Hey guys, I started playing from march due to a mate getting me into it; since then he's given me a few pointers and I've been reading a few articles here and there.

I've obviously been playing at NL.02/.04 and I'm starting to get into .05/.10 with the hopes of fully switching up as soon as I get $200 in my bankroll.
I've posted up my stats in case there are any obvious leaks that anyone can pick up on.

Thanks a lot in advance.

Hi all, would appreciate some feedback on my first 30k hands. thanks in advance.

Dickensm: these are solid, but quite nitty, stats. It looks like you are playing a good TAG style. I'd say you could start experimenting opening up preflop a bit more, especially in late position (cutoff and button).
For the rest there really isn;t much to remark on these figures as far as I can see.

thedoctor: OK figures, but it looks to me like you are playing a bit too weak tight postflop: you are betting less than 30%, so basically just when you hit a flop, and check/fold a lot of the rest. This will work well against calling stations who pay off your made hands, but you will need to become more aggressive postflop to beat stronger opponents.
Maybe start looking for good spots to bluff/semi-bluff,fire multiple c-bet barrels. This is easy to overdo, so be careful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fabadam View Post
UtherLigthBringer:
This is really odd. How can you have played ~3700 hands in ech position but only 1850 in the cutoff? Are you sure you're not switching UTG and CO here?
Your numbers are also way off. Basically they should get higher as you get nearer to the button. So 26/20 UTG is definitely way too loose. It looks reasonable though if we swap UTG and CO ...
Also, limping 37% in the SB is really loose, even if you are getting 8 to 1 because it's a family limpfest. I'll also assume the 16% PFR in the SB is mostly stealing blind vs blind?

BTW, you can't say "stats should be so and so" for a good player, just some tendencies (PFR close to VPIP, looser near the button, etc.) are almost universal for good players (and also achieved by some fairly bad players).

FABADAM:

Thanks for the tips. And you, at which stakes do you play?

And i'd like to know something bout your stats (stats of a good player), so i can fix my target for the future.
TY

I am not that good a player. I think I have a good grasp of the basic mathematics involved (I am a mathematician), but am not always that good at applying, since I have a tendency to become over-aggressive and bluffy, which is a rather subtle form of tilt.
I have played up to NL200, but played mostly NL100 for a long time.

Currently I am playing NL25 because, even though I am quite loose aggressive at the table, I am a huge bankroll nit (I will not play at a level with less than 40 buy-ins), and I like cashing out profits every now and then too.
I am a recreational player, so all poker profit is just great, since there aren't many hobbies that don't cost any money at all, but rather show a profit.

I do have to say that, especially at Stars and FullTilt, NL25 these days is probably about as tough as NL100 was 2 years ago. The players are generally more weak-tight but there are very few really big fish now.

As for my general stats, I still maintain that you should NOT work with targets.

My general style at NL25 now is that my preflop VPIP/PFR is about 25/21, but there are times I play 20/16 or 30/25 too because of table conditions.
I 3-bet about 8%, mostly out of the blinds vs habitual stealers.

Postflop, my AF is (I think) something like 4.5/3.5/2.8 by street.
I also c-bet a ridiculous amount (70% or so), because people just keep folding. I have recently been experimenting with checking behind a bit more, also with made hands -- I am trying to balance my play even if maybe it makes no sense at this level.
However, all my play is highly villain-dependent (at least, when I am on my A game) because I play a maximum of 4 tables so I don't really auto-pilot like the 12 tablers+ do.

Main leaks of my self I have to keep working on:
(1) If a NL25 nit regular raises the flop, fold top pair. With an overpair, at least learn to fold the turn.
(2) Don't be in a hurry to bust a maniac. If he dumps all his money to someone else at the table, so be it (this is my biggest tilt problem -- I get way too loose against real maniacs, going into a lot of weird coinflippy situations rather than wait for a big hand).
(3) When you start to feel tilted, quit (see 2).

Ehy Fabadam,

it seems you're going well.

