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Old 03-22-2017, 11:29 AM   #1
hubble71
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Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

Can't find any information on this game/scam on two plus two. This is for sure 100% a scam run by professional con artist and not a legitimate casino game. I have searched this site for other stories/victims of this scam. (maybe I'm not using the search properly, or maybe I am just very unlucky and one of the very few people that have fallen for this scam.) I will post a full report describing the operation in as much detail as possible so no one else loses money (becomes a victim) of this SCAM..
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Old 03-22-2017, 03:07 PM   #2
hubble71
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

When you walk into the casino they give you $20 in free chips to play a special game. The game is very Roullette like (looking). It has a Roullette like wheel where you drop eight marbles into and they fall into holes that have numbers beside (1-6). Each marble is then counted to give you a total score. (Highest score would be 48 and the lowest would be 8) and every number in between would/should be possible. When your number total is added up you look on the table to see what it correlates too. Every number has a different result associated with it, some good, and some bad.. The game starts out with the players bet at $10 and the Jackpot at $1000. As you start the game (with the free chips) you don't pay very close attention (big mistake) and you magically get good spins that give you a lot of points early. I was up to 65 points with the initial free chips and the jackpot had doubled to $2000.00. (Took about 10-15 spins). One of the spins my total was 44 with the 8 marbles and that gave me 50 points towards the jackpot. The dealer said " OH! that was a very good spin for the player, that total happens very rarely, you are very lucky". When at the 65 point mark and out of the free chips if one was to walk away no harm would be done. I kept playing having $400 in my pocket. As the game went on costing $20 a spin and the jackpot at $2000 gives you the hope that you should still make a profit if you get a couple 5 ant 10 point spins to get you closer to the 100point total points required to with the jackpot. One of the point totals doubled the jackpot but didn't double my bet. (can not remember what point total that was). I remember that the numbers 28-30-and 32 doubled the jackpot but also doubled the bet to keep playing. A couple of the totals give you a blue cherries or red cherries (the dealer covers up that number with a red or blue plackard) and you don't lose your bet. (players bet stays) and if you get 4 red cherries you get a $1000 and if you get/accumulate 4 blue cherries you get $2500. If you happen to roll the number that is already covered with a plackard the player loses his bet. So when I lost the $400 that I had on me I was at 85points (15points more to win the jackpot that was now at $8000 and it was costing $40. to spin) At this point I was frustrated because I was so close to winning and was out of money. (thinking I could not take full advantage of the lucky 50 point spin I had so early in the game). Talking with the dealer they said they could hold the game for me while I could go get more money to play. (thinking I'm so close to the big payout and I have about $1100 cash back in my room about 15 minutes away that I should continue to play) I go get my money and continue to play now paying very close attention to the numbers as the dealer adds them up when I roll (he adds very quickly) . I can add numbers very quickly and did not catch him making an error from this point on. The game slows down from this point on and if you get a good result for the player it is a very small number, adding to your total slowly but surely you think you are just one spin away from the jackpot. Along the way you hit the 28-30-32 number combination that doubles the bet but also doubles the jackpot so you think who cares as long as you win the jackpot the bigger it is the better. I get to 96 points and I am out of cash. it is costing $160 to spin and the jackpot is at $32,000. Again I am frustrated that I got so close to winning the jackpot and run out of cash. This is when they dealer lets me know that I can run a marker and play on credit if I have a credit card. I reluctantly agree to continue. Neadless to say the that in the next couple of spins it goes up to costing $640 a spin and the jackpot is at $128,000(My point total is at 99 only 1 point away from the jackpot) . The dealer informs me that my marker is over $5000 and that I can not continue without settling up. We run my card for 100,000 Dominican pesos and it is accepted. (about $2100) and when they try to run the remaining balance through the card is declined. I go back to my room frustrated that I was so close and also a bit nervous that I owe the casino a few thousand dollars. I have the money, in bank accounts at home but hoping that the daily credit limit is what is stopping my card from working. (I have plenty of available room on my credit card). As I layed in bed thinking how lucky I was to get the big 50 point total so early in the game and then also to get so unlucky to get to 99 points (one point away from the jackpot) and run out of money/credit with the jackpot so huge I start to think it smells of a possible scam. The next morning I go to the lobby of the resort (only place with WIFI) and google roulette like scam in the Domincan and come to the realization that no-one ever gets the jackpot and that it is a SCAM run by professional con artist. After much communication/customer complaint forms filled in/ with the resort customer service and conversations with the resort manager I get very little satisfaction that anything positive/good will get resolved. I changed my flight and left the country 2 days early, as everything was just felt shady from the casino/resort/ resort staff. My credit card is now cancelled.. I lost the cash and believe the 100,000 peso charge is unrecoverable. I left owing money to the casino. If I felt it was a legitimate game I would gladly pay the money I owe. I have not quite figured out how the game is a scam (the numbers on the wheel change possibly, magnets in the machine force the balls into specific slots possibly, or the quick adding of the dealer is not correct) or a combination of all three is a possibility.
The game does not have a name but from my research It is know as "8 ball jackpot or Jackpot Roulette or the Scam game."
The resort I stayed at was the Bavaro Princess All Suites Resort, Spa & Casino. The casino is on the Resort at the entrance called Avalon Casino. I CAN NOT EMPHASIZE ENOUGH NOT TO STAY AT THIS RESORT OR GO TO THIS CASINO.
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Old 03-22-2017, 05:59 PM   #3
NewOldGuy
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

