you guys misread the action, read it again.

can we have another one please?

to comment on later

Bumping this thread to pose a question. OP makes gives some excellent advice about how to use hand ranges, but what about putting that range together in the first place? If I have never put together a hand range myself before how do you recommend starting to do that kind of analysis?

Should we basically look at the pokerstove percentages and match that up with villain's VPIP, presuming of course that we have a decent sample? Do we spend hours and hours looking through PT stats to see what people actually tend to bet with? Do we just comb these boards for estimates from others?

Finally, is it even really possible to do this even semi-accurately if I've only played a few 1000 hands. Should I even begin to add this level of thought to my play before I hit 10,000? Or 20,000?

I really want to start being able to Pokerstove but feel very ill suited to putting a range together. I imagine I could cause myself no end of hurt if the ranges I plug in are completely off which will lead naturally to poor decisionmaking.

Thanks so much WC for this series, I hope one day to be in a position to dole out advice myself!

Arouet good post I am looking for the same sort of adivce!
BTW great call WC!

great thread wcgrider. i just read this last night, and if it wasn't for this thread i probably wouldn't of called a bet on this hand:



Full Tilt Poker $10.00 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

UTG: $10.83
Hero (MP): $10.00
CO: $6.84
BTN: $10.00
SB: $24.93
BB: $10.20

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is MP with A K
1 fold, Hero raises to $0.35, CO calls $0.35, 2 folds, BB calls $0.25

Flop: ($1.10) 4 J T (3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $0.70, CO folds, BB calls $0.70

Turn: ($2.50) 5 (2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks

River: ($2.50) 2 (2 players)
BB bets $1.60, Hero calls $1.60

Final Pot: $5.70
Hero shows A K
BB shows 9 8
Hero wins $5.32
(Rake: $0.38)

yea i know its cheezeburgers stakes, but i thought it was a cool hand for me, i probably woulda folded (like i always do if i dont get there) if i hadn't read this thread last night. pretty cool what a little bit of thinking and thought process can get you.

Doug your second hand example is pretty crazy. Brilliant read on that guy...

Btw, I have been reading your threads past couple days and taking notes. So, thank you very much for doing this and hopefully it will help my game. (Unfortunately, I'm currently a losing player).

However, I started to correct some of my mistakes and my stats are getting better (my VP and PR are very close to each other and below 20.. Mostly around 15)

I'm hoping that in a month or so I will become a winning player.

What does 85/12/.2 mean when describing players?

Wow great post! Thanks!

Opened my mind a little bit more about Hand Reading and I like Rider Therom.
Since i play $25 and $50NL only, i can clearly see how it applys now.

2008 20/17 = tag
2013 20/17 = maniac fish

Join date mar 2010 =

good play ahah cool brags

what does the u mean in "uNL"???????????????

It's supposed to represent the Greek letter mu, which in science is often used to mean "micro".