I mine but, not seriously. I've been mining eth but I think I'm going to switch to zcash.

I think nvidia 1060 is a cheap and efficient card but the market changes

Hey all. I posted related questions and would like some input on this.


1. If you want to invest in altcoins and daytrade, having an account at an exchange is 100 percent necessary right? I used shapeshift to get other altcoins with my btc but it was mainly to hold it. I did this because i heard shapeshift was very easy to use and you did not need to create an account at an exchange. Also bittrex should be the main exchange account one uses? What are other good ones? I heard hitbtc is good as well?


2. I posted this question and got response but this still confuses me. I look at coinmarketcap for the coin and prices. Lets use lisk for example. Lets just make it simple and say its 5 dollars a coin. If you buy 1000 lisk, you pay 5000 dollars plus the fees but lets just make it 5000 flat to make it simple. If you were to buy it when looking at bittrex, you would do a buy order of 1000 shares. But when you do this, you have to put 5 dollars in btc terms. Why do they do this? Why can't you trade altcoins against usd? Also let say your plan is to sell it once it hit 6 dollars so you can net 1k profit. When the coin hits 6 dollars, you sell it. But when you do, you get 6k worth of btc at that time right? So you have 1000 dollars profit. So if you want to lock in your profit immediately... do you immediately send that 1k worth of btc to gdax or gemini and then cashout to your bank account? I was told gdax or gemini is best to cash out bitcoin for usd to bank account.


3. When you want to buy 1000 lisk, i notice on bittrex there is a very good chance you cannot get 1000 lisk from one buyer. So say you want to buy 1000 lisk at 5 dollars. Say lisk is at 5.10 now. You would do a sell order right if you want it to automatically buy it at 5 dollars? But when you do this, when you buy 1000 shares, isn't there a very good chance your 1000 shares could be bought at 5 different prices or even more? Or let say the price of lisk is around 5 dollars and one seller is selling only 10 shares of it. The next seller is selling at 5.01 and selling 50 shares. Let say you look at bittrex and the offers and in order for you to buy 1000 shares, it probably would be through 10 sellers. So if you want to buy lisk now and want 1000 shares, you are obviously not manually buying 10 shares of one user, 50 of another at different prices right? Thus you just put say 1000 shares of 5.05 etc so its faster? The other thing is im not 100 percent sure about is when you want to buy 1000 shares at 5 dollars... lets say the price is around that market. If there are lisk being sold at 4.95 for example, if you put 5 dollars, bittrex will automatically buy the first lisk shares offered at below 5 dollars first before it hits 5 dollars right? I ask this because it would be easier to calculate profit/loss if you get all 1000 shares at the same price and not 1000 shares at 10 different prices.



4. Related question. But when lisk is at 5 dollars and you buy 1000 shares of it. Does it matter what btc price is at the moment related to altcoins or not? The confusing thing to me is say you want to do a buy order of 1000 shares of lisk at 5 dollars. Let say price is 6 dollars at the moment. So you put buy order of 5 dollars at 0.xxxxxx btc since that is 5 dollars. So if the moment lisk does hit 5 dollars... that would not be the same price on btc as btc price changes all the time. If thats the case wouldn't that mean the 0.xxxxxx btc price which you put as 5 dollars could possible be 3.50 or 8 dollars etc? Thus you wanted to buy 1000 shares of lisk at 5 dollars... but when the order goes through, lisk could be 3.50 or 8 dollars? Or is my logic wrong here? Because im talking about a buy order where it buys for you only if it hits that certain price. The other thing that is confusing here is say you do that order but lisk is not near 5 dollars. You cancel it. Then do it again. And say you put 5 dollars again. Now wouldn't that btc amount you put be different than the btc amount you put earlier before you cancelled it? The same with selling. You might put down sell lisk if it hits 6 dollars. But does it sell when lisk hits 6 dollars on coinmarketcap... or when that 0.xxxxxx btc amount hits 6 dollars? Because isn't it possible even if lisk price stays the same as 5 dollars when you buy it... the 0.xxxxxx btc selling price you put down hits 6 dollars due to btc going up or down?

