Yup, I just moved over to cash and I'm not moving up until I can prove I am a winning player at all the levels.

Same, I came from SNGs and I had a bankroll of $800-$1,000 that I built but I'm grinding .01/.02 NL cash as well so I can reassure myself that I am not gonna be blowing money away.

i had to cash out everthing after xmas to pay bills, and i had about 1 euro on fatbet poker, after 23 days ive got 34 euros following chris fergussons bankroll management ie no more than 10 per cent of br on table. sorry no graph but fatbet is not a pokertracker site

Seriously guys move up asap you are burning money playing in these levels you have enough to take shot a 25nl its not much harder

SNG and Cash are 2 different monsters.

I did move up to .02/.05 and I only have 1k hands there but I see enough donks there to see they are as bad as 01/02. I'm pretty upset because I was 3/3 reads on all in showdowns that I knew I was going in as the underdog with KK/QQ preflop vs AA but I still had to call for +EV. I've been in a few other all ins preflop with KK and QQ but I knew I wasn't against AA. It's so easy to spot fish at these small stakes and there are still people running 70/30 at this level and I'm baffled but there are some solid players and there are a lot of TAG fish as well. Since I've seen thousands of showdowns cause of SNGs, my reads have improved but the postflop play is a lot more in depth. Maybe I'm a knit or maybe I rather not be so volatile but shoving KK-QQ has been costing me a lot but hopefully in the long run, some donk will call a full stack with less than Aces.

Risk vs. Reward

[IMG][/IMG]

Good Job

This is my first post in this thread since I have now decided to focus on cash games.

I deposited enough to get my bankroll to be at $200 so I could play 10NL.

Had quite the hot streak to start out so I am up to $300 so far....fighting the good fight.

Using the free trial of Poker Tracker til I have to purchase it and will at that time so I will be able to graph any winnings I may have.

Will try to keep my progress updated in here. Thinking about starting a blog as well.

Good luck to everyone still grinding away!

Tried out cash for the past 4 days and the first 3 days I ran so bad because of suck out after suck out, my KK, QQ, AA all continuously losing in all in preflop but my reads have been dead on for the majority of hands.

Only had half buy-in($5) for 02/05 for 8 tables due to bad beats from the past 3 days, I managed to almost double up on 7/8 tables and 1 table I kept stacking off and ended up 5x up. Busted 5+ small-med stacked people in less than 15mins. You can see it on the graph lol.. Hoping I can move to 5/10 soon. Not sure how much I need for 5/10 8tabling.


Bankroll $75

I think you need $80 to 8 table 10nl lol I would stick to 5nl buying in with $5(100bb)

The red line isnt a big factor in micro stakes as long as your won at showdowns is alot higher

i realize the max buy in is $80.. there is a bankroll management for each stake and 8 tabling is a bit more than the original bankroll requirement.

buying in at half buy in is 100bb at 2/5 but full buyin at 5/10 is 100bb as well. why not stack yourself to max? it's the best idea and it's not like i can't beat these stakes, if you've seen my HH, i have KK cracked by AA-QQ,AK 2-3x a day for the past 3 days.

First off, only, let me repeat ONLY, play at levels of which your bankroll allows and not what you feel (or think for that matter) is the level should be playing at. Since you seem to focus on BRM (bankroll management) so much in your posts lately, then you need to adhere to the area of which you are focusing on improving. Playing half stacked at 10NL is not a good idea for anyone who is a winning +EV poker player. I'd rather noth break down the mathematics of how its costing you money. But it is, IF you are a consistent winning player.

Wether or not you are multi tabling or not shouldn't really affect your general BRM rules. When playing cash games a good measuring point as to what level you should be playing is around 20-25 MAX buyins at that particular level. Some prefer less at lower levels, some prefer more at all levels to have the sense of security to sustain the variance easily. Obviously the more the merrier is a good ideology for your bankroll. Just note that when multi tabling you are sacrificing efficiency for volume, so in effect you should win slightly less at a much faster rate. Remember though that you will also seem to see bigger and harder pockets of negative variance based on how much poker you will be condensing into your sessions. Because of this a little more padding to your bankroll is a good idea.

I noticed amongst all your sessions that you have commented about recently that you seem to have the exact same opinions on any particular session, "AA,KK,QQ<everything" types of comments. In all sincerity, I just thought that you might need to look a little deeper into your game and find some more clues as to what your own personal leaks are. Poker is such a diverse game. And having such a monotonous point of view for your losing hands is probably somewhat of a misjudgment. Big hands like AA,KK and QQ will inevitably lose to hands that they crush Preflop, but the ultimate outcome is that they will make you lots and lots of money the more you can successfully put yourself in those situations.

