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Old 12-09-2011, 12:06 PM   #251
SuitedJunk
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Re: Thread about video poker

The great thing about video poker is you can do what you want... There are people who will hold just a "10" and hit a Royal.

As far as your examples:



Ex:

3 4 6 A T

How about vs. two unsuited high cards?


If you are going to hold anything besides the 346, it should be only the Ace. The 10 only hurts you. It will keep you from getting a royal. One more card filling up the space between you and 4oak (four of a kind). Just hold the Ace, you can hit a royal holding one card... I have...


Ex:

3 4 6 J Q

How about vs. two suited broadways?


Yes you can hold both picture cards. You have no chance at a royal, but you can hit a straight, full house, 4oak, two pair, etc etc... There are certain people that would hold only the Q of clubs. And me personally I would only hold the Q.

Ex:

3 4 6 K Q

How about specifically a 234 SF draw vs. suited and unsuited broadways


In this case, You can really go either way, with what ever you feel. Some will go for the KQ for the chance at the bigger payout (royal, still has a straight flush possibility as well). Plus with KQ, you have a better chance at getting a break even pair or two pair. 3 4 6 suited you have a chance at a straight flush (still slim) and a straight. but getting a smaller paying hand is just as hard.


Ex:

2 3 4 with K Q or A K



Basically same as the first two... In JoB, you should hold 2 picture cards, but some go for holding one if off suit for a chance at a royal.
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Old 12-09-2011, 12:11 PM   #252
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Re: Thread about video poker

This is a good analysis of a similar hand... but more for a double double bonus / tripple double bonus game in mind:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6fMz...layer_embedded

Here is another in Bonus Poker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6fMz...layer_embedded


Whole series is here:
http://alanbestbuys.com/id194.html

Many think Rob Singer is a nutter... but at the same time, people who play specifically for the math can be even crazier... If you play for the math you are playing to lose anyway (JoB is a negative expatiation game), only thing that gives you an advantage could be bonuses and playing through hundreds of thousands of hands before you could begin to realize the actual return of the game.
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Old 12-09-2011, 04:20 PM   #253
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Re: Thread about video poker

Casinos must like Rob Singer. He is telling you to sacrifice EV to generally reduce variance, which is only okay if you're really concerned about swings, but if you are, you probably shouldn't be playing casino games to begin with.

In video poker, there often is only one decision per hand that is best for the player, all other decisions cost the player money in the long haul.

And these decisions also change by game!

Also with all these questions, a SF draw with 3 low cards and 2 gaps, like 3 4 7 for example, a single high card then becomes a better play.

Ex:

3 4 6 A T

How about vs. two unsuited high cards?


With one high card, always keep 3 4 6

On a quarter full-pay jacks or better machine ($1.25 per hand) you earn about 7.75 cents more on average by doing this than just holding the ace.

3 4 6 $0.6707
A $0.5925


Ex:

3 4 6 J Q

How about vs. two suited broadways?


Keep 3 4 6 still

3 4 6 $0.6672
J Q $0.6373
J $0.5925

Ex:

3 4 6 K Q


Now, because KQ is suited, we are better off with high card, straight, flush, and royal chances than 3 to a SF with one gap.

K Q $0.7579
3 4 6 $0.6672



Ex:

How about specifically a 234 SF draw vs. suited and unsuited broadways

2 3 4 with K Q or A K



Actually 2 3 4 is the same as 3 4 6

with 234 you can only make straights with A5 or 56, just as many as 346 (25 or 57)

Now if you had 3 4 5 then you should hold this vs KQ suited

3 4 5 $0.7875
K Q $0.7579

I got the numbers from using VP Genius, it's a great tool, and will create a strategy for tons of different games and paytables (and yes, strategies can change based on a paytable adjustment).

http://www.vpgenius.com/video-poker/...r-better.aspx#
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Old 12-09-2011, 06:17 PM   #254
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Re: Thread about video poker

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Originally Posted by SuitedJunk View Post
The great thing about video poker is you can do what you want... There are people who will hold just a "10" and hit a Royal.
Yes, you can "do what you want" but you are encouraging him to play sub-optimally. None of these decisions are especially close, and tringlomane is right, the best thing to do is to use VP genius to analyze the hands and tell you how to play optimally.