5. Does gdax or gemini send you a 1099 or paperwork? I ask this because a while back someone who told me they use coinbase which is basically gdax...am i correct here?... send thim a 1099 or related document and it showed like 100k in profit but he said he made only 20k in profit. He said coinbase reported any transfers he made from coinbase to another site or his wallet and vice versa and said that was ridiculous and he had to contact them about it. Thus transfers according to coinbase showed as profit. Did anyone here have this issue? And the other thing is do they send paperwork to the irs etc? The reason i ask this is because let say in my example, you buy 1000 lisk at 5 dollars and sold it at 6 dollars. You here have a 1k profit. So here you send 1k worth of btc to gdax or gemini. Then cashout to your bank account. So would gdax/gemini record this as 1k in profit? Because this wouldn't make sense because let say you got 10 btc you bough at 3k but you did not buy it at gdax or gemini. You then sell it at 5k at gdax/gemini. Well here you made 20k profit. But if you transfer that whole 50k to your bank account.. would gdax/gemini report that as 50k? Because you can obviously prove you bought 10 btc at 3k each for 30000 and then sold it for 5k each for 50000. But if gdax/gemini shows 50k,.. do they? And if so, wouldn't everyone have to report that their 1099 from gdax or gemini is incorrect? Because if they do report to the irs which i believe they do, then isn't everyones 1099 going to be incorrect unless someone only sends the profit only to gdax/gemini? And which is the preferred place to cash out? Gdax or gemini or is it something else?


6. Same question... does bittrex do it or not? Because you are trading btc with altcoins but also could do btc with usdt etc which i heard requires documentation. But if you are trading with btc and altcoins only, do they send information to irs etc? Because woudn't they like gdax/gemini report it wrong because if you bought btc a long time ago etc and trade it with something else, they assume all your btc is profit? Thus if you trade 10 btc total with altcoins, they could say you have 10btc worth of transactions?


7. I know trading altcoins for btc there is capital gain or losses etc even if its not done with usd. Now i like to know how to calculate this in my example. Say you bought 1000 shares of lisk at 5 dollars. You sell them at 6 dollars. So here you have 1k profit less fees but lets just make it flat 1k. Unless you sell that 1k worth of btc immediately to gdax/coinbase, well you have 1k profit from selling lisk right no matter what? But let say you do not cash that profit out to your bank account. You still have to report 1k profit from lisk. But now let say btc dropped 10 percent. Then you cash out around 1k worth of btc to your bank account. Here... you have 1k capital gain on selling lisk. But you have a loss of like 500 dollars assuming say btc is 5000 dollars when you got the btc from selling lisk and it hits 4500 right? Thus if you want to lock in your profit, you have to immediately send that amount of worth of btc profit which is around 1k to gdax/gemini to lock that profit in? Otherwise if you wait and btc goes down... well that 1k profit you made from lisk is going to be offset by that 1k loss in btc drop? This is what makes me wonder why everything is not done with usd. Because if it is, then its very easy to calculate profit/loss etc.

Anyone think that NEO is going to get a good boost due to the icos coming up?

1. Yes.
Exchanges are the place to be, Bittrex, Bitfinex, Binance etc...

2. BTC is the main pair for coins.
Some exchanges also pair some coins to USD.
Yes you should convert BTC to USD in someway.

3. This is how exchanges work.
You create a buy order, either the simple way, best price or with a limit buy order, stop/losses etc... Read up on how this works.

4. Given that BTC is the main pair for most coins you want to look at Satoshis.
Pure USD value is not super relevant given you are trading against BTC.
Try to skip the whole USD value and start trading in satoshis.

5. I dont know, im not US based.

6. I dont know, afaik USDT is created because some exchanges cannot offer USD pairs due to licences.

7. In the Netherlands is very simple, once a year you fill in the worth of your portfolio and pay some taxes (1.2%), you do this each year.
Yes this is a snapshot moment at that given time.

Profit/loss is still easy to calculate you just need to translate it to satoshis.
You convert x USD to BTC, this gives you x Satoshi, you then trade and end up with x Satoshi, now compare the two and set if off vs. current BTC price.

ico on NEO is relevant yes, but NEO really would boost if China is done regulating.
To much uncertainty around all china based coins at the moment.

if the trade-off for security is slow transaction times in bitcoin, how unsecure are these coins which have less than 1 minute transaction times? Some even have less than 20 seconds times. is this a real worry within the alt community?

its not a security trade-off, how did you came to that conclusion?

Simple explanation for slow transactions:
Miners can choose which transactions they include in their block, so small transactions with low(er) fees tend to be low on the list to get picked up.

Seems like lots of NEO hype going on.

NEO released Chinese poetry promising wonderful adventures in 3 days. Cue the FOMO!

I am excite

Okay thanks for that information.


Anyone from the US can answer my other questions? Such as does coinbase/gdax, gemini, bittrex send you a 1099 or w2 etc? And if so, do they send you the amount you cashed out total to your bank account or what? Because if its the total amount you cash to your bank account, then it would seem like everyones 1099 is going to be wrong because you could have 30k in withdraw from gdax or gemini to your bank account and only 2k is profit etc.


