i mean it's been in wsj, nyt other mainstream outlets. i assume they have some clue but i guess i could be completely wrong.

you def think that any benefit of mentioning it in terms of it being a natural break are outweighed by negative implications of ppl in ur profession being arrested/charged/it being a knee jerk reaction?

I mean, I personally told the truth in my applications and interviews as well. I think that if you don't tell the truth, it will be easy for admissions officers to see through the BS. If you were a pro poker player and Black Friday hit, tell the truth and say you were a pro poker player, if you have nothing else to put down. I'm not sure if Loz is saying to make up something for the gap as a pro or just saying to spin your story, but I'm just saying it's gonna be hard to completely make something up.

When you have a 2-3 year or however long gap in employment history and you haven't exactly had any leadership roles within your community, it's gonna be hard to make up stories, unless you can weave some sort of amazingly intricate web. I mean, all of us can understand this, telling your life story is exactly like playing poker, your story has to make sense, or it's that much easier for your opponent to pick off your bluff.

If you were going to lie (and I'm not advocating lying), spinning your story is where you should do it, as you don't have to back up anything. As an example, you can say you wanted to prepare yourself psychologically for the highly volatile derivatives market by playing poker professionally for a month and you did fantastically well. Who knows, it may work! I've never thought that playing professional poker is viewed favorably upon by admissions officers (that's another discussion, and yes I play a lot of poker), but it is what it is, and you can always spin your experiences positively and explain the reasons of why you were playing.

I'm just saying you never know, your 86 offsuit may actually be a winning hand at showdown, and you never had to bluff in the first place just to get re-bluffed!

i graduated in 08 and have been playing since. poker is my resume so i'm past that. maybe i am an anomaly (even in here) in that i am using my poke resume to get me into business school and not trying to negate it. i have some leadership stuff, been coaching youth lacrosse for last 2 years, involved in some conservation groups and activities but my employment is poker. and i think that i can show through my gmat being taken in march, and then subsequent BF in april that i was both thinking about poker and show a logical conclusion to attend business school through both my actions leading up to BF as well as the significant impact BF has had.

my 2 cents:

BF is not the elephant in the room. don't feel an overwhelming need to address it. some people will know about BF, others will not. even for those that do, poker still exists in the US, obviously live and even online...you are still making a calculated choice to pursue an MBA compared to other options.

i'm not saying hide it in an interview, but only discuss it if the conversation lends itself towards it. if it did come up, mention the countless pros moving abroad or focusing on live play and have a good answer why you chose an MBA instead of those options.

the key here is to be ready for the dialogue but realize it doesn't have to come up.

hope this helps?

yea that seems like a good approach for interviews for sure. it came up in my tuck interview and i basically said that i had been thinking about an mba for a while, had taken the gmat once before BF and it just made my decision to apply that much easier.

oh ha totally ignored the essay part of your question (which was basically all of it). I'd say if there is a question that really tailors itself to using BF (as an obstacle or setback), it could work as one of them if you're struggling to come up with a third or something but for the "why MBA?" I'd focus way more on your future and not even mention it.

word counts are not friendly and having to explain BF just doesn't seem like the most productive use of your words.

just one man's opinion, however.

yea i think i pretty much agree with you. cornell's essay for instance just asks about career goals and how they would help achieve them and has 400 word cap. i am def not bringing it up there.

i am working on columbia atm and their question asks: Considering your post-MBA and long term professional goals, why are you pursuing an MBA at this point in your career? Additionally, why is Columbia Business School a good fit for you? (Maximum 750 words)

i think i am going to include it as part of the 'why now' in the 1st draft and see what word counts and how the essay shapes up and goes from there i guess.

I'm saying that if your real goal is to work at KKR but you went to Ohio State and then played poker for 4 years, then do not be honest and say you want to work at KKR if you want to maximize your chances at being admitted to top bschools.

Well.....agreed lol. We're all allowed to change our minds in regards to the future right?

Btw, if anyone's coming to Darden to visit or email, shoot me a PM if you wanna chat.

Follow-up: what does a 740 do for me? Do I have any realistic scholarship chances, and if so at what caliber school? Still thinking I'll only apply to Ohio State but just curious.

congrats on the 740! i'm no expert on scholarships, but my educated guess: you might get some love at tOSU, but not at a top 10-15 school. in my ignorant view of the process, i picture most of the scholarships going to women and minorities (i assume you are a dude...no clue about race/etc)...forte foundation and consortium and the like.

also, why only apply to ohio state? even if you want to stay midwest, at least give booth and kellogg (and ross with your avatar ldo) a shot, right? if nothing else, for a third alumni network.

