^you dont/cant use transferwise? Solved all my issues with sending money to and from USA#1

How about sending money to/from legal businesses the banks deem too risky with whom to conduct business? Cryptocurreny is and most convenient method -- and in many cases the only method -- by which to deposit significant sums on various LEGAL gambling sites and crypto exchanges (bitfnx just had to cut ties with US customers).

A total of 5-6 banks decide at their discretion which businesses all US residents have financial access to. These banks have no legal obligation to conduct business with anyone, and can squeeze companies out of the US market at their discretion. It's disgusting.

Posting on a poker forum about how nobody has real use-case for Bitcoin is pretty LOL.

I have never used them, but it's probably a pain in the ass.

Also looking at the fee page, much more expensive:

https://transferwise.com/help/articl.../usd-transfers

And 1-5 business day clearing time, lol. Inferior to Bitcoin in both convenience and cost.

Again, you somehow think this is a legal use case to send money to foreign countries with no reporting. It is not. For some reason you seem to think that remittance doesn't have laws associated with it, much less international remittance.

It is far easier than BTC. It is more expensive as well. However, I doubt you actually use BTC while traveling and instead use it as an intermediary for fiat, which is w/e.

Which reporting, specifically?

Yes, of course as an intermediary to fiat. I have never dealt with a financial institution that is easier to transact with than Bitcoin, whether it be banks (terrible), paypal (terrible), moneybookers (terrible). I can provide a laundry list of problems I have encountered with them over the years, but in my experience it is impossible to convince people otherwise who believe the current global banking system is efficient. Third party intermediary institutions only get in the way and take fees, it is as simple as that.

All financial institutions comply with anti-terrorism and moneylaundering laws that wish to operate in the US in an ongoing basis.

You are actually using one (maybe two) financial institutions when you xfer BTC from fiat-> BTC -> fiat, so that statement is absurd. Unless you are committing crimes of course, but it seems like you don't really have any idea about the regulation that you are being subjected to and making claims without really knowing anything about the subject. This is rather par for the course sadly with crypto.

I do not live in the US and your argument did not state specifically "in the US," which would be absurd given that Bitcoin is a global payment system. In fact, being a US citizen while living & working abroad is ****ing terrible. Figures that renunciations are increasing at all time high rates.

True, I am not familiar with US laws in this scenario. If everyone who sells Bitcoin is a criminal, so be it. I believe you given how outdated and draconian US fiscal and monetary policy is.

Actually most other countries including the UK have laws that are basically identical. No country wants people sending money around willy nilly.

The only part that may be true is how long these countries take to regulate BTC transactions.

Selling BTC is definitely illegal (without an appropriate license) in the US, and may or may not be where you are living/citizen of/etc. I just found your efforts to "correct" me mildly amusing given how little you seem to know about what you are actually doing and the legality of it. Furthermore, if you aren't selling BTC directly and using an exchange you likely fall under their compliance and reporting, this would absolve you from any responsibility on your own. (See Coinbase)

Best of luck learning about this in the future tho!

Do you have a source for this?

AFAIK, the UK AML registration limit is 10kgbp transactions. The EU is similar. For the US it's $1.5k, but not sure on that. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/money-la...r-registration

Do you really want links to the full listing of all laws in the UK that govern KYC/financial regulation?

Nope, you are correct. I was misinformed. This community is a beehive of criminal activity; only a matter of time until 2p2 gets its domain seized by the FBI.

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/members/383417/

if you're still lurking, would love an update

You are missing that the vast majority of wealth is held in counter inflationary assets. And inflation is very low, to the point where it does not bother most people.

Also you ignored all my argument that bitcoin is inferior to fiat currency in a lot of important ways. And for legit use doesn't really offer upside. Unless you are super bothered by 1% inflation. I see that a lot on here, I make an argument, and like 80% of my points are ignored or hand waved away without providing a counter argument really.

Im not going to repeat those points, but it is inferior in a lot of ways, even when developers improve on it.

Personally I hold like 95% of my wealth in stocks. I probably get like a 2% dividend yield on that (and companies I own pay out small % of earnings overall). So inflation is a non issue for most people.

The market cap of fiat is a lot higher because people keep their money in USD eur Yen etc. They don't use them primarily as a transmission mechanism.

I have a few thousand in the bank (not counting investments), and it has been there for years. If I live in Europe, and I would only buy euro's for transactions, and only hold USD, and everyone else would do that too, the euro would be valued a lot lower.