Good luck and I hope some of that helps.

well the thing was i have 2 bankroll, cash(pstars) and sng/mtt(ftp). Before learning poker, I would just spend $50 in cash games with my full bankroll but I started playing SNGs and Amaterasu got me into STTs which I turned $25 into about $1,000 and I was tempted to use that money for cash games where I could play 25NL but I forced myself to start from 01/02NL 4-5 days ago. in the past 3 days, i looked at my graph and I am winning almost every pot I am in, stealing blinds etc but my biggest leak in SNG was the same in Cash. All-in preflop and the thing about Cash and SNGs are cash goes by implied odds and SNGs go by Independent Chip Model(ICM). For SNGs, we have to call-ins based on how wide of a range the villain has and in microstakes cash it seems to be hand strength as in top 1% AA-QQ and how to maximize EV by getting it all in. When I 3 bet with my KK, I'm trying to make weaker draw hands lay down and trying to get as much money in for future streets so the pot is bigger thus the cost to play any draws or TPTK but people 4-5 bet back and that seems to narrow the range down to top 1%. What I've been told was that I am experiencing horrible variance that I shouldn't be running into AA as much and it is true but people who have 4-5 bet me only showed KK-AA and QQ once. A lot of people flat QQ more to reraises. I know I have a lot of other leaks such as overplaying TPTK with no straight or flush boards so I'm against 2pair or 3kind but those pots I lose a lot less and am able to stop the loss but I've been trying to find another line as to what to do with AA-KK and I haven't slow played it yet and it is much harder to get reads when slow playing

I half stacked myself playing 8 tables rather than full stack 4 tables is because I really do hate going all in preflop unless it's AA only, if I did have the full buy in, I would ofcourse buy in max(STT players are serious knits). I figured 8 tables, I could win a lot of pots post flop with position, aggression and slow playing nuts. It has worked amazingly today as I almost did not go all in preflop except for my AA. I am ok with 8 tables, 4-8 tabling SNGs in bubble/3-way/HU was crazier due to short handed and thanks for the advice, some of it did help me look at some of the leaks. I just feel like I am wasting my time half the time due to bad beats and I keep telling myself I have to 'earn' my way up moving stakes as well.

My updated graph:



I think I'm going to take another shot at 25NL now.

good luck, what was the milestone bonus, was that like pokerstars millionth hand thing?

Yeah... it sucked though, i didn't even realize I was in a milestone hand until after it was over. I folded A8o PF in early position. Turns out I would have flopped two pair. Winner of the hand got $250 instead of $100.

Well I'm withdrawing myself from this thread... which is pointless to say cause I never post anyway.

The point is I went from $0 to what I'm at now $2,842 and still have no clue how to play poker. I'm being serious... I really don't know how to play. Nit it up if you want to win at micros I guess... you won't learn anything though... I don't recommend it.

Well I'm off to actually learn to play this game. Good luck to everyone bank roll building here.

I wonder if I can still get PokerStars $50 first time deposit bonus lol

on my 9th day of cash grinding. spent about 3 days at 01/02 and got frustrated with the shoves every hand. moved to 02/05 where i had the worst variance and people here stack off on draws which is what 10/25 seems like. luckily 05/10 had the same max buy in of $10 so i had 4 buy ins to play 8 tables half stacked until i had enough for 4 buy ins for 10/25 to play 8 tables half stacked. 10/25 is frustrating me yet it's stupid. i keep giving villains too much credit and in the end, everyone is stacking off with 2nd pair WTF!?
summary:
01/02 = just bad everything
02/05 = preflop call stations, ATC suckout 2 pairs
05/10 = they respect you raises, they fold their BB 99%, when they 3bet, they have the nuts
10/25 = 3 bets every street with ATC, very common with draws, TPTK will win a lot, no one ever has a hand most of the time, a lot of people are really cally or are working implied odds to the max cause 67s seems to be everyones fav. hand.

some interesting wtf hands at 10/25. it's nothing big or major but i just am suprised that everyone goes to showdown with 2nd pair and a lot of HUUUUUUGE pots win with King high seems to win....

this is the first level where my reads are totally off as everyone 3 bets more but the bet sizing gives a lot away. i can only see weakness of strength, can't put anyone on anything. being a bit more knittier than everyone going all-in pays off real well here. 05/10 a lot more people were tighter and when going all in would mean the nuts.

i'm not following bankroll magagement i know, 4 max buy ins instead of 20-25, from now on i'll start the 20-25 buy in rule. from now on, things are a bit more scary to buy in with very little and i'm more satisfied grinding here, i'm getting FPPs yay.

the colorsssssssss




Poker Stars $0.10/$0.25 No Limit Hold'em - 5 players - View hand 23311
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

SB: $14.75
BB: $11.05
UTG: $4.65
Hero (CO): $17.30
BTN: $51.50

Pre Flop: ($0.35) Hero is CO with Q K
1 fold, Hero raises to $0.75, 1 fold, SB calls $0.65, 1 fold

Flop: ($1.75) 6 K 3 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $1, SB calls $1

Turn: ($3.75) 4 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $2, SB calls $2

River: ($7.75) A (2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks

Final Pot: $7.75
SB shows A 6 (two pair, Aces and Sixes)
Hero mucks Q K
SB wins $7.40
(Rake: $0.35)
i know i should of bet more on the turn but i thought he was slowplaying me but seriously, he hit 2 pair wtf is he checkin, wtf is he calling for OOP and calling 2nd pair. this has been common, not the bad beat but people calling down 2nd pair, people at all lower levels have not..

