I find it funny how 18 months in people still don't understand exponential graphs. Even if you find 'kids getting hospitalized with C19 peaking since the start of the pandemic' worthless because the absolute number is so low, the absolute number of an exponential graph can switch from low to high in a matter of days or weeks.

Kids getting hospitalized is also bad news. It means a lot of kids are getting infected (because % hospitalized vs infections is very low), those kids have close contacts with their parents & grand parents, etc, and everything will spike. Especially amongst low vaccinated areas or areas where the new variants are very present.

The news needs to report it since it might not be a good idea right now to send your kids to live with their grand parents for a week right now during Summer, etc.

It will be interesting to see what happens in USA in the coming weeks. USA seems to be spiking pretty hard with all graphs going up. Cases & ICU patients already way higher than last Summer, despite vaccines. Deaths still lagging behind, luckily.

The graphs are secondary to their messaging. Not long ago (pre-vaccine) the messaging from the crew here was that since it only impacted olds and fatties and most of them were relatively unhealthy or had conditions or had lived their useful life already - no big deal - just let it rip, the olds should be locked away, and get it over with and bury the ones who do not make it.

When the vaccine came out the messaging was that noone under 40 should go near the vaccine, to do so would be the equivalent of a criminal attack, especially to kids who are incapable of making choices for themselves (the people with this messaging have not met many 16 and 17 year olds these days and clearly will never be in a position to have kids of their own)

Obviously things changed again so their messaging has to adapt again, hence we see the beginning of the new rationalizations including things like most of the kids were going to be sick in the hospital anyways and the actual numbers are not huge just yet so wave the hand - it aint no big deal.

Sure, once in a while the derps get sidetracked with vitamin D, doomsday fetish fantasies, or an amusing argument whether Covid started in 2002 or 2017, but their messaging always changes to fit their agenda as the world changes. Their ability to understand an exponential graph is a non factor in that, as they will always present cherry picked data to meet their agenda, usually from relatively small countries (sadly Liechtenstein has not been used so far).

My messaging has pretty much been the same since March 2019.. masks and lockdowns are bad, vaccines are good but its each person individual choice to get them. Nothing you can do for them if they dont.

And my understanding of exponential math is quite good, I still dont see any evidence that Florida hospitals will be overrun by children in the near future.

Welp count my 73yr old dad as a breakthrough infection. Moderna, 2nd dose in March. Been 5 days and technically mild. We all were around each other for 2 days. Delta has shorter incubation period right?

My Trumpian FB friends have followed this general path since March 2020:

Covid is a hoax
Covid is just the flu
Only 150 people in the whole country have it you pu**ies
Only kills old and unhealthy
CDC inflating the death stats
Most "Covid deaths" were motorcycle accidents
Masks don't work
Masks are harmful
Vaccines won't work
Vaccines are harmful
Vaccines cause infertility
Vaccines are a big pharma conspiracy
Muh freedom

What the Derps have absolutely shown the world is that this vulnerability is real and it runs deep and that the Derps actually have the power to lead what the reaction limits will be.

I don't think that on this planet outside the derps of this forum anyone would doubt that countries assess each other for what type of vulnerabilities they have to attack. Cyber vulnerabilities, convention military vulnerabilities, terrorist attack vulnerabilities, bio weapon vulnerabilities, etc

Only within the derps of this forum would you see guys suggest that 'ZOMG you think Terrorists or other Nations might actually try and attack us the GREAT American' and think they were making a point.

There would not be a nation on earth that tracks and assesses these type of threat and vulnerability assessments that did not massively change their status to the US having a massive vulnerability and exploit now PROVEN that could be taken advantage of.

A derp might look at the US and think 'nothing has changed, nothing to see here. We will be perceived to be effective and able to handle something like this, as the perception always was prior.' But anyone outside a derp knows the US was stress tested and the data that came out is that the US is a massive failure in this regards and has a huge vulnerability and that is undeniable.

Literally the dumbest US citizens are the ones who will ultimately decide ANY and ALL measures of effective containment that can be implemented and the country has no way around that but to try to convince the dumbest why what they are wrong.

The US is one of the only countries who let their dumbest lead. The top Scientists and top Doctors basically pitch the dumbest on what needs to be done and the dumbest look at the checklist and decide what they find acceptable or not. You have the equivalent of Marjorie Taylor Greene making the calls on how the country can protect itself.

Sure but the Dem party is centre right on a world wide scale. The emerging Progressive arm represents more of a traditional 'left' party but they have no power yet.

Comparing the US and Canada, on a left to right spectrum you have....