To the OP, I would immediately disregard any source that gives you advice different from the ones tringlomane posted, as whatever conflicting advice you read was not even close. The only time there are exceptions to the basic strategy rules for 9/6 JoB involve penalty cards, for example if you are dealt KsTs943, the 9 is a penalty card as it slightly lowers your chances of making a straight with the KT. There are a few different examples where you would make one play if no penalty cards were involved and another play if there are penalty cards involved, but they come up rarely enough that the change in your EV by learning them will be pretty minimal.
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Old 12-09-2011, 06:44 PM   #255
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Re: Thread about video poker

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The only time there are exceptions to the basic strategy rules for 9/6 JoB involve penalty cards, for example if you are dealt KsTs943, the 9 is a penalty card as it slightly lowers your chances of making a straight with the KT. There are a few different examples where you would make one play if no penalty cards were involved and another play if there are penalty cards involved, but they come up rarely enough that the change in your EV by learning them will be pretty minimal.
Yeah, unless OP wants to fry his brain, I wouldn't want him to focus too much on penalty cards. I play so infrequently that I even probably miss virtually all penalty card situations, but ignoring them would lower the total return less than 0.01%. However, I do seem to like being a math dork about this game.

Last edited by tringlomane; 12-09-2011 at 06:44 PM. Reason: typo
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Old 12-09-2011, 09:33 PM   #256
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Re: Thread about video poker

Thanks for the help guys it helped me out today as i put in my first mega grind to get card upgrades at the casino + cashback.

I brought $8,500 with me to play $20 a spin full pay 9/6 JoB. It was a pretty crazy session, I grinded my dick off for about 12 hours. I didn't hit any royals or straight flushes unfortunately. I was stuck about $7,000 at my low point but I came roaring back and ended up breaking even. The coolest part of the whole session is when i hit immediate back-to-back quad kings. What are the odds on that? Pretty crazy
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Old 12-24-2011, 12:11 AM   #257
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Re: Thread about video poker

bump, been on the grind, hopefuly i can post my picture soon
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Old 12-26-2011, 06:52 PM   #258
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Re: Thread about video poker

playing JOB today
was dealt T J X X J
of course hold JJ and my redraw was
QKA

FML
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Old 12-26-2011, 08:03 PM   #259
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Re: Thread about video poker

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Originally Posted by Barbiaux View Post
a lot of great info in this thread as always.

One thing I didn't see mentioned though is, how is it done. Do people who make money sit there and play until they get the royal and hope it wins more than lost so far? On the podcast I just listened to he mentioned a royal cycle can be as many as 30,000 hands.
This question indicates that you don't really understand gambling. I'd put in a lot of effort understanding things like expectation and standard deviations and risk of ruin and whatnot before ever attempting to play video poker for a profit. Read until you can answer your own question.
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Old 12-26-2011, 11:04 PM   #260
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Re: Thread about video poker

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This question indicates that you don't really understand gambling. I'd put in a lot of effort understanding things like expectation and standard deviations and risk of ruin and whatnot before ever attempting to play video poker for a profit. Read until you can answer your own question.
I posted this 7 months ago. At that time you are completely correct where as I did not understand VP. I had always thought it was the same thing as playing a slot machine. Since then I have studied this game for hours and hours. I would say that I am 90%? fluent on this game now. However this has not allowed me to beat a 97% return machine :-( which is what I am stuck playing in PA.
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Old 12-26-2011, 11:42 PM   #261
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Re: Thread about video poker

The dude who made that podcast is an ass because he doesn't really know what a "Royal cycle" is. All average royal cycles are > 30,000 hands, afaik. And in practice, going 100k hands or more without a royal can be done with a frequency > 5%. And yes, a 97.3% game is too big of an edge to give up to "beat" longterm.
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Old 12-27-2011, 11:45 AM   #262
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Re: Thread about video poker

On the winpoker app, how do u adjust the JoB for royal progressives?
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Old 12-28-2011, 12:42 AM   #263
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Re: Thread about video poker

Change the royal flush value in the paytable and it will adjust its strategy accordingly.

To do this select "add paytable from selected game".
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Old 12-28-2011, 09:50 AM   #264
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Re: Thread about video poker

Got it ,Ty
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Old 12-28-2011, 08:10 PM   #265
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Re: Thread about video poker

You are most welcome. Did you take the progressive down?
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Old 12-29-2011, 01:01 AM   #266
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Re: Thread about video poker

Quote:
Originally Posted by catch thirtythree View Post
Thanks for the help guys it helped me out today as i put in my first mega grind to get card upgrades at the casino + cashback.

