it's the opposite.

Consensus is 1st round is equal to 2nd round, or maybe very slightly easier to get into. 3rd round is next to impossible unless you won the Nobel Peace Prize. Tbh I'm not sure why they even have different rounds in the first place.

I guess to split up the volume of applications? And I don't know if that makes me happy or depressed that i sailed through the 3rd stage for the top MBA program here last year (i didn't take it)

You can't apply to the same school in a different round. You have to wait till next year.

bumping this thread for Round 2 applicants.

my update is: got rejected in round 1 by Kellogg, Chicago, Wharton, and MIT. Only interview was at Kellogg where the interview is almost automatic. I wasn't exactly surprised by my rejections -- there was always a pretty large part of me that thought that MBA admissions committees are essentially risk-averse and wouldn't accept me because I'm not a consultant/ibanker/nonprofit worker. (you can see my history in this thread) It made me rethink what I wanted out of an MBA. After talking with friends at top 5 programs, I'm even more of the opinion that 99% of the value of a traditional MBA program is in getting admitted.


Anyway, that led me to Acton, so I applied and got accepted today, and will be going there in August. Pretty excited about it.

Acton actually adds value, is free-ish, and tries to help you get on a path to being both rich and happy. I'm honestly really glad I didn't get accepted to those other programs.

Congrats and glad you're happy. 99% thing sounds true.

Yeah and that's really what struck me about Acton -- it was the only MBA program that I truly felt adds legit value in the classroom. going to Acton is probably riskier -- which I don't like as I'm very risk-averse -- but you'll never take the risk out of entrepreneurship completely.

LozColbert, could your rejections be due in large part to your quant scores? Don't get me wrong--your GMAT is very respectable, but from my understanding, quant plays a much more significant role at finance focused schools like Booth and Wharton. Your credentials, although less than traditional IMO, are actually rather impressive, and far more dynamic than most I've met.

I should mention that I'm not pursuing an MBA for a few years, and my knowledge of this topic is considerably less than yours. I'm finishing up my 1st year at an IB.

You could be right, but i think my quant score is right at the 80% threshold that they care about. I'd think that passing CFA level 1 and both levels of the CAIA would minimize any concerns. Also, a poker student of mine, who is in his final year of a math PhD at one of the best universities in the world, wrote one of my recommendations praising my ability to teach him poker and directly relating that to my quant and logic skills.

Just got waitlisted at Booth. Kinda pissed but keeping my hopes up. Already been rejected from Columbia (without interview), waiting on NYU decision post interview. If I go 0-fer with my profile I will be furious.

What do you mean by that? Surely there must have been something in your application that was keeping you out (undergrad, work experience, recommendations, etc).

Sorry, realized I shouldn't have written that

was just having a bit of fun; i figured if you can dish it you can take it.

hope you get in off the waitlist. quite a few of my friends eventually got in off of waitlists, i think the key is to make the AdComs know that you really want to be there. and if you decide traditional MBA programs aren't worth it like I did, I think Acton's round 3 hasn't passed yet

god, reading this thread is scaring me. i am taking the gmat next tuesday and expect to do pretty well but even if i get 720+ (my practice tests so far have been 7+) i have no job experience (been a poker bum for 3 years since i graduated) and just really don't know what to expect. i went to a good school (williams) but didn't have a great gpa. it just seems even w decent/good credentials i still won't really have any idea of what level of schools to focus on or try and get into. anybody else in here planning for '12?

I'm not an expert but I can see the poker thing going both ways. If you've had any significant accomplishments in the game though, I'd play it up to differentiate yourself (note: if I ultimately don't get in I think this would be the reason). Schools love to accept unique applicants. Just make sure that you also "fit in" in the sense that they know you'll be able to handle the rigorous academics.

are you sure it will be good to go though? even if you get in getting a job w/out experience will be tough. yet on other hand you don't want to get job now that's paying like 50k. maybe do something volunteer or internship oriented in your field, kiva fellows?

yea, hopefully i can weave a nice narrative out of poker. i don't have any splashy achievements (i.e. don't play donkaments) but have been a pro for 4 years now and made a decent amount of money

i do think that it will be good to go. i mean, if i could get into a top 10 school and then can't get a job idk i think i'd just give up at that point lol. the problem i have right now is i am basically treated as persona non grata by all of the banks that i have talked to and interviewed with over the past year and a half. i can't apply for any internships and i can't apply to any first year analyst positions. all the hiring is so rigid and determined; only rising seniors for internships and only current/graduating seniors for first year positions. and obviously i can't compete for a position that requires experience bc i have none. it's been very frustrating but i feel this is the best way to sort of 'reset the clock' if you will and start anew. i think i will learn a lot and believe i would be able to demonstrate enough to get a job coming out.

obv that is all speculation but it is what it is. also, honestly i would have zero trouble working a job for the next year that paid 50k (provided the job was worthwhile obv) or even working for free if it was the right opportunity. i just can't seem to find hardly anything. i will look into kiva fellows, i'm not very familiar w that. thanks.

edit: i should clarify i don't by any means 'expect' to get in anywhere and have no idea what the process would be like. i would obv love to get into a top10 school but if i don't there will be some cutoff where it probably wouldn't be worth it to go. i am not sure where that cutoff would be but i do know it is there. i am not going to go just to go if i don't think it's the best decision.

yeah look into the kiva thing, also maybe talk to a few grads and get their thoughts. i agree it's the best way to pivot into a new thing but had one friend who got a decent one (notre dame) w/out experience and couldn't get a job afterwards. it's kind of a 1-shot thing, so have to make sure it's a good shot.

