OP: "Actually I already have my RE license, I got it when I turned 19. However, I have never used it as I am not really interested in being a salesperson. I want to be an investor and have the salespeople work for me."

I was trying to engage Mihkel05 who just likes to through out his opinion, as though it has weight and detract from what others say rather than every saying something of substance himself.

But, I have a property doing better than 10x, that is < 10x. I promise you, right now you can get one for $550k at $3200 / month.

The number I choose were both easy and meant to represent the average. Which, in a reasonable area with reasonable choices, they do.

Maybe some people might know more than others and sometimes the best advice isn’t to offer blind encouragement?

This is correct.

OP, you think that the successful investors just buy property and farm out all work. It doesn't work that way. The majority of successful investors do a lot of the work themselves. They have to because you have the management fees will kill your profits if you only have a handful of units, which you will when you get started out. So, get used to getting your hands dirty.

TS is basically correct about everything. Successful investors make their money on the purchase of a property. I realize that real estate is all about the local market, but there really aren't any good deals to be had right now, pretty much anywhere, if you want to buy and hold. I know this because I talk to real estate investors regularly. I have walked into REI meetings and told rooms full of investors that I wanted to buy their houses. Invariably they came back with a bunch of properties that are obscenely overpriced. When I tell them how far apart we are, they look at me like I'm an ******* because I wanted to be able to make money too. That started happening a couple of years ago. I stopped going a year ago, but I hear the story is still the same. It is that way because a million people like yourself watched HGTV and decided it was an awesome way to not have to really work. They were all wrong.

Evictions are a pain. It is not worth the effort of going after someone for backrent. They don't have any money. Few people are successful getting anything out of wage garnishments.

You can minimize them with strict rental guidelines, but you will be doing it yourself. Property managers suck at renting out units. Try calling some of the units you see for rent on craigslist that are obvious property managers. See how long it takes the average one to call you back. That day it takes them to respond is costing you money when they are handling your prop.

I agree with the sentiment of not making big bucks on the rental aspect but if the people you’re hiring to handle rentals are slow or unreliable it’s probably because their compensation is structured poorly. It should be heavily tied to their ability to minimize vacancy and delinquency.

He’s young. I can’t speak for you, but I was a moron at his age.

This is by far the best advice ITT. Economics degrees are ass paper. Get a job or a license as a real estate agent and learn the trade from the ground up. The money you save on not going to school is more than enough for your first down payment.

We've already been over this...
1) I already have an RE license
2) I don't want to be a salesperson
3) I'm not dropping out of school
4) RE agents don't know s*** about RE investing, like literally they're clueless.

Economics isn't worthless, it's better for a business job than a business degree. It's better than finance if you're not going to an Ivy League school. Also, it's what I'm interested in, so that's what I'm going for.

Here's this by the way - http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/...make_bank.html

There's a decent chance that OP will graduate/come into loan-readiness to get his first property just after this economic cycle ends and prices crash again. If so, real estate might not be a bad idea. Although stocks >>>>> real estate in returns from 2009 to now, and without any of the BS or headaches.

The fortunate timing when he's coming out of college might be his best bet at doing quite well out of this - provided he has the right degree for a job in a recession so he can get a loan. Another reason why job prospects matter way more than the cash.

+1 for for the next roaring 20's while I'm in my 20's

Then wtf are you doing here, looking for validation? Do your own thing, fail and then realize 20 years from now the advice given in this thread was correct.

Sales experience would be invaluable if you plan to invest in a market contingent on sales. You could also make a decent amount of money to invest with by doing it. You sound like the kid who wants to run the record company without having produced a record though. "I don't want to be a producer, I want to delegate to producers." Good luck with that one. It doesn't work like that in any industry. No one will listen to some snot nosed 25 year old with no experience. I predict 15 years of hard life lessons based the attitude you seem to have.
It's totally, utterly, and completely useless in the real world.

No business degree is worth anything beyond the skills it teaches you. Unless your degree is STEM or an MBA/Masters from an Ivy League or close to it, it doesn't mean **** to employers. It's basically a 4 year aptitude test. The only people who think otherwise are people who haven't finished their degree yet and have no real world job experience (read-you).



I can find 3 dozen articles on why 3 dozen degrees are awesome. Some of those articles were probably sanctioned by school marketers to get people to take degrees no one is taking. The only thing that matters to company owners is how well you do what you're told, and how much money you make them. You can do that with or without a degree. The only job you actually, practically need a degree for is STEM. Social sciences is literally flushing money down the toilet, especially if you plan on pursuing a do-it-yourself career, which is what you should do, because working for other people 1) sucks 2) is an idiotic way to spend your life.

EDIT: Read the article. Whoopeee, after 20 years you'll make an average of $95k/yr. Calculate compound interest on the amount of money you make at RE sales and then RE investing by dropping out of school now and starting working on your career immediately (or better yet stay in school and bin RE altogether and do actual investing like TS suggested) and you'll be making $95k a month in 20 years. But nah, you're too smart for that.

