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October Beginner's Bankroll Thread October Beginner's Bankroll Thread

10-27-2013 , 02:00 AM
I guess I made the right decision by calling. Well, I mean folding would have been the best decision, but what can you do? Fold Ah here considering people at the micros can go crazy with the Qh? My heart sank when I saw that card on the river though. Put him on QJhh, and said to myself "If you've got the straight flush that's just a cooler and NH".

    Pacific, $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

    MP: $15.25 (152.5 bb)
    Hero (CO): $14.59 (145.9 bb)
    BTN: $8.18 (81.8 bb)
    SB: $18.24 (182.4 bb)
    BB: $12.23 (122.3 bb)
    UTG: $8.14 (81.4 bb)

    Preflop: Hero is CO with A K
    2 folds, Hero raises to $0.30, 2 folds, BB calls $0.20

    Flop: ($0.65) 7 K T (2 players)
    BB checks, Hero bets $0.40, BB raises to $1.30, Hero calls $0.90

    Turn: ($3.25) 3 (2 players)
    BB bets $2.10, Hero calls $2.10

    River: ($7.45) 9 (2 players)
    BB bets $3.50, Hero calls $3.50

    Results: $14.45 pot ($0.72 rake)
    Final Board: 7 K T 3 9
    Hero showed A K and lost (-$7.20 net)
    BB showed 8 6 and won $13.73 ($6.53 net)
    10-27-2013 , 03:19 AM
    Shove the river.
    10-27-2013 , 03:27 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by birdayy
    Shove the river.
    +1 ainec

    TDA, don't like the call with trip Jacks to the overbet. Just don't see villains bluffing like that often enough imo
    10-27-2013 , 04:09 AM
    TDA, hand 1: His 3 bet seems oversized. I guess you've got odds to set mine given those stack sizes. If you had fish stats calling 100bb with KK on that board is ok, but the nit should have his "set warning" alarm going like crazy for 190+bb.
    10-27-2013 , 07:50 AM
    Villain tank folded so I guess he had an OP.

    "I played it like a set."



      Poker Stars, $0.08/$0.16 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
      Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

      CO: $16.64 (104 bb)
      BTN: $7.25 (45.3 bb)
      SB: $24.78 (154.9 bb)
      Hero (BB): $23.96 (149.8 bb)
      UTG: $16.67 (104.2 bb)
      MP: $20.17 (126.1 bb) - 18/16/6 H:159

      Preflop: Hero is BB with 5 A
      UTG folds, MP raises to $0.48, 3 folds, Hero calls $0.32

      Flop: ($1.04) 9 3 9 (2 players)
      Hero checks, MP bets $0.64, Hero calls $0.64

      Turn: ($2.32) 5 (2 players)
      Hero checks, MP bets $1.40, Hero calls $1.40

      River: ($5.12) T (2 players)
      Hero checks, MP bets $3, Hero raises to $21.44 and is all-in, MP folds

      Spoiler:
      Results: $11.12 pot ($0.50 rake)
      Final Board: 9 3 9 5 T
      Hero mucked 5 A and won $10.62 ($5.10 net)
      MP mucked and lost (-$5.52 net)

      Last edited by birdayy; 10-27-2013 at 08:16 AM.
      10-27-2013 , 08:18 AM
      Quote:
      Originally Posted by Dunna100
      +1 ainec

      TDA, don't like the call with trip Jacks to the overbet. Just don't see villains bluffing like that often enough imo
      FWIW depending on your PS settings that size can come up for clicking 'pot'. I don't think it's anything like a fold because he can probably do this with worse for value (because he's a fish LDO).
      10-27-2013 , 09:40 AM
      Quote:
      Originally Posted by birdayy
      Villain tank folded so I guess he had an OP.

      "I played it like a set."
      Just so you know I had a look at that range and I basically dunno how to go about splitting it up as it seems to be really villain dependant and I have no idea what's standard in that spot for villain to jam with.

      So sorry.

      I also dunno how much I like jamming. Standard seems to be shove all our chips in the middle, probably is the only way to get a bluff to work against some people. Also I don't really get the flop and turn float tbh.

      @Olly - Take a break mate, seriously. Just take a few days off and chill without thinking about poker. After that up your studying; play a bit less and it'll turn round.
      10-27-2013 , 10:36 AM
        Poker Stars, $0.02/$0.05 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 2 Players
        Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #20235611

        SB: $14.39 (287.8 bb)
        Hero (BB): $5.38 (107.6 bb)

        Preflop: Hero is BB with A 2
        SB raises to $0.15, Hero raises to $0.50, SB calls $0.35

        Flop: ($1) 2 5 6 (2 players)
        Hero bets $0.70, SB calls $0.70

        Turn: ($2.40) J (2 players)
        Hero checks, SB bets $1.50, Hero calls $1.50

        River: ($5.40) 4 (2 players)
        Hero checks, SB bets $2.70, Hero calls $2.68




        Get the Flash Player to use the Hold'em Manager Replayer.