Canada .................................................. ............................. U.S.A
NDP >>>>>> Liberal Party > Conservative Party | Centre | >>> Dem Party >>>>>>>> GOP

Because I am not speculating.

A derp does not realize that more than one thing can be true at the same time.

Only a Derp would not think the World has taken note of the extent of vulnerabilities each and every country faced with this Covid Test and challenge. Every nation that pays attention to this stuff in their Military vulnerabilities and strengths of other nations will be down grading the US, in this area, to near the bottom of the list.

We can and should acknowledge that fact (and yes it would be a fact even if a Derp would say 'show me the top secret files or they don't exist) as this is normal course stuff we KNOW is assessed, measured and logged.

It did not go over my head. It has NEVER been my position. The 'I gotcha with a strawman' does not work with me.


Yes.

But once again you seem to not be able to ascertain what the question or issue is.

What it is NOT is a question of 'can every virus be contained' as that may or may not be possible regardless of the actions taken.

What the question, is a question or 'if necessary, even in the face of devastating evidence coming out of other nations, can the country's gov't implement measures in a timely fashion to protect ones citizens'.

In the US we should all accept now that answer is NO. Not only will it take hold, but it will do the MAXIMUM damage. Nothing short of a cull (and eventual vaccine or other mitigations) will stop it. There will be no citizen mitigations as the Derps won't allow it.


FLOL. if you think the Derps will believe its 10% IFR.

FLOL if you think Derps follow and understand IFR.

Who is going to tell them that and convince them of that? Gov't officials? Scientists? Doctors?

That is a serious question. What are you gong to do if your scenario happens (10% IFR) and the Derps refuse all measures only correcting once they or a family member die, which currently is the only thing that changes most of them.


Take a second and answer that, because short of arresting or shooting all the Derps if you think the Derps will simply comply based on EVIDENCE, and knowing what Covid has exposed, you truly would have to be a fool.

You have been very consistent. I'll give you that.

But you have also been consistently wrong.

You have argued for Let it Rip since the First Wave and all through it. Your position even then, as we saw what was happening in NYC, Italy and elsewhere was "hospitals would not be overrun" as you use some extreme definition for 'over run'.

Hospitals WERE in fact over run in the first wave, despite your definitions, because what overrun simply means is their ability to deliver the life saving care that is available and present due to a lack of beds, Care givers or other stresses.

So no one should take your Math seriously when you apply it so poorly.

TS, yes please post your data that shows at this point spread is not happening (or is not the main vector) between US citizens and what could possibly be causing that novelty in the US?

Yes, properly tested vaccines that give you immunity are good. What we have now is the opposite in every way.

Governments forcing you to take an experimental and ineffective "vaccine" isn't even the crazy part, the pleb bending down and taking it up the ass without asking questions is worrisome.

Things are gonna get dark before we get back to normal.

Everyone who is taking a vaccine up the ass is handing you a the beautiful gift of a hospital bed being available if you end up in the hospital.

The plebs are making the correct evaluation. The downside of the vaccine is miniscule, way smaller than the downside of contracting COVID. It's very clear now everyone in the West who wants to lead a normal life is going to get COVID multiple times. The only question one has to ask is whether you want to go in those battles with or without a vaccine.

I actually agree for the most part about masks as theater. That being said I don't think all libs are wearing them to virtue signal. Many do believe they help stop the spread which is why they get annoyed at those who refuse. I don't necessarily agree with them but it is not all about feeling superior. They are trusting Fauci et al. who keep hammering masks as an essential tool to fight Covid.

No, they're level-headed straight shooters. I only made it 2 minutes, but brilliant


I'm probably going to regret this, but why do you think that kids who have never been vaccinated and never had problems with covid (relative) are now seeing a "spike"? It's summer etc. Are these raw numbers terrifying or is it a trend? If its a trend, where do you see this trend headed? What measures should we take in light of this data?
The first 3 were left wing talking points + you are racist if you don't attend celebrations in chinatown this weekend. For the rest of the list they went 5/10 which isn't bad for someone still on FB

Anyways, this guy showed up with some piping hot takes

If your on the same page as Newt Gingrich then off course CNN is going to subjectively appear left leaning to you.

At the end of the day its a standard neo liberal centre right main stream media organisation.

Are we still ignoring the fact that the WHO changed the definition of "herd immunity" to fit the narrative? That happened.



Source: trust me bro.

The same people claiming "covid is not the flu, it has serious long term effects" are also saying "we know the vaccine is harmless, it has no long term effects".

At least we get some comedy out of this mess.

