so i pretty much play 50nl and was taking shots at 100nl on stars but have recently been taking shots at live private games and withdrew my whole role to have shots at these 5/10/20 games that play like 2nl.

long story short, ive have been playing for about 14 hours straight with no breaks and have made about 6k (after reloading once KK>AA ) and have a stack off around 6kish.

theres an aggrofish on my left who has been running hot and has roughly the same stacksize. he has been super aggro post-flop, c/r flops and just making really donkish bluffs etc. and me trying to be a hero, stacked off light vs him 400bbs deep, i dont hate my play but i wish i thought about it abit more but tiredness/fatigue owned me.

i dont feel sick from the losses but i havent ever loss anything closs to this, its pretty much my entire bankroll and really dont know how to handle myself here, i know its not alot of money but i feel really attached to the money i know the risks of playing underrolled in loose live games but just feel so crappy as it was my bankroll to move up online a learning tool etc. and now i dont have money to redeposit and quitting pokers seems like a really good option atm.

any advice from people with experience?

man this looks like such a bad beat thread, not looking for sympathy just unsure how to rebuild.

Yeah I have been there before too. I built up around 4k in about a few months playing underground games in high school (1/3 NL), which was the most money I ever had at the time. I've had nights where I built up a 500bb stack and play all night from 7pm until 5am to get coolered for almost or all of it at the end, when you get home you just drop in bed disgusted. Just gotta move on and grow from it just like any other tough experience.

Fast forward a few months, I was in my first year of college away from my family for the first time funding myself for food and life. I had about 3k then too and I shipped a lot of money doing stuff. As I was dwindling down I told myself, "damm I can just deposit and make $ online, easy game." (Never even played online before). Then I deposit $500 on carbon to play some 50NL. Then another 5. I have $400 left, I deposit $300. I now have to live for the next 2 months with $100 cash and trying to figure out where I went wrong. Bread, peanut butter, water, and a big box of oatmeal (plain, yuck!) was all the food in my room. I ate from the dorm fridge when I couldn't take the food I had anymore. I could've, but didn't call my parents for $$. That was a tough 2-3 months to "try" and live the lifestyle I was enjoying. I learned soooo much from it though.

Sorry for the TLDR but just wanted to say poker is a tough game. insanely long breakeven stretches or sick losing sessions like the one you experienced (relative amount) break a lot of poker players careers.

Take a break till you feel better (you'll know when it happens) and get back on the grind. Idk if you watched rounders, but yeah right now your mike after battling KGB (thats what i told myself to feel better lol). Your roll was decent so it could take a while to rebuild playing .02/.04 so maybe you may want to consider "driving the truck" and then jump back to the stakes you were at online. This could be your break from poker and you can reflect on your situation.

Firstly don't play underrolled. Now that's out of the way, if you are taking shots at a juicy game but are underrolled, I have found the best idea is just nut peddle. Very unsexy and unimaginative but if your aim is to make teh moniez rather than look good at the table just sit back, peddle the nuts and let them give you their money in a lower variance way. You won't make as much as you could if you played looser but as you have a small roll for these stakes you also have a much larger risk of ruin so you need to do everything possible to reduce the swings. Pushing thin edges when minimally rolled, even if you are the best player at the table, is just a sure way to bustoville.

If you feel like you're super tilted, maybe a break from poker is best. Posting this thread here is most likely your way of hearing the harsh truth in hopes that you'll confirm that we tell you to do what you already think you should be doing.


Work for a while, build your roll, and redeposit. Take this as a harsh lesson in bankroll management and learn from it.

I would suggest a break from poker. Read some books, watch some videos but stay away from the tables. Your first instinct will be "I have to win that money back" and that will ultimately lead up to no good.

TLDRs was great, really keeps my mind straight that other good players have been through the same ****, i understand that i could of easily busted my roll playing these games but if i ran good in these games i knew i could build a very big roll, very fast. i really dont think im going to be grinding out 5nl games to build another roll. i mean i felt like i shoud of left the game because i was so tired, but the game was so good that even if i was playing my c-game id still have a huge edge. "driving the truck" sounds good, arghh. such a gross feeling.

i agree with everything you say, but at 5/10/20 + random straddles the game plays way to big to just nit it out. idk i just felt like if i ran good, i could build a nice live roll + redeposit an online roll, now im a busto 20yr old and feel like i wasted a year of grinding

yeah, i have very minimal people around me who understand poker. i just felt hearing similiar stories would make me feel a bit less crappy.

i have good tilt control etc. but i do agree that this loss will affect me mentally short-term if i try hit the tables nytime soon, ty.