I usually play on FullTilt and it seems that there are good players even at the micro stakes (5NL). I've played a lot on just 2 tables fullstack, but i've seen that pros play regularly on 8-12+ tables. So i've decided to take a shot playing on 4tables. I've had just 8k hands, but it seems i'm running good.

I'm trying to play with a methodycal style, but not on autopilot. I take my time and i take my decision. Like you, i love to play with a bankroll larger than most pros think could be enough. I play 5NL on 4 tables with 400$ behind, so i can take my risks without handshaking on my mouse

Just 8k hands on 4tables, but here there are:
VPIP 22 PFR 16 AF 4.60
WTSD 29 W$WSD 71.5
AF 39 FSB 88 FBB 88
BB/100 3.75

Stats of 4tables tighter than stats of 2tables. I can make a better selection of starting hands because i'm always busy with a hand. So i can can concentrate better on playing my best poker.

I'd be happy If u would give me some other tips on 4tabling.
TY.

ULB: W$WSD of 71.5%, with WTSD of 29% (quite high)??? How in the name of the lord do you manage that? I can't get it above 50% even when I'm running as hot as the sun (that is, on sessions where my winrate is > 20 bb/100).
Ok, it's only 8k hands, but still.
Honestly, when you win that much at showdown, I think it is actually TOO HIGH! Normally. I'd say you are folding too many winners, but a WTSD of 29% is quite high (real nits are always below 25%).

So my guess is that your river betting/raising for value is not high enough: I guess (just on the basis of these stats), that you are calling/checking a lot of winners on the river. You win these showdowns, but by value-betting the river with these hands you would win more because
(1) they fold to your bet, causing your W$WSD (blue line) to go down, but your W$/wo/SD (red line) to go up. This is probably one of the reasons my red line is always positive: I value bet hard on the river, maybe even too hard.
In this case you win as much as when checking/calling, but without the risk of losing the showdown --> they will sometimes fold a winner.
(2) they call your bet, you have the best hand and you win more money then you would have if just checking/calling.

Of course, there is a downside:
(1) They call and have you beat, either because
(a) they have the top of their range : tough luck.
(b) you are value betting too light, and the top of their range is actually very large.

Learning to differentiate between (a) and (b) is not so easy. It's called playing poker. On the river, the bets are the biggest in NL/PL, and the consequences of your decisions are large. When on my A-game, I can do it very well at the micro levels by now, but it's easy to go over the edge and spew as I have found many times by now ....

But still, if you are better than the opposition, there is a lot money to be made on the river, and your stats indicate you are dropping a lot of money on the ground.

One further remark about your own multi-tabling: I don't think I play any tighter 4-tabling than 2-tabling. To me, it indicates you aren't actually ready to play that many tables.
Occasionally, I will actually be playing a hand at each of my 4 tables. That is, I raise/call preflop on 4 tables at once. I admit that I will fold marginal hands like QTo in the cutoff if I've just raised AKo on table 1, KK on table 2 and 55 on table 3. But if that 4th hand is QJs, I'm still raising it. Or if the the button and blinds are huge nits, I'll raise 75s because they're probably folding anyhow.

I don't know by how much your VPIP drops when you go to 4 tables rather than 2, but if it's significant (more than 5%), you shpuld think for yourself whether you really want this.
There is nothing wrong with it, but it does mean you are stressing your own capabilities to the limit. Maybe you want to do that -- that's fine.
I don't want to do that: playing poker over that many tables feels like work, and I play poker as a hobby.

NB: Just for kicks, I have tried a few times to 20-table $1.10 turbo DONs on Stars. Even though my ROI is positive, I don't think I managed a single of these sessions without timing out on at least one of my tables. I really don't know how the 50-tablers do it. DONs are pretty mcuh the easiest poker format around, but having to make a decision (even a simple one) every 2 seconds for 45 minutes straight is just not easy.

FABADAM:

Sorry mate, wrong line of stats. They were another limit (1c/2c with 0.60CAP), just 8k hands.