I would guess the game is played honestly and just has a very high house edge and not much chance for you to win. If you don't even know the rules or the odds then you might as well burn your money. Games that are designed to look beatable but aren't, are the lifeblood of all casinos since the beginning of time.
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Old 03-22-2017, 06:34 PM   #4
Didace
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

I fail to see the scam.

Also, Dec 2006 registration and first two posts today. Impressive.
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Old 03-22-2017, 07:26 PM   #5
hubble71
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

If this is not a scam I would be back as soon as possible with a very large bank roll to win this game as many times as possible (with a very large bankroll) . The payouts are too large for the relative to the amount you can win and compared to the odds of hitting a favorable result. No one ever wins the jackpot. If you get to 99 points all the results are bad for the player from that point on, and the people that do continue to play the game go on to lose 10s of thousands of dollars. I do have post on this site from many years ago, when I originally started playing poker. I haven't posted on this site in years. I still believe it is the best gambling forum out there and read certain sections every week. I am not looking for pitty but am trying to warn as many people as possible. I will try and attach a link to a picture of the game that I have just found on line.
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Old 03-22-2017, 07:35 PM   #6
Tractor
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

@hubble71: I would actually like reading your post but without any paragraphs it's almost impossible to follow.
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Old 03-22-2017, 08:22 PM   #7
hubble71
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

When I look at my original post I see it is hard to follow with out paragraghs.

When you walk into the casino they give you $20 in free chips to play a special game. The game is very Roullette like (looking). It has a Roullette like wheel where you drop eight marbles into and they fall into holes that have numbers beside (1-6). Each marble is then counted to give you a total score. (Highest score would be 48 and the lowest would be 8) and every number in between would/should be possible. When your number total is added up you look on the table to see what it correlates too. Every number has a different result associated with it, some good, and some bad..

The game starts out with the players bet at $10 and the Jackpot at $1000. As you start the game (with the free chips) you don't pay very close attention (big mistake) and you magically get good spins that give you a lot of points early. I was up to 65 points with the initial free chips and the jackpot had doubled to $2000.00. (Took about 10-15 spins).

One of the spins my total was 44 with the 8 marbles and that gave me 50 points towards the jackpot. The dealer said " OH! that was a very good spin for the player, that total happens very rarely, you are very lucky". When at the 65 point mark and out of the free chips if one was to walk away no harm would be done. I kept playing having $400 in my pocket. As the game went on costing $20 a spin and the jackpot at $2000 gives you the hope that you should still make a profit if you get a couple 5 ant 10 point spins to get you closer to the 100point total points required to with the jackpot.

One of the point totals doubled the jackpot but didn't double my bet. (can not remember what point total that was). I remember that the numbers 28-30-and 32 doubled the jackpot but also doubled the bet to keep playing. A couple of the totals give you a blue cherries or red cherries (the dealer covers up that number with a red or blue plackard) and you don't lose your bet. (players bet stays) and if you get 4 red cherries you get a $1000 and if you get/accumulate 4 blue cherries you get $2500. If you happen to roll the number that is already covered with a plackard the player loses his bet.

So when I lost the $400 that I had on me I was at 85points (15points more to win the jackpot that was now at $8000 and it was costing $40. to spin) At this point I was frustrated because I was so close to winning and was out of money. (thinking I could not take full advantage of the lucky 50 point spin I had so early in the game). Talking with the dealer they said they could hold the game for me while I could go get more money to play. (thinking I'm so close to the big payout and I have about $1100 cash back in my room about 15 minutes away that I should continue to play)

I go get my money and continue to play now paying very close attention to the numbers as the dealer adds them up when I roll (he adds very quickly) . I can add numbers very quickly and did not catch him making an error from this point on. The game slows down from this point on and if you get a good result for the player it is a very small number, adding to your total slowly but surely you think you are just one spin away from the jackpot. Along the way if you hit the 28-30-32 number combination that doubles the bet but also doubles the jackpot so you think who cares as long as you win the jackpot the bigger it is the better.