Well if you think taking a break from poker is a good option after that experience, no one here is going to argue against that.

There's this Post Oak Bluff video I watched on youtube...can't find it to save my life but basically a pro talks about how he was playing high stakes HUNL with a massive fish, but he kept losing tons of money because the fish was running hotter than the sun. Because of this, he decided to quit even though he had a massive skill edge over the fish. He said if he hadn't quit the game, he would've been broke.

The moral of the story is pretty clear - no matter how big your edge is in a game, you need to exercise good BRM to protect your BR. Sure, players take shots now and then. But a shot isn't your entire roll on the table...it's 10%-15% of your roll (imo). And again, the shot has to be in a game where you have a significant edge in. Can't cry over spilled busto, but it is what it is. Happens to everyone.

My version of shot taking was winning enough money at 2/3 to have 2 bullets for 3/5. I lost those 2 bullets, but at least my entire roll wasn't on the table so I was still able to play another day after that cooler session. You might want to try that next time, unless you aren't close to a casino.

yeah, i mean i feel bad for not quitting after how tired i was. but if i scooped that 12k pot i wouldnt even think twice about it. *sigh* maybe this is just a cheap lesson on how to take shots, but i mean if you were invited to a game like this, would you pass it up?

I would never put my entire roll on the table. There will always be good games dude. Think about how long it took you to build your roll ffs lol. We've all been there, though. Let he who never degened his BR away, cast the first stone, etc etc

fair enough, thanks for advicee.

Wow, so many mistakes listed in your short post:

1) Playing underrolled. This is huge. I know how bad these rich fish can be but they can still take advantage of you if you are underrolled and there is no way you can play optimally if you are underrolled. In fact, I would argue that playing optimally is not what you would want to do when playing underrolled as survival is more important than pushing every edge.

2) Playing tired. No excuse for this really. You were already deep and a winner. Just leave. Noone will get mad if you leave after 8+ hrs.

3) Aggro fish that covers you is on your left. This is pretty inexcusable. If you couldn't change seats this alone should have convinced you to get up.

BTW, I have a hard time believing that it plays like 2NL. Were you the best player at the table? Not one sicko? Why is that? High rake? Barriers to entry? I haven't seen many games that big lasting 14hrs that haven't had at least a few sickos in them.

Regardless, playing underrolled is gambling pure and simple. Now you know what it feels like to be a degenerate gambler.

Whatever else you choose to feel, don't choose this.

I'm sure you're a much better player today than you were a year ago.

You don't have the bankroll to show for it - you broke the rule about BRM, don't do it again - but the other skills you've developed are still very much in place.

Rebuild. Go again. It's not over until you decide that it is.

Good Luck.

yeah agree with everything you said, but in my head i felt if i left id be leaving moneys on the table.

the game was held at my friends dads house (whom are extremely wealthy) but long story short got an invite (its a very social game between rich buisness dudes and would be pretty hard to get get an invite, esp if your a sicko) the game starts at 8pm-ends when table breaks but because we started short-handed and people started coming later on in the night the game ran much longer.

theres no raked pots, my friends dad just hosts it for a night out kind of thing the only rake is a $100 fee to pay for dealer/drinks/food which is pretty cool.

id say i was by far the best on the table (obv. ), one nitty old dude and my mate who only plays live whos solid, the rest are just there to gambool.

thanks diamond

Nice post and some good comments, but you hardly seem like someone needing to post on the BQ for your answers. Best of luck to you!

Now it sounds like you're saying "I'd do it again in a heart-beat".


Even if the play was +EV there was a substantial risk of ruin that you seem to want everyone here to ignore and say "You did what any of us would have done."

That'll be me then.