My real stats over 20k hands 2c/5c (5NL) are 8.000 2tables + 12000 4tables:

VPIP 28 PFR 16 AF 3.05 ( AF preflop 1.15, AF flop 2.97, AF turn 3.52, AF river 2.65 )
WTSD 24 W$WSD 51 W$WSF 44
ASB 33 FSB 65 FBB 80
CBET 77 3bet 4.30
BB/100 7.60

I've played poker at my beginnings just for fun, but seeing on tv doyle, daniel, eli, phil i. and seeing online tom, ziggy, patrick, brian i've understood i can play poker like a work. So i've started studying poker reading books like Super System 1 + 2, Little Green Book, Theory of Poker, Harrington.

And my goal is to achieve a level of play, my A-game, that with the increase of my bankroll can allow me to make a living with poker. So that's a brain training. I'm playing 4tables like most pros does.
Now i'm playin 5NL, but soon i hope i can play 10NL... and when i'll play NL100-NL200 i think i can make a living with poker (even with a small edge on my opponents, but playing 2k-3k hands per day)

Now i can play a very small number of hands per day (bout 500-600). I'm very busy at the university. But i want to increase my skills (and of course my bankroll!! ) and i continue reading books bout poker.

But i dont play just for money. If i've got extra time, i like to play for fun 7-game on FT 5c/10c. I've a good knowing of the basic play of each game and i try to have fun, even when i'm tired, for 45minutes/1hour. Most of the times i reach the break even without a good income.

I'm not a very skilled player, sometimes i make some donk mistakes but i'm trying to learn the game and i'm working on my stats. But at 5NL people plays in a very very strange way. So i've to adapt my game to the table. Often it happens that there's a limp fest and i'm on the Cutoff with 78s (shouldnt i call ??) and my VPIP goes high. But i want to take chanches to win a big pot with a cheap flop.

So... Here there was my goal.. becoming a pro, and i'm working to reach my target.
It seems you have a wider experience than mine. Probably you know some players that play professionally. How they turned from amateurs to pros? Can u give me any tip to reach my goal?

TY a lot for the help. I love 2+2. Talking with friends bout the game it's the right way to become a better player.

P.s. If u need some tips bout the game of Soccer i'd be glad to help you. I'm a semiprofessional player.

Hey, these are my stats at 10nl for the month of april, I've been working on my game to fill some leaks and was wondering if you guys could help point out where I could work. I changed my game up a little at about hand 9000 or so which explains the change in the red line (this is probably costing my blue line, but not sure if its costing my overall value).

I think I have some pretty serious postflop leaks and I'm probably pretty weak from the blinds, but I'm just looking for some confirmation if this is where I should be looking to work.



Uploaded with ImageShack.us



Uploaded with ImageShack.us



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

T.Durden: 19.6/18 is a good TAG preflop stat, with the PFR very close to VPIP -- I 'd even go as far as say that you could probably coldcall/limp-along a bit more though it doesn't matter much now. Position awareness is excellent, no problems there.
I think you could possibly be a bit more aggressive on turn and river, but I may be wrong there: unless you have specific reasons to call so much I'd say your overall AF is too low on turn and river, though not a lot. Still overall results in the 2nd half are very good.

FABADAM:

Sorry mate, wrong line of stats. They were another limit (1c/2c with 0.60CAP), just 8k hands.

My real stats over 20k hands 2c/5c (5NL) are 8.000 2tables + 12000 4tables:

VPIP 28 PFR 16 AF 3.05 ( AF preflop 1.15, AF flop 2.97, AF turn 3.52, AF river 2.65 )
WTSD 24 W$WSD 51 W$WSF 44
ASB 33 FSB 65 FBB 80
CBET 77 3bet 4.30
BB/100 7.60

I've played poker at my beginnings just for fun, but seeing on tv doyle, daniel, eli, phil i. and seeing online tom, ziggy, patrick, brian i've understood i can play poker like a work. So i've started studying poker reading books like Super System 1 + 2, Little Green Book, Theory of Poker, Harrington.