I get to 96 points and I am out of cash. it is costing $160 to spin and the jackpot is at $32,000. Again I am frustrated that I got so close to winning the jackpot and run out of cash. This is when they dealer lets me know that I can run a marker and play on credit if I have a credit card. I reluctantly agree to continue. Neadless to say that in the next couple of spins it goes up to costing $640 a spin and the jackpot is at $128,000(My point total is at 99 only 1 point away from the jackpot) . The dealer informs me that my marker is over $5000 and that I can not continue without settling up.

We run my card for 100,000 Dominican pesos and it is accepted. (about $2100) and when they try to run the remaining balance through the card is declined. I go back to my room frustrated that I was so close, and also a bit nervous that I owe the casino a few thousand dollars. I have the money, in bank accounts at home but hoping that the daily credit limit is what is stopping my card from working. (I have plenty of available room on my credit card).

As I layed in bed thinking how lucky I was to get the big 50 point total so early in the game and then also to get so unlucky to get to 99 points (one point away from the jackpot) and run out of money/credit with the jackpot so huge I start to think it smells of a possible scam. The next morning I go to the lobby of the resort (only place with WIFI) and google roulette like scam in the Domincan and come to the realization that no-one ever gets the jackpot and that it is a SCAM run by professional con artist.

After much communication/customer complaint forms filled in/ with the resort customer service and conversations with the resort manager I get very little satisfaction that anything positive/good will get resolved. I changed my flight and left the country 2 days early, as everything was just felt shady from the casino/resort/ resort staff. My credit card is now cancelled.. I lost the cash and believe the 100,000 peso charge is unrecoverable. I left owing money to the casino. If I felt it was a legitimate game I would gladly pay the money I owe.

I have not quite figured out how the game is a scam (the numbers on the wheel change possibly, magnets in the machine force the balls into specific slots possibly, or the quick adding of the dealer is not correct) or a combination of all three is a possibility.

The game does not have a name but from my research It is know as "8 ball jackpot or Jackpot Roulette or the Scam game."

The resort I stayed at was the Bavaro Princess All Suites Resort, Spa & Casino. The casino is on the Resort at the entrance called Avalon Casino. I CAN NOT EMPHASIZE ENOUGH NOT TO STAY AT THIS RESORT OR GO TO THIS CASINO.
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Old 03-22-2017, 09:40 PM   #8
Didace
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

Quote:
Originally Posted by hubble71 View Post
The payouts are too large for the relative to the amount you can win and compared to the odds of hitting a favorable result. No one ever wins the jackpot.
What are the odds of a favorable result given that no one wins the jackpot?
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Old 03-22-2017, 10:45 PM   #9
Alpha Fish
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

the alarm bells should have gone off in your head once they told you to keep upping the bets to win the jackpot

seen a similar scam quite a few times back in the day, amazing that they are dusting off old tricks at a supposedly popular resort, guess times are tough
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Old 03-22-2017, 11:29 PM   #10
hubble71
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

Yes many alarm bells should have gone off. The main one being that if something seems to good to be true it probably is. There were many other alarm bells that should have gone off. I feel somewhat embarrassed that I fell for this scam...

A favorable result in this game is any that increases your point total (getting you closer to the jackpot) without costing you more money, or running you out of money so you can't continue on to win the jackpot.

The dealers told me many times especially when I had the high point totals that every chance you rolled the marbles onto the wheel that it was a 1 in 5 chance that you would get a positive number to increase your points to claim the jackpot.
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Old 03-23-2017, 01:33 AM   #11
Alpha Fish
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

yeah usually a trick like that is performed at a shadier-looking establishments (or even on the streets), if you haven't seen something like that before it's easy to fall for it especially if alcohol is involved

basically you had no shot, the thing would've keep rolling 28 or whatever the **** it needs to land on to double your bet so eventually you'd be forced to quit even if you had $100M cash on you

pretty sick that they resorted to pretty much straight up robbery I wonder if there are any kind of regulating bodies there that can do anything about it

update: found an old link for you OP apparently they've been pulling this kind of **** at various resorts for years

https://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopi...Province_.html

from link:

Gambling: Many Americans have reported losing large amounts of money at Dominican casinos by playing a game (or variations thereof) known as “Super Keno,” “Caribbean Keno,” “Progressive Keno,” or “Progressive Roulette.” Players have complained that the game’s rules are unclear and/or misleading. Casinos have also been associated with cases involving credit card fraud. Any complaints arising from a casino should be directed to the Office of Casinos at the Secretary of Finance. To register a complaint with this office, call 809-687-5131, ext. 2120

if I were you I'd start by calling your CC fraud dept first and dispute the charges. GL
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Old 03-23-2017, 08:09 AM   #12
Tractor
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

@hubble71: Thank you for the formatting.

