Hi,

Are there any good free solvers out there?

Pokersnowie has a free trial

Thanks. Any full free?

I doubt there is any full free solvers at this stage. Wait 5 years maybe and there probably be a full mobile app solver available for download for free.

In that case, in 5 years the solver will consist of a text file saying "hold'em is solved, play another game"

Chess is solved, plenty of people still playing it
Probably a few that are making a living playing it

It's not because a high-end computer can solve a game that a human brain can do the same.

Chess isn't solved, chances NLHE will be in 5 years are fairly low, free solvers don't exist as far as I know.

Hmm, interesting
I thought the AI's had it solved, guess they're just like the GO AI & stuff that learns by playing a ton instead of actually solving the game.

There are no free solvers. Even if there were, you'd have to buy solutions packs (which are quite expensive), or pay for time on a cloud server to calculate your own.
GTO+ is relatively cheap (much cheaper than Pio) and you can run it on a standard computer.

Also, chess is far from solved and likely never will be. The best chess engines seem to add another 100 rating points every year though, while humanity is waaaaaayyy behind.

Chess will never be "solved" but nobody would play it for money if there was rake without bumhunting

Good steer Arty...thinking of getting back to cash next year but my "pre-requisite" to do so will be learn a damn solver, so nice one.

Question specifically for you if you are still checking this thread...what site you recommending for online cash in the UK? Unibet?

Wrong! Even if you could calculate a solution, good luck finding a memory device the size of a trillion universes to save it!

Quantum computer bro. Coming soon

And when we have quantum computers, cracking the encryption that keeps our online $$$ safe becomes trivial and we have no Internet pokers

They just have to upgrade to quantum encryption algorithms that are uncrackable, and they will.

I hardly play any more, but if you're in the micros, Unibet 4NL is still much softer than Stars 2NL, (in fact, 10NL on Unibet is probably softer than Stars 2NL) and you get better rewards/rakeback on low volume.
At more "meaningful" stakes, you ideally want a site that lets you use a HUD/tracker so you can study both your own stats, and the propensities of the population, but there aren't many of those left now.

^^

Cheers

I'm thinking (hoping) of combining 10nl to 25nl online with an evening a week of live play, so hudless would fine.

Pretty much. An AI doesn't solve anything because it learns by example. There's no ability to prove anything with an AI*

*Note that research is ongoing on AI that can actually find mathematical proofs to given problems.


A "solved" game would mean: "I get to make the first move an then I win - there is no other outcome possible" (e.g. a game like connect-four is actually solved that way).
But for chess, GO and poker that's not the case. The respective AI is just so good (for different reasons in each case) that humans stand no chance.

tic-tac-toe

global thermonuclear war

A strange game.

The only winning move is not to play.

True. for tic-tac-toe it's a no loss condition. For connect-four it's actually a certain win (on the last move if the opponent plays optimally)
For chess (and GO) it's still unknown.

That's pretty much solved (as a loss-loss)

There are moves where you place an X that gives you two-in-a-row in two directions at once, where no matter which line the opponent tries to block, you always get a line of 3 on your next move.

EDIT: "Most experienced tic tac toe players put the first "X" in a corner when they get to play first. This gives the opponent the most opportunities to make a mistake. If your opponent responds by putting an O anywhere besides the center, you can guarantee a win."
i.e. if their first move is sub-optimal, you can take them into a branch of the game tree where you always win. The game is effectively over, and your opponent has only made one move!

Well, as you note this only works if the opponent makes an error - so this is not solution but rather the usual "give the opponent opportunities to make a mistake"-play.
A solved game means you win even if the opponent makes the best possible move every time (e.g. the one who makes the first move in connect four can win if he makes no mistakes - and there is nothing the opponent can do about it).

Are you seriously claiming that tic-tac-toe is not a solved game?
A 'solved game' is just one where the optimal moves for every possible outcome have been computed. IIRC, tic-tac-toe only has about 138 terminal board positions. A 12 year-old could solve it, and computers in the early 1950s played it perfectly.

A game being "solved" doesn't mean you always win. The solution is the one that is a Nash Equilibrium, wherein all rational players minimize their losses (or maximize their winnings) by making the optimal move, even if it merely delays the opponent's victory, or minimizes their score.
In many games (such as some chess endings, and tic tac toe) the solution, from a particular decision point - if both players act optimally - is a draw.
In a prisoner's dilemma with simple payouts, and where both prisoners act rationally in their best interest, and in the knowledge that their co-conspirator will do likewise, no one 'wins'. Both prisoners still go to jail.