OP is a dumbass. If I could get at him in real life, right now, Id kick him hard up the arse. Roll on the table? What were you thinking of? Not good bankroll management thats for sure. You didnt even tell us "Oh I had to take a whole roll shot because the game was soft". In short, this is a sharp lesson in what happens when you arent rolled correctly for the game you are playing. Let this be a warning for anyone else who's thinking about doing it.

i think thats a complement, so ty sir :P

i agree, i think im trying to find confirmation that im not the only person in the world with a brain of a monkey.

i deserved that.

brm > rollzontables because i want to be a balla, got myself a labourer's job to get my roll back before uni starts, there goes my summer.

It'll do you good mate. Character building. "That which does not kill us only makes us stranger!"

Not trying to make you feel like crap, but even though I said most people have gone busto using bad BRM, that's still completely different from putting a year's worth of grinding on the table.

If you were able to grind up to 2 BIs for 1kNL you should have enough experience to know that's a bad idea.

If you want a relatable story, I might come close

BR during summer --> $3000

Took a break from poker, got interested in sneakers.

BR post aftermath of sneaker hobby + other stuff (Oct) -->$400

My reg game is 4/8/16kill Omaha 8. 25% of the required BR to play that game. And the "other stuff" included a $100 deposit on Bovada so I could still grind in case I go busto playing severely under-rolled.

I know my sneaker binge isn't the same as taking a shot at a good game, but I still left enough money for myself to play poker if/when I wanted to. The worst part about going bust is that when you do, you can't even play anymore.

Yeah for the next time you really want to degen, Just think about the slope of an exponential curve (the one that starts off flat and close to the x-axis and gets steeper at an increasing rate the longer you go along the x-axis). with that 6k you were at the part where you can actually accelerate your growth ($) at a decent speed, but by going busto you have to start at the flat part of the graph again. I would post a pic so its easier to visualize but I think you get what I am talking about. Not only do you lose your 6k, but you lose the money that the 6k could make you in that time that you have to grind .02/.04 over or whatever to get your roll back (opportunity cost basically).

And like I said, I have already been in your spot before so I know whats coming next for you. DO NOT go to that home game after getting that paycheck from work lol Im serious! My close friend (who also plays the 1/3 games with me) used to work for minimum wage and would always take his $200 from work to the 1/3 and go busto every two weeks and I had to roll him so he could make it through the times. (he is a good player and finally broke through thank god). We were both in high school and I didn't have a job so I was nervous as my ROR would increase in my attempt to roll my friend and play.

Be patient, get your s**t together, get your online roll back, build up (most likely from a JOB, wayyy faster) at least 10BI's for LIVE and then go crush the world and be a baller at uni lol

I'm concerned by your comments to the effect o "if I could only run good" and "the game was too good to nit it up." It sounds like that nitting it up was the style that was called for regardless of your BR situation. Any time you enter a game where you're counting on running good there's a problem. Just something to think about.

As for rebuilding, if you can't cope with rebuilding the long way, why don't you find some other form of income and try to supplement yuor BR? Could be faster and more steady. If you want to take another shot at these games, you could just show up with 1-2 BI instead of your whole roll. A little run bad will knock you out for a little while, but it won't crush you either and you've still got the same giant edge.

I am currently working on bankroll rebuild number 3. It happens. Although it shouldn't happen via the way you describe. I have lost my roll twice from overspending off the table followed by a sick downswing. Is it tough dropping down rebuilding. Hell yes. The 2nd time I had my roll going, I was using it for life stuff. Even the wife has made comments for me to get going on the poker thing. (she was liking the extra money I was bringing home, too bad for her she is the reason for the extra spending. I tried to warn her. Don't get married lol)

Stick to the grind, use the negative experiences for lessons learned. If you don't learn from mistakes, you are forever doomed to repeating them. (yes the wife told me she will not beg me to take from br for stuff. Home improvements for what it's worth, not complete wasted)

In defense of the OP, I think he meant there were tons of thin edges, and if BRM wasn't an issue, it was extremely profitable. If they're constantly allowing him to get it in as a 55-60% favorite, you'd take that every time. I think that's what be meant by "run good" was to win the more marginal (but still long-term profitable) spots. I highly doubt he was talking about purposely getting it in bad and trying to "run good".