This game sounds like a terrible money eater and purely designed to suck you out with the constantly raising bet amounts that are required to "win" this scam jackpot.

The place you played at is a big tourist place, so you most certainly were not the only foreigner to fall for this. This is a 5* star resort, so this scam must be happening on a very high level. I am sorry for your loss but your alarm bells should probably have gone off when the dealer allowed you to hold the table. I doubt he would offer this if he knew that the casino was going to lose.

If you feel that you have been cheated, I strongly suggest to file a charge back through your credit card company, as Alpha Fish already pointed out.

Other than that you could still submit some reviews about this place on the internet to warn others, but this will not get you the money back.

Next time you play, stick to reputable casinos and probably do not risk too much on games you are not familiar with. Especially when playing abroad. Considering the amount you risked, you could have gotten some great deals at online casinos. However, on the internet you got to be very careful with scammers as well. Sometimes it is not easy to spot them at the right time, as you painfully experienced.
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Old 03-23-2017, 09:13 AM   #13
NewOldGuy
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

I did some research and this game is a variation of Razzle Dazzle, a common carnival game scam that has been around for many years.

It doesn't always use a roulette wheel to get the numbers, but the principle is always the same. The game is virtually impossible for a player to win with honest dealing due to the way the sums add up asymmetrically in the house favor, i.e. there are many more losing combinations/sequences than winning. The house edge is close to 100% with no cheating. But the scam is that the dealer deliberately miscounts the sums in the early going to favor the player and make it look easy to win, and you rack up points. He adds up the sums quickly and scoops the balls up, and gives you combinations that lead towards winning. Then when you get close, he just stops doing that and plays it honestly and you stop getting any points. And if you do hit a long shot at that point, he can lie about the sum again and scoop before you can do the calculation yourself. It's hard to see and remember 8 numbers quickly, but the dealer is an expert at it.

Last edited by NewOldGuy; 03-23-2017 at 09:20 AM.
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Old 03-23-2017, 09:37 AM   #14
hubble71
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

I have already filed complaints/with my credit card company and gave many statements and as much detail to them as possible. (as mentioned my credit card is cancelled, getting a new one). I will be very surprised if anything is recovered/comes back to me.

I left a report on Trip Advisor about this resort/Scam in a hope that I can save some body/anybody. (AGAIN DO NOT GO TO BAVARO PRINCESS RESORT, SPA & CASINO. DO NOT PLAY AT AVALON CASINO.)

From my research this scam moves from casino to casino probably leaving when the heat on them gets a little to great etc. Its been around quite a few years, RIU Palace Macao Casino in 2012. Dream Casino in 2015, Casino Diamonte in 2016, and now Avalon Casino in 2017. (all in the Punta Cana region) Found an earlier reference to it at the Playa Chiquita Casino in Sousa in 2001.

My intent to post this experience on twoplustwo was to hopefully get more insight on how the scam is run and to warn as many people as possible. Twoplustwo seems to have the smartest most intelligent gamblers contributing information.

Most articles I have found say the dealer mis-counts the rolls and sucks you in. I still think that may be part of it, but feel that the numbers on the wheel must change, or magnets or something similar forces the balls into the slots that give you undesireable outcomes once you get close to the jackpot 100 point total.

If anyone was able to show me how this game is not a scam I will send the money I owe the casino and gladly pay my debt.
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Old 03-23-2017, 10:05 AM   #15
hubble71
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

Thanx NewOldGuy. I think I get how they pull off the scam now. No mechanical devices necessary. Just pure deception early on, then a quick hand with a little creative math at the end if you were to get lucky.
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Old 03-23-2017, 12:59 PM   #16
_Z_
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

Thanks for the warning, hubble. Sounds like a game perfectly designed to suck people in.

Let us know what happens from here on with the credit card company and casino.
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Old 03-23-2017, 02:10 PM   #17
Didace
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

It's absolutely stunning to me that someone doesn't realize that a casino game is designed to suck you in and take all of your money.
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Old 03-23-2017, 04:56 PM   #18
Alpha Fish
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Re: Jackpot Roullette Scam in The Dominican Republic

yeah I guess it's absolutely stunning that some people gamble for fun

please step off that soapbox, the dude got straight up robbed in a confidence scam, in a first world country the casino would already be shut down with owners lawyering up in a hurry
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