And my goal is to achieve a level of play, my A-game, that with the increase of my bankroll can allow me to make a living with poker. So that's a brain training. I'm playing 4tables like most pros does.
Now i'm playin 5NL, but soon i hope i can play 10NL... and when i'll play NL100-NL200 i think i can make a living with poker (even with a small edge on my opponents, but playing 2k-3k hands per day)

Now i can play a very small number of hands per day (bout 500-600). I'm very busy at the university. But i want to increase my skills (and of course my bankroll!! ) and i continue reading books bout poker.

But i dont play just for money. If i've got extra time, i like to play for fun 7-game on FT 5c/10c. I've a good knowing of the basic play of each game and i try to have fun, even when i'm tired, for 45minutes/1hour. Most of the times i reach the break even without a good income.

I'm not a very skilled player, sometimes i make some donk mistakes but i'm trying to learn the game and i'm working on my stats. But at 5NL people plays in a very very strange way. So i've to adapt my game to the table. Often it happens that there's a limp fest and i'm on the Cutoff with 78s (shouldnt i call ??) and my VPIP goes high. But i want to take chanches to win a big pot with a cheap flop.

So... Here there was my goal.. becoming a pro, and i'm working to reach my target.
It seems you have a wider experience than mine. Probably you know some players that play professionally. How they turned from amateurs to pros? Can u give me any tip to reach my goal?

TY a lot for the help. I love 2+2. Talking with friends bout the game it's the right way to become a better player.

P.s. If u need some tips bout the game of Soccer i'd be glad to help you. I'm a semiprofessional player.

ULB: On those stats, your PFR is too low compared to your VPIP. Or rather, it looks like your VPIP is too high. Start folding more weakish hands rather than limping them. Also, you are defending the SB way too often -- it's the worst seat in the house so don't be too eager with it.
Postflop fiures look OK. It's a bit weird that your Turn AF is higher than your flop AF, they usually get lower on later streets.
You don't show your preflop stats by position, but basically your UTG VPIP/PFR should be less than half of your button VPIP/PFR.

Thanks, I was completely overlooking my turn and river AF, I'm gonna go back in my database and check why they are so low. My guess is that I'm check/calling too often on the turn instead of barreling or check/folding when I'm clearly behind. I think if I can fix that I will see a pretty significant effect on my game. After testing this out some I might post updated stats if I still feel I am having problems.

Thanks again.

Hi everyone. I really hope someone can give me some insight as to why my game is off. I am only running at 2bb/100 at 2nl which I know from reading the forum is pretty pathetic. Any advice anyone can offer is greatly appreciated.

ecfchamps: It looks like you are a set-mining nit. Your red line tells it all.
You are playing super tight preflop, which means you will nearly always have the best hand on the flop. Yet you only bet 22% of the time on the flop, and similar on other streets. So you are check/folding a ton when you have the best hand.
Poker is, for a large part of the time, about aggression. With your stats, you should probably be continuation betting 80% of the time, and generally be betting the flop about 50% or so. Your W$WSF% is now <40%, while it should be nearer to 50%.
So learn to bet the best hand. If you raise AQo preflop and the flop comes K63, bet it. Or if they bet into you, raise. The chance of you having the best hand here is 65% or so.

FABADAM:

Ty. These are my stats for position. 3.93 BB/100 11k hands.

SB 2.1k hands +2.05 BB/100, VPIP 41 PFR 18
BB 2.1k hands -41.40 BB/100, VPIP 24 PFR 7
Early 1.1k hands +43 BB/100, VPIP 14 PFR 13
Middle 1.7k hands +19.25 BB/100, VPIP 19 PFR 17
C-O 2k hands +1.38 BB/100, VPIP 23 PFR 20
D 2.1k hands +22.58 BB/100, VPIP 31 PFR 24

What d u think bout? Any evident lake to erase?

ULB: Stats from early/middle CO/button look pretty OK; if anything, you could be looser in CO and button but you should just be doing that if you understand why (the reason is that there are some opponents that you can rob blind by aggression in these positions, but you have to recognize these opponents).
Blind play looks too loose. The only wxcuse to limp that much in the blinds is that you can constantly limp your SB into 4-way pots cheap (which is OK). I can't think of a good reason to limp so much in the BB. Play the SB and BB as tight as you play the UTG position.