I would think this would be like if you play live poker tournaments which i dont play and say have 50k in w2s from poker tournaments... but after buyins, you could be down money or up very little. Because if you put down say your total profit was only 5k in live poker tournaments but w2s show 50k... well it obviously does not include your total buyins.


So im wondering if gdax/coinbase/gemini/bittrex would do something like this because someone on another forum told me he got a 100k w2 from coinbase a while back and only had 20k profit and told me the reason it showed 100k was because it recorded every transfer from coinbase to another site and vice versa. Im not sure how he fixed the situation but he said he had to contact coinbase and maybe his accountant or so. So to anyone that trades bitcoin and altcoins, did you receive any 1099 or w2 from them? And if so, is the amount they put down the total withdraws to your bank account? Because the thing is that amount is not relevant since you obviously acquired the btc or altcoin for a price.

Agent Smith (BTC) getting rekt right now

Anyone familiar and going to invest in Nitro (www.nitro.live)? Pre-sale start in few hours.

hey josh. update on your last month or so? did you stop clicking buttons?

Can any trader or someone who does trades quite a bit answer this?

Pretty much, I reduced my amount on metal to an amnt im more comfortable with and have just been holding. Still well below my initial investment thanks to my metal losses, and will likely never make back those losses in terms of BTC, but it is what it is. Now i just hold and see what happens. I'm not putting any more cash in crypto but I'm also not cashing out anything unless I win big.

I still struggle with ignoring the hindsight of if I just put my money in ETH and BTC blindly at the beginning and forgot about it I'd be fine. This weighs on me a lot of I'm being honest. I believe I over estimated my risk tolerance, as the losses had consumed my life even though they really shouldn't. But I try to stay positive and realize there is still money to be made if I maintain a decent size of my portfolio in BTC+ETH (aim for 50%, reallocate alts to meet this goal every few months or so as necessary).

Hey all i posted this on another forum and i got a few response where im confused and would like someone to explain it to me.



I am planning to use bittrex to trade altcoins. I would first get bitcoin first as i need btc to buy altcoins.

So i have a question on this and want to know if im doing it right.

Let say I have $10000 in btc.

Btc = 7837.34 usd now

1.28 btc = 10000 usd


I send that 1.28 btc to bittrex. Lets just make it simple and say i want to buy lisk and its worth $5. I know its much more than that now but i like to make it simple. Let say i want to buy 1000 lisk so $5000 plus fees. I know bittrex fees are 0.25%. So that means buying 1000 lisk would cost me $5000 + $12.50 = $5012.50. This is correct right? So basically now my bittrex btc balance is around half which is 0.64 btc? To make it simple i ignored the sending btc fee to bittrex.


So let say my goal is to sell it once i make 20 percent profit. Thus i want to sell it once lisk hits 6 dollars. Say lisk hits 6 dollars. I then sell all of it for $6000 - $15 = $5985. So in this situation I made $5985 - $5012.50 = $972.50. Is that correct or not?


So once I sell the lisk on bittrex, I'm getting back btc right since lisk is paired with btc and most altcoins are not paired with usd or usdt as they put it? So here is what confuses me. At that moment i will get paid whatever amount btc = $5985 right? However... isn't it a good chance that i might not get more than 0.64 btc that i originally used to buy lisk assuming btc price went up as well? Like for example at that moment i bought lisk with my btc... $5012.50 is about 0.64 btc at that moment. But now... when i trade $5985 worth of lisk for btc... couldn't i get even less than 0.64 btc? Thus even though i made a profit of $972.50 in my example buying lisk and then selling lisk... i might get back 0.60 btc only and now my btc balance is only 0.64 btc +0.60 btc = 1.24 btc? Or is there something wrong with what im calculating here? I do know when you are investing in altcoins, you are basically betting against bitcoin. But here in my example, well you need btc in order to buy altcoins almost all the time since theres maybe 10 coins that are paired against usd or usdt?


And if my calculation is wrong, can someone tell me where is my calculation wrong?


Because i believe the profit i calculated is right here. And if it is right, how do i make sure to lock in these profits? I know you realized $972.50 in profit here. But say you dont sell the $972.50 worth of btc now... and wait... well btc price drops... that $972.50 profit could only be $800 or less etc right? Or is my logic wrong here? I want to know from daytraders on this as i know daytraders mostly buy low and sell high and make lot of these transactions. Thus if your goal for lisk is 20 percent profit of 5000 dollars invested and your goal is to make about 1000 dollars on buying lisk minus the buy/sell fees of 27.50 for a total profit of $972.50... are you suppose to immediately send that exact profit $972.50 worth of btc OR WOULD IT BE THE BTC DIFFERENCE between the 1.28 btc you started with and what you have now... and then send it immediately to gdax or gemini and sell it to them and then you lock that $972.50 in profit immediately to your bank account?