Bumpaments:

January didn't go well for me and with other things going on I had no motivation to play. Started February with a fresh mind.

Today's session (I know it says two days but thats because I played past midnight.)

Bankroll $338.44

The beats at 10nl have been ****ing me up, down $50 from it, soul destroying

So.... I took another shot at 25NL. Things weren't going so well. I don't feel like I was playing badly, but I was getting crushing beats whenever I would take hands to showdown. I kept playing at 25NL with the assumption that things would turn around. After being down $178, I finally had enough and decided to go back to 10NL.

I then proceeded to lose an additional $57 at 10NL! This is the same 10NL that was like printing money a week ago. I was beating 10NL at a steady 6ptbb/100 over 20kish hands.

The only bright spot of the past week for me is that my W$ w/o SD line was break even over 5k hands at 25NL. I don't understand what the heck I'm doing differently (if anything) lately that is killing my showdown winnings so badly.

Stats up to last post:



Stats for shot at 25NL+drop down to 10NL:


Graph of the massacre:


Bankroll at $298.56

I think I'm just taking a week off from playing.

Hi All

After some major tilt and losing half my roll i have cashed out all but $10 and have about 5500 fpp. So count me in for trying this challenge. The plan so far

convert fpp via 210fpp sat to sun 2K
play 2nl Fr (as 6max is tilting me at the moment.)
And lastly and most important get more involved on 2+2.

Once i've convert the fpps any suggestions on what sngs to play?
look forward to joining the grind.

Well it took me just over two months but I've made my first 1k playing poker. I've played over 150k hands, I think I can confidently say I'm not a winning player.

The biggest thing I've learnt that poker is more about your mental game than your actual poker skill. If you don't have the patience, you won't succeed, if you don't have the determination to do the work when not playing, you won't succeed, if you don't have the strength to deal with a 20k downswing, you won't succeed.

I'm not a very good player IMO, however I'm disciplined. I won't say if I can do it anybody can because I know I got the mental game, I know I'm mentally stronger than 99% of the population whereas 99% of you are probably better poker players than me.

Bankroll management is huge as well. 20 BI's is ok for a casual player but not nearly enough for a serious player.

Nice McAvoy congrats.

sorry to hear that bill, instead of not playing, take that time to study your leaks. when i moved up to 25NL, i found it a lot easier than 10NL and so much easier than 5NL(i was almost losing player in 5NL). people play a lot more standard in 25NL so anything not standard bet sizing or min bets are sign of weaknesses or strengths. this is where i pick people off and my aggression kicks in. a lot more reraising and if they reraise you more, ofcourse they are slow playing but usually that isn't the case.

you maybe knitty as to playing your hands but i assume you are fighting with TPTK such as AK on a Ks2c7c board and someone is reraising you to basically a shove, it's an easy spot to fold. you gotta know ur villains and regs.

this hand is a suckout i made on someone because it was a dumb stack off of TPTK because i couldn't put the villain on a 4 but I was thinking possible flush but possibly Qx.

he was like 20/3, pretty smart person, knew implied odds but he was a bit hard headed but I really was here. I never ever stack off here but I just couldn't believe two 4's would flop with him having a 4. This is the mistake a lot of people are making, not being able to fold TPTK, i hit a 2 outter so don't take the result into consideration but he should of known that I was a donk with a Queen here when I went all in on the river.

I played this terribly
My thoughts:
After teh flop, Villain called IP so he could be having AQ, KQ, QJ, SC
Turn, possible flush, still thinking he has Qx, don't think he would bet out with a flush so I call his bet.

On river, I was gonna check/fold here but Queen came up which I wasn't expecting and I figure, split pot, flush vs FH, or quads. Either way, I seemed to be ahead realistic and he will have to call most of the times here but I didn't really believe he would on a botom full house.
9/10 times, we won't get this lucky so if an A came on the river, I would of had to check/fold as well, I was basically drawing dead but people at 25NL are getting decent at playing implied odds.


Poker Stars $0.10/$0.25 No Limit Hold'em - 7 players - View hand 30419
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

UTG: $6.00
Hero (UTG+1): $44.00
MP: $11.30
CO: $14.25
BTN: $22.00
SB: $23.45
BB: $25.90

Pre Flop: ($0.35) Hero is UTG+1 with A Q
1 fold, Hero raises to $0.75, MP calls $0.75, 1 fold, BTN calls $0.75, 1 fold, BB calls $0.50

Flop: ($3.10) Q 4 4 (4 players)
BB folds, Hero checks, MP bets $1.25, BTN raises to $3, Hero calls $3, MP calls $1.75

Turn: ($12.10) 2 (3 players)
Hero checks, MP checks, BTN bets $6, Hero calls $6, MP folds

River: ($24.10) Q (2 players)
Hero bets $12.25, BTN calls $12.25 all in

Final Pot: $48.60
Hero shows A Q (a full house, Queens full of Fours)
BTN mucks 5 4
Hero wins $46.25
(Rake: $2.35)