Still, there won't come any leaks out of this analysis. Rather, keep note of hands that gave you problems during play, and post these in the micro-stakes NL forum. Also, read other people's posts and comment on them.
The good stats have to be the result of correct play on every hand, not the other way around.

Thank you for your thoughts. I think that my biggest problem is check folding a missed flop. What would you say an optimal raise size would be? Let's say the pot is $0.20 on the flop and they bet pot into me, what should I raise to in the scenario you mentioned?

You mean you raised preflop, and they donkbet pot into you? That happens to me about 1 or 2 times per 1000 hands. I usually fold then, unless I've noticed they are habitual donkbetters, in which case I'll raise to about $0.60 here.

I have mentioned it here before, but I have a special abbreviation in my player notes "MDF". It means "makes minimum donkbets and folds to a raise". The reason I have this abbrev in my notes is that I see it ALL THE TIME.
I'll raise J9o on the button to 3 or 3.5 BB, BB calls. Flop is Q83r, BB bets 1BB. I raise to 6 or 7 BB, he folds. Happens at least 10 or 20 times per 1000 hands I think.

When you miss a flop, remember that the odds are that your opponent missed it too. You raise with AJo, one of the blinds calls (with 76s). Flop is 832 two-tone. Now you are way ahead. Just c-bet between half and 2/3 of pot. They will probably fold about 60-70% of the time, making your bet profitable right there, even if you don't win a single hand he calls with (which you will, because he'll call with 87s, but you may catch a J or A).

Hello boys and girls. I've been working on making a transition from MTT/SNG play to cash games, and have put in my first full month as of today. I'm feeling discouraged that the only additions I've made to my bankroll over the last 5,000 hands have been bonuses and rakeback. I know being a small winner overall is better than breaking even/losing, but I'm making such marginal profits at 2NL that I can't help but worry that I have leaks larger than an oil rig in the Gulf of Mexico

In particular, I'm clueless as to how to improve my red line. I try to select looser tables for the sake of getting premium hands paid off, but cbets and thin value bets with a single pair just seem to blow up in my face. When I don't give the >50/<10 fish credit, they always seem to have it .

I think I meant to add something else, but I don't remember right now. Without further delay: Here's my stats, help me not suck!

Illiterate: frankly, I think your results are not great, but still reasonable. You are winning at nearly 10 bb/100. Your overall stats are reasonable, if slightly on the nitty side. For NL2, and given you're beginning cash games, that's quite OK.
Your preflop stats are OK, though I think you could probably be even looser in late position. Your Bet% is on the lowish side on all streets (<30% means you are just making clear value bets, no semi-bluffing or thinnish value betting at all), and your W$SD is quite high. Your W$WSF is not at all bad though.
So there probably is space for tougher aggression and thinner value betting, by making good reads -- in short, learn to play more poker -- but at this level you're probably always going to have a red line that goes down.

Hello everybody, I would really appreciate if someone can give me some ideas to improve my game from my graphs if u can see any leaks/weak points I am currently running at 3bb/100 at 10nl (8/12 tabling) and thinking of taking a shot on nl25(less tables of course).




Thanks in advance.

chicotaslb: you are playing extremely tight, both preflop and postflop.
Preflop you could open up more in late position, early position play seems solid.
Postflop is a bit weird. Your W$WSF% is quite high, so you pick up a lot of pots postflop, but still you really aren't all that aggressive -- your Agg%'s on flop and later are quite low for someone playing so tight. Also your W$SD is very high, so it looks to me like you are folding a fair share of winners.
I would say you can be much more aggressive postflop, though it might be hard getting good enough reads for that if you play so many tables.

The winning was over after about 25k hands when it starts to go down I thought I did loose my skill or I never had any and all regs have enough stats on me and exploit it. They did not fold anything and that is cruel if you are used to bet, bet, bet.

NL50



Now I do stop crying!
It's time to improve down under NL50(NL20) and get rid of tilt.

Here there are my new stats before starting NL20:

overall position stats



3bet stats minus Premium Hands



3bet calling stats minus Premium Hands



Where the leaks might be, I will will try to find out later.