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LC: Shoving Treshold LC: Shoving Treshold

11-18-2008 , 09:09 AM
Not including reads and stats with our decision, what would be the % of the pot in relation to our stack to go for a shove against 1 player? when the only decision we have is 3 betting or shove.

The lowest % I usually see in the forums is 20-25%.

Last edited by ronmar; 11-18-2008 at 09:13 AM. Reason: edited the lowest %
LC: Shoving Treshold Quote
11-18-2008 , 10:08 AM
What your asking is basically just an extension of the ~10 BB rule of thumb, i.e. when the pot is >15% of your stack, shove.

Finding the exception to the rule is the important thing, and there are a lot of exceptions. Just to point out two; 1) If the effect of the bubble is greater, then you usually want to discourage action, in that case you should make deeper shoves. 2) Shove deep preflop to avoid playing postflop out of position.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronmar
Not including reads and stats with our decision
Try making/finding an example which you do include stats and reads and you will probably get better advice.
LC: Shoving Treshold Quote
11-18-2008 , 04:04 PM
so If pot > 15% of my stack, i need to find a good reason not to shove since most of the time the +EV play would be shoving.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IFoldPktOnes
Try making/finding an example which you do include stats and reads and you will probably get better advice.
How about my example above, but I have a read that the UTG limper open limps with QQ+ only, so even if the pot size is 20% my stack folding>raising>shoving?
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11-18-2008 , 04:24 PM
If is trap/limping QQ+ only and you beat QQ+, then I'd just get it in right away (he isn't folding and if he's at QQ he might fold flops with overcards), 20% would be easy an shove, so would 10% be. If you don't beat QQ+ you need to fold regardless and never raise and never shove.

Conclusion: I don't really see where you are going with this.
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11-18-2008 , 04:33 PM
If you are you looking for rules of the thumb:

Yeah, like IFoldPktOnes says, I guess open shoving instead of open raising becomes standard around 10BB. And if the pot has already been opened I'd always shove when I want to raise and any decent raise (of, say, 75% of pot) commits me (say, leaves about as much in my stack as in the pot). Other than that, it just depends: On how much you want to discourage action. How much you want to avoid seeing a flop when committed (some people open raise AA to 2.5BB even when 6BB deep, I don't do that but the point is obvious). On your opponents ranges for calling shoves / reacting to raises? On what phase of the game you are in etc etc etc.

So yeah, like has been said, a rule of the thumb isn't that important since there are always situation specific things that you need to consider.
LC: Shoving Treshold Quote

      
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