        Coz blockers, kinda. Ott I used up all my regular time and almost went into the time bank before checking (I was considering shoving or b/c'ing during the hand), and he SNAP bet. I doubt value hands do that considering I tanked so long ott. River is trivial, V had K7hh
        10-27-2013 , 10:42 AM
        Because blockers? What do you block? An A high flush draw.

        Shoving turn would be really bad, if you ever do shove the turn if you hit an A high flush you are missing out on so much value. You need to think about board textures. I agreed previously with you about going for as much value as we possibly can, but say you had Ac9c that board has so much that people will call normal size bets with yet very little that people will call a shove with.

        If someone has 100 combos of hands and will call a bet with 50 of them and a shove with 2 of them unless we are super deep obviously the first is a better option.
        10-27-2013 , 10:42 AM
        Quote:
        Originally Posted by birdayy
        Shove the river.
        I would have shoved if the river was a 2 or something. The 9h just seemed like such a gross card, since I think a huge part of his range is QJhh, as he was playing rather tag-ish it seemed. The board is just gross since there's so many combinations of straight flushes, and a lot of the cards on the board discount certain hands, like 98hh, which I'd expect him to flat with at times.

        At the same time, I actually don't expect too many reg-ish players to call a shove with worse here. If I was to shove river here, i've basically turned my hand face up as Ah. While I don't expect many people to be able to hand read at the micros, I think a lot of players have a fear of running into the nuts, and will usually wait until they have the nuts before making big calls.

        I think versus someone who I've had more history with, someone who I know can call here with Qh or something, I'd definitely be shoving. This was simply a hand where I had a gut churning (the same gut churning I've gotten prior to getting caught by the police doing some things I shouldn't have been doing), and thought I was behind.

        I lost the minimum here, so I'm proud of that.
        10-27-2013 , 10:56 AM
        Losing the minimum doesn't matter if it's the wrong play. Fwiw though I don't think very much calls with worse if anything really so you're right to not shove.
        10-27-2013 , 10:57 AM
        Well...my first week of online grinding 5NLHU is official over



        Rake = $15.10, $15.10 / 1140 hands = .013c/hand x 100 hands = $1.32 rake per 100 hands. $1.32/.05 -->26.5bb/100 hands in rake...and there's no rakeback for Bovada. Correct me if my math is wrong here, or if my sample size is too small to get an estimated avg on the rake (probably is, still steep though).

        6 BIs below EV, I'm guessing it's not a big deal/surprising considering it's HU. Things could be worse, like running 6 BIs above EV

        Last edited by TensRUs; 10-27-2013 at 11:12 AM.
        10-27-2013 , 11:09 AM
        Quote:
        Originally Posted by MMSS
        Because blockers? What do you block? An A high flush draw.
        Villain is trying to rep a flush here, and I block his Axcc 3bet calling range, which accounts for maybe 35%-40% (if I had to guess) of his calling range that has specifically two clubs, and Jx makes up about 15% of his entire 3bet calling range.

        Although these numbers, ldo, are really rough. That's the thought process I was going through during the hand though

        If V had Jx w/ a club, I wouldn't be posting the hand lol. I also felt like V floats with all Ax, Kx hands on this board

        Quote:
        Originally Posted by MMSS
        Shoving turn would be really bad, if you ever do shove the turn if you hit an A high flush you are missing out on so much value. You need to think about board textures. I agreed previously with you about going for as much value as we possibly can, but say you had Ac9c that board has so much that people will call normal size bets with yet very little that people will call a shove with.
        It seems like you're saying shoving is terrible for balancing purposes. I would never shove here with a flush unless the game dynamic permitted it. Tables are anonymous so balance in these kinds of spots doesn't matter too much (it does for raising a wide pf range to get calls/induce raises with our premium hands though)
        10-27-2013 , 11:15 AM
        Doesn't really look like he's trying to rep a flush draw there at all. Depending on his ranges I wouldn't be surprised to see him float your cbet a lot and bet the turn a lot. His range isn't really narrowed massively at any point.

        And shoving the turn isn't terrible for balance reasons (although that is another reason) it's terrible because it allows villain to play pretty perfectly against us. Fold a lot of his range and call with the top of it. If villain starts hero calling that's even worse for us. It's very unlikely he's going to be folding TOO much.
        10-27-2013 , 08:03 PM
        Quote:
        Originally Posted by asriva
        What is shanoobs ? How does one join ?
        Its a PokerStars Home Game for BQ. Activity is fairly irregular, but when BQers what a private table its the go to place. I am the club manager.