The thing is if everything was paired with USD, then it would be very easy to calculate/profits and losses. I know bittrex has usdt but that is only paired with btc and not many other coins. So the other thing is would daytraders instead of sending it to gdax or gemini... they immediately turn that btc into USDT? That way their profits are locked since you have usdt? I know usdt is around 1 dollar but it cannot be a little less or more. But i read its still an altcoin. So i want to know exactly how daytraders lock in their profit after they lock in their profit from one coin. And most importantly, is it even possible to have a lesser btc balance after buying lisk at 5 dollars and selling it at 6 dollars depending on the btc price. Because this is very confusing to me.

These are the responses i got back and like to know what your comments are and if all of them are incorrect. I'm pretty sure the 2nd comment on me calculating it wrong is incorrect.


The deposit part is okay, the buying lisk part is also okay. Getting the profit and conversations are true. After you sell them for $6 each, you will have your balance as BTC, because there is no LISK/USDT market on bittrex. This means, you may make profit in terms of USDT, but you may be in the loss in terms of BTC if BTC price went up while you're trading it.


I can tell you right off the bat that you made a serious calculation error in saying that once you buy LISK, your account will only be worth 64% or whatever. This makes literally no sense. I think you misplaced the decimal in the fee structure by 1 or 2 zeroes. Bittrex fee is 0.25% not 2.5% or 25%. Fees are hardly relevant in daytrading cryptocurrencies because the swings are so high to begin with that they are rather negligible. If you can't even beat the fees then chances are you shouldn't be trying to day trade crypto to begin with.


The problem is here:

"Thus i want to sell it once lisk hits 6 dollars"

You do not get to sell your lisk for dollars. You sell it for BTC. When you put in your sell order you do not enter dollars, only BTC.

So in your example with BTC = $7838, then $6 is 0.0007656 BTC. You could sell when lisk hits 0.0007656 BTC. Of course by that time then BTC could go up or down and 0.0007656 BTC is no longer worth $6, it could be $5 or $8. Its a moving target when trying to compare BTC and Dollars.



With altcoins your mindset needs to change from thinking in dollars to only thinking in Bitcoin. Everything is measured against Bitcoin. You never want to sell your lisk for less BTC than you purchased it for otherwise it would have been better to just hold your BTC rather than trade.



The USD price is there purely as a reference. Use it or don't. [/B]


If Bitcoin drops then it makes altcoins look much more attractive.

Again, you need to stop converting everything to USD, work in BTC. Trade your BTC for lisk at .0007BTC and sell when they are at .0008BTC. Don't worry about the dollar, fiat is irrelevant to trading altcoins for bitcoins. Fiat only comes into play when you cash out/in for BTC.

This is a hard concept to grasp but you need to forget the dollar, think in bitcoin. Otherwise you will always be trading at a loss and will be broke very quickly.

So basically they are telling me...

But you are telling me its possible to lose money if you invested in a coin like lisk where you bought 1000 shares at 5 dollars or lets just say 0.0007 btc. Then when the price hits 6 dollars... lets just say 6 dollars is now 0.00065 btc. Then you sell it for btc. So here, moneywise you should be up 1000 dollars minus fees. But you get back less btc than you started with.

So here, this is NOT what you want to do?

However, you do make around 1k profit minus fees though right since even though you receive less btc than you invested even though the price went up, well that 0.00065 btc is worth more than the 0.0007 btc that you initially used to buy lisk?


So in this example, you can't lock in any profits and send money to your bank account to lock in the 1k minus trading fees? Because i thought you would transfer whatever btc amount is around 1k to lock in your profits? Or it does not work this way?

Yes this concept is confusing. Because here... when you invest in altcoins and it goes up... you need bitcoin to either stay at same price or go lower in order for you to get more bitcoin right? However, what if you already are holding bitcoin that you don't touch etc and want to invest in altcoins. Because i obviously do not want bitcoin to go down because i have a lot more money in bitcoin than investing in altcoin.

So do daytraders either daytrade bitcoin/eth/litecoin because they can deal with usd only? Or they only trade altcoins and don't own bitcoin because if bitcoin goes up, then they lose bitcoin if altcoins go up etc assuming bitcoin goes up enough?