His job prospects out of school will be the same regardless of where he gets his degree. He'll be just another entry level social science major and probably have to get a job in a totally unrelated field such as barista-ing. Doing anything but spending the next 6 years working in the real estate field in some capacity and saving up enough capital to begin investing is silly, given his stated goals.

Economics grads aren't in the same category as a typical social science major. Their earnings alone shows you that. If he was doing a social science major, then sure, I agree.

The average salary alone of RE agents is far below econ majors (as is the 90th percentile), which makes it seem silly to tell him to go into a lower paying dead end job he dislikes.

Economics is a social science.

Are you talking about entry level graduates or people with 10+ years experience? If he can even find a job, he'll be on par with the average RE sales salary right away (~$40k), and he doesn't need to spend $50k and 2+ years of his life to do it.

Eventually you hate any job, that's the truth. May as well max out potential capital accrual instead of spending money on a degree he won't even use long term. He might pick up some real world experience and people skills and market pulsations in his industry of choice as well, which is way more important toward being a self-employed person than a degree. Maybe his parents would even agree to defer to him some money in lieu of school, although I suspect he's been living off their dime and one of the stipulations is that he finishes his degree (typical of boomers).

OP do you have a plan socially at X? Are you an extroverted person? I would just think that entering into established relationships two years in would be difficult.

Economics is business school with a side of math and a side of philosophy. It was my major, and if you absolutely must major in business economics or accounting is the way to go.

It's technically a social science, but does anyone really think that economists are as credible as even psychologists? Please. The whole discipline is based on pillars that are fundamentally flawed at a deep level. There's some promise in the behavior econ stuff, and big data sets are coming that will revolutionize the field, but the content I was taught in undergrad from 2010-2014 was 94% bull****.

The real thing that economics gives you is business school + math + some framework for looking at the world. You get to take the accounting courses that matter, the computer science courses that matter, learn how to work with excel at a medium-high level, and how to lie with math. All of these skills have real financial value. Combining them is even better. Add in a background in sales, investing, and poker and you get me. I think the econ bit is the weakest part of the whole package, but reasonable people might disagree.

Kind of, I'm a little worried but I don't think it will be a real problem. I plan on joining a few clubs and finding other stuff to do around campus (like volunteering) to meet people. Greek life isn't allowed so I actually think that will make it easier to fit in. I will say I'm mostly extroverted and it's killing me right now bc my friends that go to NKU literally do nothing almost ever. Then I'm watching everyone I know at UK partying 24/7 on SC and it makes me jealous.

I'm not as worried about not meeting people at X as I am at NKU. I've already taken classes there and no one seems to do much. So, it makes me feel like going to NKU will be much harder socially.

I wish I would have went away somewhere and dormed....

Yeah, I'm sure in 20 years I'll look back and think, "you know dropping out was really promising". Go back and read the thread. I've already explained that my education is a free roll. I'm not pissing away a free education that I'm already half way through plus living expenses to get a job doing something that I already know I don't want to do. I don't get to take my college fund if I drop out so why would I give up $15K plus living expenses over the next two years? That's about $45K only a total moron would give up $45K at age 20 in my position. Plus, guess who's not going to get their home put into their name if they don't graduate college? Me, you'd know this if you read the thread. So genius, do you think it makes good financial sense to throw away $200K?

I will make more money with a career job than selling real estate.

Literally no degree is worth anything beyond the skills it teaches you. You can't be an accountant without learning accounting skills while getting a degree in accounting. Replace *accounting* with every other degree.

Your statement here is so dumb it's sad. Go try to get a teaching job without a teaching degree, etc. Also, I've never heard of an IBanker with a biology degree. Please go get an undergrad in bio and interview with Goldman if it's so much superior.

Ohhh, I see, it's all a big conspiracy by the not for profit schools.

No, no you can't. You can't be an accountant without a degree. You can't be a lawyer without a degree.

An idiotic way to spend your life is doing something you don't want to do. Lots of people that work for other people actually enjoy what they do.

10 year average salary of an econ major is $126K.

I already do go read the thread.

Both schools offer economics degrees as social science degrees or business degrees. Either school I would be taking classes in the business college, getting a degree from the business college.

No, there's not a chance in hell my parents would give me any money if I'm not in school.

Wow, not sure how you picked up on this since I only mentioned it ITT about a dozen times by now.

Again you have to be careful when looking at averages. It doesn’t require a vast conspiracy for them to be incentivized to pick people who will beef up their stats which will obscure the value the school itself is providing.

Econ majors are a diverse bunch and it along with business degrees tend to attract people being groomed to run their parents businesses and/or will have people willing to mentor them because of close relationships. If you don’t have that and you’re not focussed on working towards specific skills you’ll likely end up in the lower percentiles.

Property appraisals is a tangible skill that requires not much of an investment in coursework that relates to re investing. Look into what courses you’d need to do that locally. Not sure how it works where you are but in Ontario it’s the defacto first step towards more complex appraisals of businesses, reserve fund management and a bunch of other professional designations that banks have an ongoing need for.

