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04-05-2018 , 11:14 PM
Can I get some advice for this hand please, in as such would any players find any folds at any point during this hand. I'll start with why I called his agression, I 3 bet him pre-flop, AQ when it's blind vs blind is a 3 bet all day long for me. He just calls my raise, so at this point I've taken any sort of AA, KK, QQ, JJ out of his range here, And I am looking at some Ax suited hands, KQ, KJs etc etc.

Now of course the obvious thing here is he has a 10 the way he is betting, but I can't find many 10s that are calling my 3 bet pre flop apart from maybe A10s, so when I find out his actual hand I was gobsmacked, and yes I got lucky, but definately one to review and talk over if not to help myself in future situations.
Any input appreciated.

https://www.jivaro.com/profile/deank...0e0d706e815d0/
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04-06-2018 , 07:18 AM
Blind on blind I think you need to give an unknown opponent credit for a wider range than you have described. Your mostly be correct in removing premium pps when villain doesn't 4bet pre. Villain can definitely have more 10x hands than A10 but I'm never folding TPTK on this flop on the basis that villain has a 10. Just don't try to gii otf in this spot.
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04-06-2018 , 07:46 AM
What was the turn bet meant to achieve?
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04-06-2018 , 07:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelvis
What was the turn bet meant to achieve?
Well one of the reasons I signed up was for advice on how to get better hence why I posted the hand. In answer to your question I am guessing I am ahead with TPTK on the turn and I am betting for value, of course all this was before I knew he had a big pocket pair.
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04-06-2018 , 08:09 AM
On QTT a hand like KQ or QJ isn't going to raise and if he was bluffing then he can't call anyways so no point in betting. Only if he has a straight draw is he maybe going to call, but other than that you're just going to get money in against better hands.
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04-06-2018 , 08:21 AM
His point is your hand is face up once you bet again as having at least a Q since you’re unlikely betting again without at least that. So if he knows you have a Q what hands is he continuing and or check raising with?
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04-06-2018 , 11:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deankenny
Can I get some advice for this hand please
I think villain should be the one asking for advice, as he totally butchered his kings. I expected him to show up with TT or T9s+.
I prefer checking back the turn, because villain can't call with much (so a "value-bet" doesn't make much sense), but he'll be 'forced' to bluff rivers and you can snap call without ever getting stacked. (AQ is some distance from the nuts on QTTx, so you don't necessarily want to play for stacks on the turn, especially since villain check-raised the flop).

As others have mentioned, villain's pre-flop calling range should be a lot wider than you suggested. Even in nitring games he should be calling the 3-bet with most pairs and suited connectors, especially given the cheap price. You might want to make your 3-bets a little bigger, both for value when you have a legit hand and to increase fold equity and narrow his range, so it's easier to put him on a hand.
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04-06-2018 , 12:45 PM
I'd check the flop against most opponents, since betting will fold out most hands you beat. On this kind of board the last thing you want to do is bloat the pot. If you bet the flop and get called, you check it back OTT.

As played, check the turn and call any reasonable sized bet. If checked to OTR you probably want to bet something, but on that board you hate to be check raised.
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04-06-2018 , 02:30 PM
I see thanks guys, the reason I bet is beacause I am basing most my play on blackrain79. One of the thing he stresses throughout his guides is to "always" make a bet when you have a hand on all streets, because fish are calling stations and will call you down with most things even middle or even bottom pair.

Here is a snippet from one of the many times he quotes to do exactly this.


Last edited by deankenny; 04-06-2018 at 02:45 PM.
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04-06-2018 , 03:20 PM
OP - note the first sentence of BlackRain's quote.

You do not have a "big hand". You have a decent but vulnerable hand. Don't get caught up in thinking top pair is a great hand.

He's more referring to people who slowplay flopped sets, straights and flushes.
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04-06-2018 , 04:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurn, son of Mogh
OP - note the first sentence of BlackRain's quote.

You do not have a "big hand". You have a decent but vulnerable hand. Don't get caught up in thinking top pair is a great hand.

He's more referring to people who slowplay flopped sets, straights and flushes.
True, it's just I couldn't put many 10s in his range with the 3 bet etc, and of course he had Kings, which I highly didn't expect.
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04-07-2018 , 07:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deankenny
I see thanks guys, the reason I bet is beacause I am basing most my play on blackrain79. One of the thing he stresses throughout his guides is to "always" make a bet when you have a hand on all streets, because fish are calling stations and will call you down with most things even middle or even bottom pair.

Here is a snippet from one of the many times he quotes to do exactly this.

Blackrain79s advice is worthwhile but he isn't advocating that you always bet when you have a seemingly strong hand without consideration for other factors. You have to consider the flop texture and villain's range when betting for value. An ace high flush can be a weak hand on some boards. You can be entirely justified in betting 3rd pair for value hu otr in certain spots. The point is that we can't just look at our own hand and bet on the basis of how high up it is in the hand rankings.

When making a bet always ask yourself what better hands in villain's range could fold and what worse hands could call. Simple maxim that will save you a lot in the long run.
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04-07-2018 , 07:11 AM
Yep, the concept of a big hand is relative. Unimproved aces on a Q72 rainbow board is big, unimproved aces on a JT9 monotone board isn't. Try to think that if you were to blast it in against an opponent who will come out better with what he's likely to do it with
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04-07-2018 , 07:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sixfour
Yep, the concept of a big hand is relative. Unimproved aces on a Q72 rainbow board is big, unimproved aces on a JT9 monotone board isn't. Try to think that if you were to blast it in against an opponent who will come out better with what he's likely to do it with
Personally I'd call unimproved aces at any flop a medium hand, not big. I'm still betting the flop, of course, and I'll probably call a raise on the flop if it's not too big - but anyone hanging around after the flop when I just have AA and the turn comes out is gonna make me think my AA isn't so big after all. Of course, this all depends on effective stack sizes too...plus all the other usual factors
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04-07-2018 , 07:45 AM
AA in a 3bet pot on Q72r is massive. You're not going to have better hands the vast majority of the time.
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04-07-2018 , 10:15 AM
Sure, agreed.

But it's also still just a pair.
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04-07-2018 , 11:04 AM
Last time I had AA in a 3bet pot, flop was Q64r from memory. Villain had 66.

1-3 live.

Last edited by BroadwaySushy; 04-07-2018 at 11:09 AM.
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