Two Plus Two Poker Forums Constructing Ranges
 Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read TwoPlusTwo.com

 Notices

 02-21-2019, 08:55 AM #1 WNP8888 newbie   Join Date: Feb 2019 Posts: 22 Constructing Ranges Hi guys, I'm still fairly new to poker, but have been watching a lot of video's and reading forums/websites to try and learn. I'm trying to use a card matrix to have a standard set of moves preflop in each position, which can then be tightened or loosened depending on how the table is playing. I'll mainly be playing micro stakes online, so understand that means I should tighten up a little compared to what might be seen as standard (less bluffs and more value bets). So my question is, what are good VPIP, PFR, 3bet% and 4bet% ratios to play from each position (assuming 6 max games)? My first go at constructing a range for the Button is: Button - VPIP = 20% PFR = 14% 3bet = 7% 4bet =2.6% Would those be good stats to play with?
 02-21-2019, 09:04 AM #2 Duncelanas Pooh-Bah     Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Losing money at husngs Posts: 5,256 Re: Constructing Ranges I don't play much cash, but this range is absurdly tight from the btn in unopened pots and you also have way too big of a vpip/pfr gap. Basically you want to be opening for a raise unless there are openlimpers behind you. I suggest checking out something like upswing poker's free opening ranges and using those as a starting point.
 02-21-2019, 09:26 AM #3 Iblis adept     Join Date: May 2016 Location: Rome Posts: 969 Re: Constructing Ranges 20/17 (14 too low)/7 is something you might want to play on average considering all positions, not from the button.
 02-21-2019, 11:07 AM #4 ArtyMcFly Carpal \'Tunnel     Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Enchantment Under the Sea Posts: 11,937 Re: Constructing Ranges For 6-max microstakes, fairly typical opening frequencies (assuming no one else entered the pot) are as follows: UTG: 14% MP/HJ: 18% CO: 24% BTN: 42% SB: 40% But you can exploitatively play wider than that in late position (some winners open 60% on the button), especially if the BB is a nit or a fish. If you're opening for 3x or larger, then tighter ranges, especially UTG, make more sense.
 02-21-2019, 01:54 PM #5 WNP8888 newbie   Join Date: Feb 2019 Posts: 22 Re: Constructing Ranges Thanks guys, your posts have been very helpful! I've gone back to the drawing board, and thought more about what I'd do in various circumstances from the button, and so far have the following: If folded to - VPIP 41%, PRF 41% (Maybe even a little wider if I think SB and BB will fold) If all UTG, MP and CO limp - VPIP 26%, PRF 23% (If only one or two of them are in then I'll open wider) If someone raises from earlier position - VPIP 17%, 3bet 8% If facing a raise and 3 bet - VPIP 7%, 4bet 3% Does that seem more reasonable? I think my nature is to play tight, so trying to not give into that too much
 02-21-2019, 03:06 PM #6 ArtyMcFly Carpal \'Tunnel     Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Enchantment Under the Sea Posts: 11,937 Re: Constructing Ranges Yeah, that sounds more reasonable. You can cold-call up to about 10% if someone raises in front of you (although I typically call tighter than that) and 3-betting 6 or 7% works pretty well in the micros.
 02-22-2019, 02:31 PM #7 kvnd old hand   Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: 10nl ACR Posts: 1,245 Re: Constructing Ranges Your 3bet range on the BTN should vary extremely according to who opened. If it's a CO open with a 57% fold to 3 bet I'll 3 bet 10% of hands. If it's an utg open I might only do like 4%. If it's a guy who rarely folds to 3bet and has a loose VPIP I'll 3 bet the top 7% of my range with no bluffs All approximate
 03-21-2019, 10:55 AM #8 WNP8888 newbie   Join Date: Feb 2019 Posts: 22 Re: Constructing Ranges I've been looking more at my ranges (the standard set I use, which I then adjust based on reads on players). For the Button position, I currently have that I'd 3 bet a raise with the top 8% of my range, and call with the next 8.9%. Facing a 3 bet, I'd 4 bet with the top 2.9% of my range and call with the next 4.2%. The question is, am I calling too often? I ask because my HUD suggests I'm playing around 29% of hands which seems a bit high. If I am calling too much with those stats, am I better off reducing the call % by folding more, or pushing more of those hands into my 3 bet range, or (As I'm guessing) a mix of the two? I only limp 3.9% of hands currently from the button and raise 21.9% if that makes any difference. Thanks guys
 03-21-2019, 12:57 PM #9 ArtyMcFly Carpal \'Tunnel     Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Enchantment Under the Sea Posts: 11,937 Re: Constructing Ranges A VPIP of 29% on the BTN is fine for soft games, but a little high in tight games, unless the majority of the VPIPing comes from RFI steals. I'm only cold-calling 7% on the BTN, (3-betting 5%) and my VPIP is 25.5% in that position. (My RFI when folded to me is 40%). You can either move some of your cold-calls into your 3-betting or folding ranges. It doesn't make a great deal of difference. All the hands at the bottom of your range (stuff like 98s, 54s) should be close to breakeven as calls or 3-bets, so folding is fine too. Don't cold-call 55-22 unless your tracker shows it's definitely profitable to set mine. EDIT: If I run the "Cold-call" filter on my database, I get the following for the BTN position. I've called pre with these hands at least once, but it is NOT my default range. Notice how the further away the hands are from the top left, the more likely they are to lose. Due to that phenomenon, I stopped calling with the weaker hands on that chart, and most of my cold calls are with suited Broadways and middle pocket pairs. Last edited by ArtyMcFly; 03-21-2019 at 01:03 PM.
 03-21-2019, 01:29 PM #10 WNP8888 newbie   Join Date: Feb 2019 Posts: 22 Re: Constructing Ranges Sorry, I meant my overall average VPIP for all 6 positions is 29%, so definitely too high, and needs to be tightened up, especially given my PFR is only18-19%. I don't have stats on individual positions unfortunately. It's very interesting to see your charts, what tracker do you use? I've only recently started playing so I'm just using a very basic free one for now. It's better than nothing, but doesn't give anything anywhere near as useful as what you posted below. I'll have another look at my range and use yours as a rough guide to see what hands I should potentially be letting go more often. Maybe pushing the top of those calling ranges into my 3 bet range, and drop the bottom of it out into the fold category.
03-22-2019, 09:50 AM   #11
LoveUknow
enthusiast

Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 61
Re: Constructing Ranges

Quote:
 Originally Posted by WNP8888 Sorry, I meant my overall average VPIP for all 6 positions is 29%, so definitely too high, and needs to be tightened up, especially given my PFR is only18-19%. I don't have stats on individual positions unfortunately. It's very interesting to see your charts, what tracker do you use? I've only recently started playing so I'm just using a very basic free one for now. It's better than nothing, but doesn't give anything anywhere near as useful as what you posted below. I'll have another look at my range and use yours as a rough guide to see what hands I should potentially be letting go more often. Maybe pushing the top of those calling ranges into my 3 bet range, and drop the bottom of it out into the fold category.
Check out snowie preflop advisor and use them as a default.
Then you can make slight adjustments.
Pay attention to details. QT, KT are in my mind, these might suprise you.
Donīt overvalue suited connectors and small pockets.

On the BTN I personally prefer opening 50-60% but I open with 2.2x.
SB Iīd tighten up a bit more because you play OOP.

Generally try to either 3B or fold when entering a pot. Donīt cold call too much.

Be positionally aware. 3B A3s from BTN vs CO is totally fine, if you 3B A3s from SB vs UTG/MP you are burning money.

03-22-2019, 09:54 AM   #12
LoveUknow
enthusiast

Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 61
Re: Constructing Ranges

Quote:
 Originally Posted by LoveUknow Check out snowie preflop advisor and use them as a default. Then you can make slight adjustments. Pay attention to details. QT, KT are in my mind, these might suprise you. Donīt overvalue suited connectors and small pockets. On the BTN I personally prefer opening 50-60% but I open with 2.2x. SB Iīd tighten up a bit more because you play OOP. Generally try to either 3B or fold when entering a pot. Donīt cold call too much. Be positionally aware. 3B A3s from BTN vs CO is totally fine, if you 3B A3s from SB vs UTG/MP you are burning money.
Play tight vs 3B in very low stakes. People usually have an extremely strong 3B range and wonīt exploit you for overfolding. So tighten up your 3B calling range.

