Thoughts?

Reads?

~200 hands into 5nl zoom, so no not really.

Had ~30 hands on villain and he was 29/29

1. Your original pre flop raise wan't nearly big enough.
2. What has you beat pre flop ?
the BTN has a range that is fairly wide.
If you are affaird to jam KK pre flop you are about the most timid player there is.

Your RFI size is fine.

Preflop when villain 3bets you at 185bb effective stack you can flat and play poker...but its 5nl and you will see AK and QQ here, just as often as AA (as well as some random junk from the tards).

So I play it just like you did, and its a cooler if I'm beat. Make a note on villain (this is the most important comment!!!!) and move on.

His RFI is as standard as it gets. BTNs 3bet is a bit on the large side, probably because of the cold caller. If any of the sizings is off, it's hero's 41BB 4bet. That's way too big because it totally gives away the strength of the hand with CO and his 80BB stack behind him. It's not like BTN has a profitable setmining spot if hero makes the 4bet a bit smaller.

Therefore I highly doubt BTN has a "fairly wide" shoving range for 185BB against a 4betting range that's strictly value. Folding shouldn't be an option anyway since he can have AK and sometimes QQ or randomizers and we need only 38% equity but it's not a fist pump snap call.

Calling the 3bet to keep the likely weak player in the CO in the hand, should at least be a consideration.

sorry fatboy I disagree.
The guy 3 bet you and you are out of position.
If the flop does not contain a King you have to fold to almost any aggressive bluff.
Given the actions of the BTN you have to be affaird of any A Q J and Maybe even 10 or 9 on the flop, should he take yet another aggressive action.

My 1/2, 2/5 live world ...
1) Raise UTG to $6? ... too small probably, certainly at 'all' of my tables.
2) Flat and 3-bet from B to $28 ... Seems ok .. It's a raise of $22 into $21 pot. It would seem large to a lot of 1/2 live players who don't look at the pot though, something that is done for you online!!

3) 4-bet to $82 ... This to me is perfect since you can still shove into B IF they flat after a CO shove.
4) B shoves $390 ... I think there are 'probably' enough combos of AKs/QQ in there to make this a call, but I'm not real happy and probably feel like I can stack off in a better spot as well at most 1/2 tables. You only have 20% of your stack invested at this point .. tough to walk away from, but possible (and has only happened 4 times in my life).

Fortunately (maybe unfortunately) I also see enough JJ/TT hands where I play to make this a much easier call ... of course you need to have my image at the time as well!! GL


PS .. I was 'right' all 4 times I've folded KK PF in my life, but one of them is results orientated since V had QQ and spiked a set on the Flop against an all-in player.

I think you can safely assume KK+ and AKs are in villain’s range. If any other combo is included, such as QQ or AKo( eq>38%), calling is +EV. If no other combo (eq=32%), fold.

No hate on live players, but bet sizing live and online are two very different things for various reasons. OP posted a hand he played online and I think advice on how much you would raise in a live game is more confusing than helpful.

Personally I still would have jammed in response to his 3 bet.
IF you give him AA, KK, QQ, JJ, AKs AQs the pocket KK is STILL 61% probable to win.
Good players get their money in good when they can. If you are a probable favorite you should be firing big period.

I thought that 4bet shoving would probably fold out JJ, maybe QQ and AKs/AQs. But I guess the raise screams strength, and probably does the same. Will keep this in mind. Thanks for your insight!

@smittos and what did he show ?
I put him on QQ JJ or AKs maybe maybe AA

He unfortunately rolled over rockets

Why are you implying that AA is unlikely? He put in almost 200BB against an UTG open and 4-bet.

Shoving over the 3-bet is very bad. You are narrowing his already tight range so much that you're rarely getting it in good. It might be somewhat defensible 100BB deep or with AA (still seems pretty bad to me), but not here.

Standard cooler.

Wow Really ?
If you put him on JJ QQ KK AA you are still 60% probable.
How are you rarely getting it in good pre flop with KK....PLEASE !!
It was a cooler it happens.

Villain is not forced to call off your 185BB shove having invested only 15BB. He’s allowed to, and likely will fold some of the hands like JJ and QQ that we’re a big favorite against. We are not 60% against the range of hands he calls a massive 4-bet shove with.

200bb preflop stack-off is rarely less than KK in low limit zoom. Without a history of 4/5/6 betting dynamic, i would just flat rather than iso-ing myself vs KK+ range.

Randos don't even 3bet QQ, let alone stacking-off 200bb preflop.

I don't think anyone who has played a hand of micro stakes on Stars over the last couple of years would think that JJ is in villains range unless he's a total maniac. That's just not happening.

Hero's hand is so obviously nutted when he 4bets to 41BB, committing himself to call off against COs 80BB stack..

Maybe you are right ? I never ever play anything but live 1/2 and once in a while 2/5.
Remind me to NEVER play micros.
When I start folding things like QQ because ONE GUY shoved on me it's time to take up polo.
I don't see any logic in a 4 bet in the situation mentioned. IMO its either call the 3 bet and look at the flop or shove its that simple.

When 4 bets it is a oh no he probably has aa but I have to call

Obviously he had aces why did I call

Cooler you were alwaysgoing broke pre or even on the flop if no ace drops.

Only thing is AK combo's are reduced down, so were often looking at QQ+

Its 5NL 4bet bigger pre , Call of Jam, 1 in 22 times you get KK, someone will have AA

It happens

just realised that you were 180bb deep, imo and only imo at 5nlz anyway this is nearly ALWAYS aces this deep,

Think about it, did you feel good calling the shove ? when he jammed did you rub them titties and think pow bb's for the rifle ? or ewwwww he's going to show me Aces, (edits)

if it was the later,

Why do you have to go broke on the flop 180BB deep in a 3bet pot? There's absolutely no need to do that.