We have been shooting vaccines into people as fast as we can for 8 months now, point me to the scientific articles highlighting the long-term effects of the vaccines? I think the scientific research regarding long-COVID is well documented, in case you disagree I can search for some links.

Regarding it causing death, we have very strong pooled data regarding excess mortality:
https://www.euromomo.eu/
https://ourworldindata.org/coronavir...untry-profiles

Excess death has dropped massively everywhere where we have started vaccinating.

If the argument is "we don't know what the vaccines will do after x years", the same is true for COVID. I am dealing in realities here. There is no data point that shows that the vaccine is worse than the disease. The scientific community is also massively in favour of the vaccines.

The only way that the vaccine is a bad idea, is if you bend the narrative to fit with your pre-existing ideas.
Or if you are under the illusion that you will go through life without ever getting COVID. The ironic thing is that would only work if the vaccine stopped transmission and the majority of the population got that herd immunity for you, but it seems like that wont happen, either.

In case you want anecdotal evidence, too: I live in a highly vaccinated area (90% of 18+ has received at least 1 shot in my region of >5 million people), 95% of people I know has gotten the vaccine at some point in the last 6 months. I haven't heard anybody directly who has had a worse reaction than having the "lol flu" for 2 days. I know multiple people directly who were hospitalized, knocked on their ass for multiple weeks, have forms of long COVID, from a COVID infection. And indirectly I can point to tons of people who have died from a COVID infection.

I am willing to look at all data & research, but the majority of anti-vax publications are just populist rants or studies that have been debunked by the scientific community. But please, point me in the right direction.

Fixed your post. Vaccines will surely drop excess death a large amount, but they haven't yet. Let's keep it real and not get ahead of the data.

8 months is just the beginning of intermediate term when talking about "vaccines." Maybe after 3-5 years, the effects (or lack thereof) will become more apparent.

There are multiple variables on each side of the equation, the values of which are frequently changing, and other variables that differ from person to person, but it's being portrayed as a solved equation by all of the big brained "trust the science" (trust the often compromised, untruthful authorities such as gubmint, big pharma, scientists whose grants come from gubmint or quasi-govt. orgs funded by the likes of Bill Gates, etc.) crowd.

On Ourworldindata USA is way below its levels of last summer at the moment. I agree the data is more fuzzy in Europe, but I think we can still argue it's clearly working since last summer infections & hospitalizations were way lower.

Everyone too busy trying to be a dick to the other side to actually comment on this.

Hey TC, best of luck to your dad fella. I hope he's ok/am sure he will be.

When you say technically mild, what sort of symptoms? Since I believe mild is viewed in quite a broad spectrum.

Hope he is OK obviously. Glad to hear it seems mild so far. If it remains that way, which it likely will, there is a very good chance that getting vaccinated kept him from more severe illness and who knows possibly even saved his life. So good on him for getting vaxxed, and wishes for a speedy recovery.

The breakthrough infections do bring up the concerning fact that immunity seems to wane. People, especially the elderly, vaccinated months ago may be under the false impression that they are strongly protected from infection. Clearly not true based on the Israeli data. Which is why boosters are urgently needed, at some point protection against severe disease may decline also (UK has seen a fairly large number of vaccinated patients in hospitals recently, which could be mainly a factor of their high vaccination rates, but it is still concerning).

So everyone over 70 is just gonna need to get jabbed over 5 months forever basically?

One good thing that may come of this is people start taking their health seriously, since this thing clearly is never going away now

Thanks guys I appreciate it.

Him and Mother came to visit last Wednesday for 2 days and to see the baby. I noticed he had a slight tickle/cough, very minor but something we're all hyper aware of these days. Thursday it was noticeably worse. They left Fri morning.


He was worse Friday and Saturday. He got a PCR test Sat. Cough, drainage, tired, achy, lost taste/smell, eyes burning(??). Don't think he's had a fever or breathing issues. Sounds about like a sucky cold so far. He says his cough is better today so hopefully it's on it's way out. I guess this would be day 6.

He called me this morning when he got his + result. He seemed pretty worried and shocked, which is obviously understandable, but tried to reassure him that even though breakthroughs are happening there's still a lot of protection from severe disease from the data.

Mother got rapid test today (no symptoms) and was neg. Neither me, wife, nor baby (4mo) have had any symptoms. Our 2nd dose was mid May. Wife was breastfeeding during then so hopefully antibodies got passed on to baby. I don't see how all of us, particular Mom, weren't royally exposed. Unless we are all at the tail end of the incubation period (seems mean of 4 ish days for delta) then I'd say the vaccines did their job.