03-22-2019, 03:24 PM   #13
ArtyMcFly
Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Enchantment Under the Sea
Posts: 11,937
Re: Constructing Ranges

Quote:
 Originally Posted by WNP8888 It's very interesting to see your charts, what tracker do you use?
HEM.
And, yes 29% VPIP overall is too high, assuming you're playing micro 6-max (with 5 opponents on the table at all times). If a fair bit of your play is 4- or 5-handed, then 29% might be acceptable.

 Thread Tools Display Modes Linear Mode

 Posting Rules You may not post new threads You may not post replies You may not post attachments You may not edit your posts BB code is On Smilies are On [IMG] code is On HTML code is Off Forum Rules
 Forum Jump User Control Panel Private Messages Subscriptions Who's Online Search Forums Forums Home Links to Popular Forums     News, Views, and Gossip     Beginners Questions     Marketplace & Staking     Casino & Cardroom Poker     Internet Poker     NL Strategy Forums     Poker Goals & Challenges     Las Vegas Lifestyle     Sporting Events     Other Other Topics Two Plus Two     About the Forums     Two Plus Two Magazine Forum     The Best of Two Plus Two Marketplace & Staking     Commercial Marketplace     General Marketplace     Staking - Offering Stakes     Staking         Staking - Offering Stakes         Staking - Seeking Stakes         Staking - Selling Shares - Online         Staking - Selling Shares - Live         Staking Rails         Transaction Feedback & Disputes     Transaction Feedback & Disputes Coaching & Training     Coaching Advice     Cash Game Poker Coach Listings     Tournament/SNG Poker Coach Listings Poker News & Discussion     News, Views, and Gossip     Poker Goals & Challenges     Poker Beats, Brags, and Variance     That's What She Said!     Poker Legislation & PPA Discussion hosted by Rich Muny     Twitch - Watch and Discuss Live Online Poker     Televised Poker General Poker Strategy     Beginners Questions     Books and Publications     Poker Tells/Behavior, hosted by: Zachary Elwood     Poker Theory     Psychology No Limit Hold'em Strategy     Medium-High Stakes PL/NL     Micro-Small Stakes PL/NL     Medium-High Stakes Full Ring     Micro-Small Stakes Full Ring     Heads Up NL     Live Low-stakes NL Limit Texas Hold'em Strategy     Mid-High Stakes Limit     Micro-Small Stakes Limit Tournament Poker Strategy     STT Strategy     Heads Up SNG and Spin and Gos     Mid-High Stakes MTT     Small Stakes MTT     MTT Community     Tournament Events Other Poker Strategy     High Stakes PL Omaha     Small Stakes PL Omaha     Omaha/8     Stud     Draw and Other Poker Live Poker     Casino & Cardroom Poker         Venues & Communities         Regional Communities     Venues & Communities     Tournament Events         WPT.com     Home Poker     Cash Strategy     Tournament Strategy Internet Poker     Internet Poker         Global Poker         MPN  Microgaming Poker Network         BetOnline.ag Online Poker     Commercial Software     Software         Commercial Software         Free Software General Gambling     Backgammon Forum hosted by Bill Robertie.     Probability     Sports Betting     Other Gambling Games 2+2 Communities     Other Other Topics         OOTV         Game of Thrones     The Lounge: Discussion+Review     EDF     Las Vegas Lifestyle     BBV4Life         omg omg omg     House of Blogs Sports and Games     Sporting Events         Single-Team Season Threads         Fantasy Sports     Fantasy Sports         Sporting Events     Wrestling     Golf     Chess and Other Board Games     Video Games         League of Legends         Hearthstone     Puzzles and Other Games Other Topics     Politics and Society     Playground: Well Named Loves Social Science     History     Business, Finance, and Investing     Science, Math, and Philosophy     Religion, God, and Theology     Travel     Health and Fitness     Laughs or Links!     Computer Technical Help     Programming

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:53 AM.

 Contact Us - Two Plus Two Publishing LLC - Privacy Statement - Top