I brought $8,500 with me to play $20 a spin full pay 9/6 JoB. It was a pretty crazy session, I grinded my dick off for about 12 hours. I didn't hit any royals or straight flushes unfortunately. I was stuck about $7,000 at my low point but I came roaring back and ended up breaking even. The coolest part of the whole session is when i hit immediate back-to-back quad kings. What are the odds on that? Pretty crazy


Where did you put your grind in at? Was out at Joliet and the best I could find there was 8/6 JOB on $1 machine.
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Old 01-03-2012, 04:23 AM   #267
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Re: Thread about video poker

Are there people that actually make a living playing video poker? If so, their minimum bets are probably $5 right?
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Old 01-03-2012, 08:00 PM   #268
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I just tool a weekend trip from pittsburgh to chicago and stopped at harrahs juliet. I looked all over for job and could not find one. Did i just miss it or do they not have job. I was also shocked when i got kicked out of the casino at six am because they close. I was shocked to see a casino closing
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Old 01-03-2012, 08:28 PM   #269
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Re: Thread about video poker

Quote:
Originally Posted by Barbiaux View Post
playing JOB today
was dealt T J X X J
of course hold JJ and my redraw was
QKA

FML


The cards shuffle 300 times a second they don't "lock" for your redraw. So the odds you would have hit the identical QKA of clubs if you held the TJ of clubs is over 16000 to 1

So don't sweat it
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Old 01-03-2012, 10:07 PM   #270
Barbiaux
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Re: Thread about video poker

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Originally Posted by Limpcallcallfold View Post
The cards shuffle 300 times a second they don't "lock" for your redraw. So the odds you would have hit the identical QKA of clubs if you held the TJ of clubs is over 16000 to 1

So don't sweat it
I know this but it still sucks to see. :-(
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Old 01-04-2012, 10:41 AM   #271
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Re: Thread about video poker

thats happend to me before.. keep in mind, if you took any extra time to decide to hold just the JT, you wouldnt have gotten the QKAc
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Old 01-04-2012, 01:00 PM   #272
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Re: Thread about video poker

Quote:
Originally Posted by Barbiaux View Post
I just tool a weekend trip from pittsburgh to chicago and stopped at harrahs juliet. I looked all over for job and could not find one. Did i just miss it or do they not have job. I was also shocked when i got kicked out of the casino at six am because they close. I was shocked to see a casino closing
Welcome to the Midwest! Even Harrah's STL closes for an hour from 6-7am on Wed. I think.

I would assume Joliet has JoB machines, but I'm sure they don't pay well. You should have made a 2.5 hour longer trek to st. louis, at least some machines are full pay here.
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Old 01-04-2012, 04:56 PM   #273
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Re: Thread about video poker

Quote:
Originally Posted by Limpcallcallfold View Post
The cards shuffle 300 times a second they don't "lock" for your redraw. So the odds you would have hit the identical QKA of clubs if you held the TJ of clubs is over 16000 to 1

So don't sweat it
i was under the impression the ten cards you can potentially use that hand is decided when you hit the deal button. 5cards you get dealt. and 5cards on top of the deck. the draw doesnt change anything.
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Old 01-04-2012, 05:07 PM   #274
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Re: Thread about video poker

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Originally Posted by RudeboyOi View Post
i was under the impression the ten cards you can potentially use that hand is decided when you hit the deal button. 5cards you get dealt. and 5cards on top of the deck. the draw doesnt change anything.
That used to be the case. For at least the past few years, the RNG keeps cranking after the initial deal, resulting in the draw being dependent upon when the "draw" button is pressed. Not that it makes any difference over the long haul.

I can not recall the explanation of the reasoning behind the change.
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Old 01-06-2012, 02:33 PM   #275
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Re: Thread about video poker

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That used to be the case. For at least the past few years, the RNG keeps cranking after the initial deal, resulting in the draw being dependent upon when the "draw" button is pressed. Not that it makes any difference over the long haul.

I can not recall the explanation of the reasoning behind the change.

+1
I believe it's been about four years, and the cards shuffle 300 times a second of every little motion changes everything.
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