Greek players register early - Beginning Poker Questions

Hi,
Why is that Greek players register so early for big tournaments on poker stars?
Whenever I look ahead a few days to a big event EG. Sunday Million, 70-80% of the pre-registered players are greek, where as the % of greek players in the tournament in the end would be way less than 10%. Check it out if you don't believe me.
I'm not being racist i'm genuinely curious why.
Are they just a very punctual race?

03-24-2014 , 01:56 PM

AlienSpaceBat

table tilting animal

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 9,703

It is because of tax laws that the Greek govt introduced some months ago.

Basically pokerstars have to deduct tax from any daily winnings over $100 for any Greek player. This is given directly to the Greek govt.

If a player wins say $500 in a day then registers for 2 x $215 tourneys his winnings are counted as $70 and no tax is deducted that day.

03-24-2014 , 01:58 PM

kaput_25

grinder

Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 441

Ah good info ty, saw same thing just yesterday and wondered to myself what was up!

03-24-2014 , 02:15 PM

efra

adept

Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 957

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlienSpaceBat

that sucks for them, do you know the exact tax percentage? what if they win a big tourney?

03-24-2014 , 02:19 PM

garyk5846

grinder

Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 406

thanks for the reply alien.
Do you know if they can then unregister when the sunday million or whatever comes around, or will these leave them subject to the original tax?

Do the cash players have any loopholes like this?

03-24-2014 , 04:23 PM

AlienSpaceBat

table tilting animal

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 9,703

Quote:

Originally Posted by efra

that sucks for them, do you know the exact tax percentage? what if they win a big tourney?

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokerstars

Please explain the Player Withholding Tax (PWT), its calculation and the withholding process?

Based on the Greek gaming law, we must withhold PWT from profits in excess of €100 earned by you from gaming transactions in a player gaming session. Your profits from a gaming session are

For ring/cash games: winnings less bets placed in the gaming session (excluding any amounts where you are still at the table at the end of the gaming session); and
For Tournaments and Sit & Go: prizes won in the gaming session, less buy-ins paid during the gaming session.

The rates of tax are as follows:

No tax will be withheld for profits up to and including €100
15% tax for profits from €100.01 to €500
20% tax on profits over €500

Profits from gameplay in other currencies will be converted to Euros using applicable daily exchange rates.

Any withholding will only be calculated on the profit from the most recently completed gaming session (if over €100). Account balances can safely exceed €100 without the fear of deductions being made.

^^ from http://www.pokerstars.gr/en/poker/room/support/pwt-faq/

Quote:

Originally Posted by garyk5846

When they unregister, the refunded buyin counts as winnings. Obviously what they are trying to do is to unregister the MTTs when they have losing days. Both cash and tourney players are doing this afaik.

03-24-2014 , 04:29 PM

Fatboy54

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 3,876

Well how about we show them a little support and take this pointless thread down before someone in the thieving ****ing tax office reads it??

Just sayin

03-24-2014 , 04:34 PM

AlienSpaceBat

table tilting animal

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 9,703

Because there is a 700 post thread in NVG about this which has been there since November 2013, and has been on the front page of the forum for most of that time ?

03-24-2014 , 04:57 PM

A_Schupick

Micros Bad Cop

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 8,271

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fatboy54

Well how about we show them a little support and take this pointless thread down before someone in the thieving ****ing tax office reads it??

Just sayin

How about we also not protect people who are breaking the law?

03-24-2014 , 05:12 PM

#10

Babarberousse

old hand

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 1,752

Well, to me it seems they aren't breaking the law.
They still can't make more than 100$/day without paying taxes.

03-24-2014 , 05:58 PM

#11

A_Schupick

Micros Bad Cop

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 8,271

Quote:

Originally Posted by Babarberousse

Well, to me it seems they aren't breaking the law.
They still can't make more than 100$/day without paying taxes.

It's fraud if they unregister on losing days. No other way to slice it.

03-24-2014 , 06:09 PM

#12

AlienSpaceBat

table tilting animal

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 9,703

Quote:

Originally Posted by A_Schupick

It's fraud if they unregister on losing days. No other way to slice it.

I'm not so sure this is right.

The regulations came into effect 4 months ago, and I haven't kept up with the other thread fully. My understanding is that this process is actually understood by the Greek authorities and is part of an accommodation that they came to with stars. I am saying this purely from memory though.

03-24-2014 , 06:19 PM

#13

MMSS

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 4,679

Quote:

Originally Posted by A_Schupick

It's fraud if they unregister on losing days. No other way to slice it.

How can you make statements like this unless you're aware of the situation completely? If they are committing fraud it's not exactly well hidden and I'm sure it'll catch up with them because Stars won't want people doing funny stuff on their site.

03-24-2014 , 07:09 PM

#14

Fatboy54

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 3,876

Quote:

How about we also not protect people who are breaking the law?

way to support the community bro

/thread

03-24-2014 , 07:26 PM

#15

WereBeer

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 10,700

Quote:

Originally Posted by garyk5846

Are they just a very punctual race?

LOL

03-24-2014 , 09:08 PM

#16

A_Schupick

Micros Bad Cop

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 8,271

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fatboy54

way to support the community bro

/thread

O, I'm sorry that my support of the community doesn't contain potentially illegal things. How terribke of me.

03-24-2014 , 09:09 PM

#17

A_Schupick

Micros Bad Cop

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 8,271

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlienSpaceBat

If true, awesome.

03-24-2014 , 09:38 PM

#18

Chris DolMeth

self-banned

Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 721

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fatboy54

Well how about we show them a little support

Oh funny one, us Euros have supported the Greeks enough as it is. I say **** em'.

03-24-2014 , 09:47 PM

#19

A_Schupick

Micros Bad Cop

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 8,271

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris DolMeth

Oh funny one, us Euros have supported the Greeks enough as it is. I say **** em'.

lol

03-24-2014 , 11:23 PM

#20

TheDefiniteArticle

Indecisive

Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 14,123

ffs, respect for the law as an institution matters more than some petty 'community' where everyone's trying to take everyone else's money.

03-25-2014 , 11:21 AM

#21

asriva

adept

Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 982

If a law is illogical or stupid, down with the system.

03-25-2014 , 12:39 PM

#22

TheDefiniteArticle

Indecisive

Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 14,123

Takes a lot for something to be illogical.

03-25-2014 , 01:00 PM

#23

Kralex

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 2,349

Quote:

Originally Posted by A_Schupick

O, I'm sorry that my support of the community doesn't contain potentially illegal things. How terribke of me.

Blindly supporting the law when it is wrong makes you a terrible person.

Doesn't even have to be in relation to Poker.

Just sayin'

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDefiniteArticle

Takes a lot for something to be illogical.

Not when it comes to law. I really don't think I need to post examples as to why "respect for the law" isn't always the right thing to do.

03-25-2014 , 01:13 PM

#24

TheDefiniteArticle

Indecisive

Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 14,123

I think you do need to post examples. We need to be careful when dissenting from particular laws as it may breed contempt for the law in general. Especially in cases like this, it's just a small issue which really isn't worth the risk.

03-25-2014 , 01:31 PM

#25

garyk5846

grinder

Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 406

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDefiniteArticle

That law deserves contempt. There are others too.

A player NL50 earning around $250 a week could have results of say +$500, +$350, -$550, -$125 , -$300, +$500, -$125.
Without tax avoidance, this person will pay
$1350 *15% = $202.50 tax in a week, on a $250 gross income.
Thats an 81% tax rate.

I don't see how it "really isn't worth the risk".

Do you work for the tax office?

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