        --- standard BQ invite ...
        - If you don't already have it, download the free PokerStars software from http://update.pokerstars.com/PokerStarsInstall.exe
        - Open the main poker lobby, then click on the Home Games tab
        - Click the 'Join a Poker Club' button
        - Enter my Club ID number: 2783
        - Enter my Invitation Code: zomgzomg

        Use 2+2 name in application, and I'll approve anyone who's had at least a few posts in BQ
        ---
        10-27-2013 , 08:53 PM
        @MMSS

        Yeah, sounds about right. In hindsight, at best I fold 33-55, and maybe some 6x although there isn't a ton of those hands given pf action. x/j is probably just as bad a jamming, except for the fact that we were able to induce air to bet a lot of its range and extract value from it
        10-27-2013 , 09:29 PM
        EZ game.
        Sucks that people never do this on Pokerstars though. Any microstake game at 888 seems to play like 2nl at Pokerstars.



          Pacific, $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
          Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

          BB: $10.74 (107.4 bb)
          UTG: $10.15 (101.5 bb)
          MP: $10 (100 bb)
          Hero (CO): $10.37 (103.7 bb)
          BTN: $6.37 (63.7 bb)
          SB: $18.02 (180.2 bb)

          Preflop: Hero is CO with K J
          2 folds, Hero raises to $0.30, BTN folds, SB calls $0.25, BB folds

          Flop: ($0.70) K 7 J (2 players)
          SB checks, Hero bets $0.60, SB raises to $17.72 and is all-in, Hero calls $9.47

          Turn: ($20.84) 4 (2 players, 1 is all-in)
          River: ($20.84) A (2 players, 1 is all-in)

          Results: $20.84 pot ($1.04 rake)
          Final Board: K 7 J 4 A
          Hero showed K J and won $19.80 ($9.43 net)
          SB showed 9 K and won $0.00 (-$10.37 net)



          Yesterdays results were originally tilting, and then kind of okay.




          Unsure why my style has so much variance to it.
          As MMSS recommended, I'll be having a bit of a break I think. Don't know if I can do it without thinking about Poker though. I just won't play.
          10-28-2013 , 11:51 AM
          Mind = BLOWN

            Poker Stars, $0.02/$0.05 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 2 Players
            Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #20262441

            SB: $8.92 (178.4 bb)
            Hero (BB): $10.30 (206 bb)

            Preflop: Hero is BB with 6 6
            SB raises to $0.15, Hero raises to $0.50, SB raises to $1.25, Hero calls $0.75

            Flop: ($2.50) K 4 7 (2 players)
            Hero checks, SB bets $1.25, Hero raises to $2.80, SB raises to $7.67 and is all-in, Hero folds

            Spoiler:
            Results: $8.10 pot ($0.40 rake)
            Final Board: K 4 7
            SB showed 6 4 and won $7.70 ($3.65 net)
            Hero mucked 6 6 and lost (-$4.05 net)



            Get the Flash Player to use the Hold'em Manager Replayer.


            I remember almost timing out during this hand...one of the main reasons I folded was if he had QJ w/ a diamond, I was essentially f*cked, and I thought that was the bottom of his range.

            My 3bet pf was for deception...100bb I wouldn't do this, but near 200bb effective I think implied odds are set up pretty well to do this some of the time.

            I guess my WR would be better if I didn't run into sickos like these. Lost 2 BIs to this guy during our match. This hand happened soon after the A2 hand (post #833)
            10-28-2013 , 12:07 PM
            Why the hell are you x/r-ing the flop in the first place? Seems really bad.
            10-28-2013 , 12:37 PM
            Trying to rep Kx...TT-QQ w/ no diamond find a fold imo. Pretty thin I know, that's why I chose a smaller sizing. It seems like x/rai >> x/c though
            10-28-2013 , 12:48 PM
            You don't have to win every pot, I think that's something you need to work on understanding.

            I personally probably wouldn't be 3betting 66, but there's plenty of reasons why that'd be fine. I'd probably be folding to a 4bet, but same as before. Deception really isn't a good enough reason though so if that's you're argument I'd just be flatting pre.

            I think flop is probably a x/f, but I could be really wrong there.
            10-28-2013 , 01:11 PM
            Someone who has played HU should weigh in on this, but calling a 4bet oop with a small pocket pair is pretty bad imo even with deepish stacks.

            Flop, x/f is the best I think; followed by x/r shove instead of making an insignificant sized x/r to which villain is almost never folding.

            Also, villain likely isnt a sicko and is simply waiting for you to spew.
            10-28-2013 , 01:20 PM
            4betting 64s + jamming with two 4s otf = sicko
            10-28-2013 , 02:19 PM
            Quote:
            Originally Posted by TensRUs
            4betting 64s + jamming with two 4s otf = sicko
            Thought that's what HU was all about?
            10-28-2013 , 02:22 PM
            i dabbled in plo.
            i know i shouldn't do it
            so far i am breakeven over 500 hands. i should stop right now, where i am in a net plus with fpps xD

            with the fpps i will play the 13fpp 9man hyper to the "sunday splash". first two places get the one dollar entry. i think these are best? are there any better places to spend the fpps?

                  
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