If you wake up you will. There is literally no point to being in school if you want to be a real estate investor. You will waste time and money doing something not related to your dream. Anything you're learning in your ass paper degree can easily be learned on google for free.

Until you realize that living your dream has almost nothing to do with what you want to do, you'll never be closer to it. There are tons of things successful people do that they don't want to do, but they do because they realize they are necessary. In fact, I would say the major difference between successful and unsuccessful people is that the successful ones consistently do what they don't feel like doing.

I don't know you, but based on your posts you are bad socially, and you have serious personality flaws that will hamper your progress towards your dream. You are judgmental, arrogant, and entitled. You need to rid yourself of these personality flaws if you expect to succeed.

Ya I don't even know what to say to this paragraph. The level of entitlement and condescension is kind of disgusting. I'm actually starting to just hope you fail.

Not at first you won't. Besides, I thought your ultimate goal was to buy and sell real estate? Now you want a career job? You should probably figure out exactly what you want before you ask for advice.


What I'm saying is that what you will be doing in a real world job is very seldom related to what you did getting your degree. Anyone can learn what entry level accountants do without putting in 4 years getting an accounting degree. The only thing worthwhile about a degree is any practical skills training you receive---computer programming, software training,etc. You get a lot of this training in STEM, and very little in social sciences.





This has to do with laws, not with the skill development one acquires through school. Anyone can be an entry level accountant or document filer. You don't need a degree to do what you'll be doing when you're working. You need to pass the 4 year aptitude test to prove you're able to work. That's it. And you're spending 40k+ a year on it, even though you intend not to use it long term. Congratulations, that's ******ed.

In order to be successful you have to do way more things you don't want to do than things you do. Until you learn this simple lesson, you're screwed.

https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/6...67/?highlight=

Yeah, you definitely seem like someone that should be calling me entitled, condescending, arrogant, and the best one of all...."bad socially". Lmao literally read what you wrote. Those are your words and then tell me I'm arrogant or make comments on my social aptitude.


https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/3...95/?highlight=

Also, this is your idea a good investment? You think I should take investment advice from you? Yeah, let's buy oil in June 2017. Don't give investment advice to people that are better at investing than you. Is that arrogant for me to say?

Do you want to know when the time to buy oil was? It was Q1 2016, 18 year old me was smart enough to buy when crude was $28 and gas was $1.50/gallon. Every petro company was severly undervalued and it's why my position is up 68.xx% today.

I don't need life advice from the creepy dude that can't talk to women. And I certainly don't need investment advice from the creepy dude that thinks buying crude in a glut at $48 a year and a half off the low is solid.

Stop s*** posting ITT, everyone else has contributed meaningful advice.

lmao this is what I come to the Internet for

My two cents, there's really zero chance that you know what you're really meant to do at age 20, or that you'd stick with that occupation the rest of your life. Some have gotten lucky and found this calling early but they are the exception, and a product of a different era (Buffett, Ray Dalio come to mind as teenage investors 50-70 years ago). But even they went to university. Graduate school even. People change careers so often these days, and careers themselves are changing (jobs such as "social media coordinator" didn't exist 10 years ago, there are thousands of other similar examples). I don't think you are, but planning your life with the belief that you will only be doing real estate investing without contingency plans would be a really bad idea.

The post-secondary system has so many flaws and faults, but until we create something better it's still realistically the best choice for an above-average intellect to start your adult life. If (when?) you bounce out of real estate into something different/better-suited, you will benefit from the piece of paper. I care less about credentials than almost anyone when considering hiring/partnerships, but even I have had to accept that there is a strong correlation between where someone went for their degree and their aptitude/skill level, and even moreso if they didn't go to university at all. That is of course a correlation rather than causation, "not all students are like that", but people typically don't have time to get to know you extensively before hiring you or partnering in business with you. They will, unjustly perhaps, use your educational history as a primary heuristic they use to determine your value in a business relationship, and that will be the case until you achieve profound business accomplishments on your own which generally takes 10-15 years or more.

Whoever said economics is a waste of time is being frankly moronic. I have used economics principles I learned in undergrad nearly every day of my life. It was by far the most practical major I could have chosen. It's the most common major among business leaders. Then again some people just don't have the innate ability to develop economic intuition and perhaps for them studying economics is pointless.

Having said that, if I were to do it all over again I'd try hard to do a dual major with Comp Sci. The economy is migrating online so if you are entrepreneurial and don't need to hire a programmer you have a huge, huge edge. The large fortunes of our generation have been created disproportionately by people with a combination of computer engineering and entrepreneurial skills.

Difference between NKU/X on your long-term success will be negligible. The experience might be worth the +$$ but only you can answer that. In retrospect, my college experience sucked, mostly because I was hyper-focused on preparing for graduate school (and commuting daily). If you plan on being really busy, I'd question how much of the X value you'd be able to extract.