Thanks, my wife has a great job so I'm pretty set on staying in Columbus. Also we have a kid and want to raise it around family.

from what I gather so far, scholarship decisions are looked at much like the application is: ~holistically

i'll ask some current MBA students this week for a better answer tho and post it here

most scholarships are awarded because Bschools want to attract a higher caliber than would go to that school without a scholarship.

Riverman would probably be a good candidate for a scholarship if he goes to Ohio State. The only negative really might be his GPA and the fact that he appears to live in Columbus.

LOL! That literally made me lol. I get your reasoning (I think), but that's just funny

I wouldn't say his GPA is a negative at all. It's not a whoa look at my GPA type GPA, but it's definitely solid.

But yeah, scholarships are there to attract top talent. For example, I know Vanderbilt is trying to climb in their rep and their ranking, so they attract elite talent by holding a scholars weekend and giving out scholarships for top accepted students to get them to commit. They raised their average GMAT from 660 in 2010 to 695 in 2011 by doing this.

So it is basically impossible to get in to a school if you don't get the app in for round 2? Does that only go for elite schools? My recommendation writers are super busy and I don't want to harass them.

I would push them hard to get it in. I have a couple of friends at Booth that made it in Round 3, but man...it is pretty dicey. You still have a monthish until the round 2 deadline, and I'd maybe send them a nice gift or a nice note, and say it's really important to you, and ask if they could find a time to squeeze it in over Christmas break.

ALSO, a little known fact is that schools will typically give you a 1-2 week recommender grace period if the rec isn't in, so you actually have a bit more time. Just register them by the end of next week, so they know you're not pulling a night before recommender and banking on the grace period.

Ezra

Ez, question about the recruiting phase. Correct me if Im wrong, but it all kicks off with i-banks, MC firms, and a few of the big corp's coming to your school (November-ish?) for the initial info sessions, and after a week or so of that, students are expected to go to these firms offices on friday/saturday.

If this is (generally) true, Im wondering: do students pursuing i-banking fly to NYC every thursday night/friday morning? Does your school chip in for your travel expenses to proactively pursue recruiting opportunities with these firms? If not, about how expensive is it?

Also I know that sounds kind of muddled, Im just starting to assemble these "facts" and so if you have any overall commentary on the recruiting process I'd love to hear it.

Hey, I can take this as it has been a few days. Basically first-year on-campus recruiting looks like this: Firms come in October and November for info sessions and networking events. You can then set up one-on-one coffee chats and further network if you want (it depends on your field how much you do this). Then most applications are due in December with most of the first round interviews taking place in mid to late January. I do not know what you are referring to with the idea of people traveling to firms every Friday/Saturday. Groups of people will take one-week "treks" during winter break to visit firms, some of whom come to campus and some who don't (for example I am in the middle of the east coast investment management trek right now), but this is a one-time deal and varies by field. Also there are such things as IPO contests for bankers and case competitions for consultants which are over the weekends but again these aren't every weekend by any means. Traveling is not subsidized by the school.

I'd imagine the above varies by school, maybe the NYC schools visit firms on the weekends and is where you got that idea, I can only speak about Chicago.

B, what happened to sterger?

Lol, we grew apart. I'm currently in the avatar free agent business.

B, free agency is an exciting time. i hope you find true love this time around.

i just saw this linked elsewhere: http://poetsandquants.com/2011/12/15...l-of-business/

an insightful read (there are interviews with directors of admissions from HBS, Stanford, Wharton from the past as well...maybe more) worth taking the time for.

some highlights with opinion sprinkled in:
-to combat consultants (a hot topic in the article), ross is putting more emphasis on the interview
-great detail about how the process works (who sees what, how it's rated, etc, etc)
-why the GMAT doesnt really indicate success...this part bothered me a bit. she's talking about how a lot of the leaders while at school and those successful in the job search are the ones with lower scores. this might be true, but leading some club during your 2 years at b school doesn't mean much, imo. it's overcompensating in a lot of ways.
-waitlists. it's stated ross had about 400 on it last year and 100 got in (which is a lot for a class of 500...clearly ross is a lot of people's safety for kellogg/booth/others). talk of why it's so big and how they try to make it as painless as possible.
-the pain reduction process is mentioned in the form of how they do interview invites, how they reveal decisions, etc. she/they definitely seem to want to help ease the anxiety, but unless you can personalize your alerts, it'll never satisfy everbody.


over the holidays, i'll hopefully know where i'm going and be motivated to share the insight i've gained from the process in a hopefully concise post. then again, i might get lazy or be furious that i have to do round 2 apps =/.

a lot of decisions released this week for a lot of top schools...can really make or break a holiday season but such is life.

Thanks Biesterfield

Submitted my first application last night to Columbia. Working on the rest now. Will update if I get an interview (or not).