to beat the play money poker rake?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBeer View Post
this

Any large difference in the enjoyment you experience is almost certainly not down to the rake change and perceived huge change in the paradigm.

I never played at 'the highest levels' of play money but I guess it's possible that people there have become good enough that you personally can't automatically crush. Maybe you need to move down where they enjoy your river overbets?
Quote:
Originally Posted by hyperknit View Post
People who donít grind play money tables all day obv donít know how negative this rake increase has been on players like us who multi-table for 4-6 hours a day the play money nose bleeds.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBeer View Post
True. Tougher than ever to be a pretend end boss.
I appreciate the effort to write your wicked sentiments.

Here is a principle you should consider in the future before doing it again:

Quote:
Try to refrain from willfully creating or prolonging a harmful state of mind in another.
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