Quote:
Originally Posted by moop!
The thing is with jacks on an ace high board (something like A49 with no flush draw), its unlikely you'll get called by anything less then an ace, and even if someone has a worse hand that can call you it's unlikely that they'll call 3 streets, so checking back the flop is a great way to keep the pot smaller and you can get value from a smaller pair on the turn / river but avoid the situation where you bet the flop, bet the turn and then have to fold to a large river bet. Its usually apparent that if someone checks to you twice they don't have an ace and then you can bet to get value out of their lower pairs, but a flop check might be someone with a strong hand letting you cbet with the intent of raising or leading the turn.
You should notice that the op says when you have some limited showdown value you shouldn't cbet, and this is the case here. Note that if you had air on this flop then cbetting might be good as you will fold out some small pocket pairs and some better no pair hands etc (note that when you cbet on an Ace or king high board people will be likely to give you credit for an ace or king as you raised preflop, which is why you cbet these boards), but with the jacks the only hands you rate to fold out would be hands worse then yours.
On the contrary, it's not the case here. In the vast majority of cases, you shouldn't be primarily guided by SDV considerations in c-bet situations, because it's a long way to showdown with two more streets to come, where equities can change dramatically or you could be pushed off your hand easily.
When you are a preflop raiser with JJ and flop comes Axx rainbow, c-betting is better than not c-betting. If you check and villain doesn't have an ace, there is a big likelihood that another overcard will come on the turn and pair his hand. There are just too many overcards for the JJ, so slowplaying it on A-hi flops, where you think villain does not have an ace, does not guarantee you will still have the best hand on the turn and that you would be making any value instead of valuetowning yourself. You are not going to make several streets of value with JJ on an A-hi board anyway, and the flop may actually be the best street to bet in most situations.
Now, it's completely different with KK. With KK, I like to check A hi flops, because turn card will rarely change the situation, and if we are ahead, we are more likely get value from worse hands by checking the flop and betting turn, rather than c-betting flop