Would like if any daytraders can explain this to me. I do understand how if a coin goes up from 5 to 6 dollars and you sell it, you get less btc than you originally used to buy lisk. But even though you have less btc than you started with... well that less btc is worth more btc than you started with right? Now the other thing is what happens if btc price goes down etc? That means btc could go down and altcoin could go down... then you dont lose much btc? But if btc goes down and altcoin go up, not only do you get more profit, you gain more btc? However, the issue is most daytraders do still own btc that they hold right? But right now im looking at profits that you can lock in to cash to your bank account etc. And the replies i got back seem to say dont' look at usd price at all. I could understand this a bit if you are planning to just keep holding btc... but if you are doing this for daytrading profits, does you getting less btc because btc went up matter or not? I thought it did not unless you just plan to hold btc etc.

yes pauly , if you want to "lock in" a profit you would want to quickly (within a few hours) exchange BTC into a more stable currency like USD or possibly USDT. This will incur some small fees. Many investors/ traders have some faith that the BTC price, although volatile, will tend to go up in the long run so they don't bother with conversion to USD.

Pauly it'd make a lot more sense to you if you just replace the word "Bitcoin" with "Euro" in all of your questions/examples.

You live in America, but you hear that the "Euro" is doing really well and the price is going up. If you want, you can use your US dollars to try to "trade" Euros. Now you have Euros and you hear that Yen is doing even better than Euros. You sell your Euros for Yen. The price of Yen then fluctuates. The price of US dollars then fluctuate. If you're not careful, US dollars can go WAYYyYyY up while you still hold Yen. Even if the Yen goes up a little bit, you've lost money by not holding US dollars the whole time.

When you have 3 different currencies/commodities/things playing against each other, it's very tricky calculate and lock in profits. If you don't even understand how it works you're far from ready to be dabbling in extra currencies/alt coins. Stick to a pair that you understand.

gogoog ETH

Pokerlogist... that is not what other posters are telling me in another forum.


They said in my example...


Assuming i buy lisk at 5 dollars and buy 1000 of them. Let say the 5 dollar in btc price is 0.0007 btc at that moment. When i notice lisk is 6 dollars, i then sell the lisk. I do know when you sell lisk on an exchange... that you are suppose to put the sell price in btc and not in usd. So assuming you dont do those orders where it automatically sells your lisk at 0.xxxxx btc or 6 dollars at that moment and just watch the market and then when it hits 6 dollars... you go and sell it. Then you notice around that time btc went up.


So here let say when you sell 1000 lisk at 6 dollars each ... let say 6 dollars is worth 0.00065 btc only. So here... you would actually get back less btc than you started with. This is what the other posters on another forum kept mentioning to me. You are losing money here because you are getting less btc than you invested. The only thing that makes sense here is... yes i do get less btc than i started with. However because the price of btc went up a lot... well when you multiply that by amount of btc i get back after the sale... its usd value should be about 1k less fees... am i correct on this or not? Because i mentioned this few times and few posters kept telling me no... if you get back less btc... you are losing money.


So are those posters wrong or not on this issue? Or maybe they didnt understand what i meant? Because they say you lose because had you kept the bitcoin and not traded it for lisk... you would have made more money by just holding that btc as oppose to using it to buy lisk assuming btc goes up a higher percentage than lisk during that period. The thing is did that person assume im selling my btc for lisk? The thing is i planned to use usd to buy specific amount of btc SOLELY to buy those altcoins. And even if i sold my original btc for lisk and btc goes higher percentage than lisk but lisk goes up, well isn't there profit when you sell the lisk on bittrex for btc?


When i mention lock in profits... i meant lock in profits on that sell of lisk at 6 dollars. Thus i spent 5k plus fees to buy lisk. I would get back around 6k less fees. So lets say when i get back btc for the sale... lets just say my profit is 972.50 or so after fees. Well here... is my profit here 972.50 assuming i send around 972.50 worth of btc to gemini or gdax or even trade it on bittrex for usd or usdt?


You say many investors tend to believe in btc and just don't bother converting to usd. Well... if they want some profits from daytrading to hit their bank accounts, wouldn't they need to immediately sell it to gemini/gdax or use bittrex to convert that to usd or usdt then?


So basically those posters were incorrect in what they mentioned to me? Because based on what they said... that would mean if you buy lisk at 5 dollars and it doubles to say 10 dollars... BUT if bitcoin goes from 7k to 21k... you lose money because lisk only doubled whereas bitcoin tripled. I would figure if this happened... well you obviously get much less btc but because of the higher btc price... well your profit should still be like how i calculated right? Because the way they phrased it, i mean if btc goes up, and even if your altcoin goes up, you can lose money which makes no sense at all. Well the issue here is almost all altcoins are paired with btc and not usd. I do not understand why altcoins are not paired with usd.