That's probably not a bad thing. If you're like me and thought that you had a chance at going to Harvard/Stanford because of GMAT/undergrad GPA, because you have a unique story and because you know people at HBS/GSB and aren't that impressed with them...forget about it. Make sure your expectations are realistic.

Obviously my experience suggests that they won't value poker in the slightest. I had lots of experience other than poker, plus a defined career goal for afterwards. Bschools want unique in the sense that they want you to have travelled abroad to work with the poor. Everyone I know who has gotten into a better school than their GMAT suggests has either done TFA or worked at a nonprofit. That probably shouldn't be surprising when you realize that most MBA admissions committees aren't made up of businessmen.

He probably won't get into a top10 school unless he has already figured out what he wants to do post-MBA. And if he's at a top 10 MBA, getting a job shouldn't be too much of a problem, especially as the business cycle kicks in.

imho, dollar amounts and general descriptions thereof will be very unlikely to impress any MBA admissions committee. I might be wrong of course, but that's my feeling. I was pretty honest that poker was a primary income stream that earned more than my consulting job. Also, as I said before, I had a PhD student in math from a top 5 program write me a rec about poker. That clearly didn't matter to the traditional MBA programs I applied to.


I think the really important part of this is for you to figure out what career you want. You basically start interviewing after a month for your summer job, which frequently determines your post-MBA job. If you go to bschool expecting to figure out what you want to do, then you're in trouble. If you want to go into banking as you seem to indicate, going to bschool is a good call. Random aside: the admissions director at UMich told me that they had admitted a few poker pros and were very bullish on them.

This was exactly my experience a few years out of undergrad. I found it absurd and really annoying, and although I even found a job at a top 25 Vault consulting firm (hardly BCG) anyway... it definitely weakened my faith in the idea that American big business is a meritocracy. Although I do understand why an ibank wouldn't hire someone for an analyst position who has shown the capacity for independent thinking.

People who already have careers can go to less prestigious schools, but for a young poker pro I think it's probably fairly important to go to a top 20 school or it's not worth it.

I haven't started Acton yet, but I think you should really take a look at it if you want to do anything other than banking/consulting/big biz. It's a little bit of a leap of faith (it is for me) but they're as selective as a top 10 school and I know of at least one other poker pro who has gone there.

If you are intent on going to the most prestigious program possible, given what little I know about you, I'd do a few things: figure out as much as humanly possible my post-MBA plans, add community service to the max ASAP, plan to apply to lots of schools and write lots of essays, and retake your GMAT if you think you are likely to improve. I didn't end up following my own advice and taking the GMAT again (not on purpose, just got busy with more important projects) and I def think a higher score would have helped. I'm actually really glad I didn't do that, because my first round rejections led me to ask what I really wanted, which led me to Acton. And I think that was easily the best fit for me.

Oh, and hire an admissions consultant. My guess would be that >50% of the marginal admits hire admissions consultants.

There's a ton of information and misinformation in this thread. I'm wrapping my first year at a top 20 program and if you intend to use poker as an entrance tool, you really need the rest of your profile to compensate for the lack of experience with high test scores, GPA, community service, etc. Even then, I've known a number of applicants that've failed because they can't articulate their reason for attending nor can they describe what value they bring to a program.

In short, know why you want to go, what value you can add to an incoming class, and especially why that particular school is the right fit for you. Your scores and GPA will get your application read, but the essays determine whether you clear the bar in many cases. I'll be happy to answer questions via PM if anyone's interested.

Nyenrode are offering top-ranking MBA candidates free flights to Amsterdam for an open weekend

businessbecause com/mba-admissions/nyenrode-mba-campus-weekend-focuses-on-leadership.htm

thanks for the really candid post loz. yea, i have had pipe dreams of getting into a top top school but have never really thought i had a shot. the only person i know who goes to stanford gsb is one of the most impressive people i know so i certainly haven't been like "well if he got in...". i am def going to do a lot of research and assuming i get a decent score on the gmat i will probably troll my resume across the desks of people that i have already talked to to show them i haven't been sitting idly and see what happens from there in terms of just getting a job.

i am sure i will be more active in here and have plenty of questions (and hopefully advice for others somewhere down the line) in the future.

any recommendations on application consultants? i only looked at one and had some serious sticker shock when i looked at their prices

www.wallstreetoasis.com bschool forum

gmatclub.com is also a pretty active forum. there are some others too.

Admissions consultants do charge pretty ridiculous prices -- but people who go to top 5 bschools do tend to have pretty high hourly wages afterwards. If they can actually add value and get you into a higher ranked school then they've probably done their jump.

I can get you some admissions consultant recommendations when the time comes. Try and book in advance, as they're obviously very busy at some times and much less so at others, where you can probably book discounted rates.