But if I use bitcoin, I use it more like a hot potato, quickly spend it, and vendor quickly sells it again. If majority of coins are used like that, market cap can be very small with trillions of $ in transactions each year. Im not sure how to make this more obvious. I guess if you run a simulation of this in excel you see it in action.

Pretty much every single point you have brought up in this thread has been talked to death here and on Bitcoin related forums. You are not the only one that doesn't like repeating himself. It doesn't necessarily mean you are wrong, but the people you want answers from think that you are.

You use it like that, but there are many people, companies and organizations that don't, for one reason or another. First of all, that limits supply, pushing the prize up, just like you say. Secondly, people don't invest only in what Bitcoin is capable of today. They see a not too distant future where it has a lot more utility, and they want to invest in that system before others do, because then the prize will be higher.

Comparing your situation to world wide bitcoin users is anecdotal at best. All of your examples are bad because you don't take into consideration what people in China, Venezuela, Russia, Argentina, Greece, experience with inflation. In a lot of these cases they use the usd legally and illegally. In some of these countries a deflationary currency is far superior to their inflationary currency, and the volatility is similar. Certain business need higher liquidity than the stock market provides. I could go on and on but if bitcoin gets even a small % of the market cap of usd or gold as value storage that would be massive.

Cliffs: bitcoin isn't for everyone but it doesn't need to be either...

There are certainly ways for me to send BTC to his exchange account or his cloud wallet in the USA and then he uses an exchange to legally withdraw? Is there something I'm missing? Why am I setting up a remittance company to send my friend $100? Why am I going to prison?

I'm glad to see this thread is still going, haven't posted here since 2013. Still bullish/obsessed about bitcoin though. Happy to chat about it a bit for old time's sake. I'm excited for lightning network, and I just started running a pruned node on a raspberry pi3 with a microsd card. Going to try to set up joinmarket on that.

remember when ToothSayer said bitcoin was going to $0 without an ETF?

hahahahaha. cuck doesn't get crypto.

I so badly want to troll the ethereum thread.

Or AI.

I must have butthurt you badly, bro. You've posted stuff like this several times. It's weird. It's like you want to make me look good. Why? Because I'm one of the few who put my balls out there and called this a "strong buy" when it was languishing at $200-$300 for an extended period.

Maybe I have you wrong and English isn't your first language?

January 2015 (at $250):
May 2015 (at $240):
I also argued very strongly against shorting Bitcoin.

We'll see what happens from here - it's gone up more than I expected since 2015 - but anyone who followed my recommendations made 5x their money at least. 16x if they followed the buy recommendation and didn't sell (I have never recommended a short/sell of bitcoin, although I probably would have around $1500 if I was sitting on 5x profit).

If making 16x your money is "not getting" something, I think a few people would enjoy my style of "not getting" it.

Forgive my innocence, but, am a lurker, who would like a few things clarified, just for history.

I first heard of Bitcoin, on DonkDown radio, in 2012 ? .. (I cant seem to get the old episodes to play), when someone .. maybe Bryan Micon ? was often heard ranting, that u HAD to buy the stuff, at $1 a coin, or whatever). He sounded a complete nutcase .. so, missed that one ..

I would love to use Bitcoin for sports betting (my business), but, residing in the Uk, any time I open a Bitcoin website, its says its blocked from my jurisdiction .. so, presumably I have to use a VPN to bypass .. and then trust someone with my money).

Listening to a few podcasts, it was mentioned that Bitcoin sports websites, would offer better margins .. like 2% over-round .. but, I cant find any.

Does anyone in the thread, trade sports in Bitcoin ? And can u recommend a site.

Thx

To be fair, I don't think anyone "gets" crypto.

The entire thing is hard to understand and hard to justify in terms of investment. We've had these situations before, and the mantra of "invest in things you understand" has held true over the years. Crypto isn't even close to being understood on a wide-scale basis. I have an investment in crypto-related businesses and I have no idea wtf is going on right now. I would think that would be the correct line of thought when some of those stocks are moving +90% in one trading session.

Nothing about crypto is normal. I'm just happy to mash buttons and go along for the ride, but I absolutely would not be comfortable telling someone else to.

Transactions in itself mean very little in bitcoin but discussing this with you is pointless. You love your strawmen. All the big announcements of vendors accepting bitcoin has seen almost no growth in actual payments in bitcoin to those vendors. Which in itself is fine as bitcoin doesn't need to be an end user payment option at the moment. I just said I expected it to grow more and I expected remittance to be bigger. Right now there are other markets and of course store of value that can maintain growth.

Some banks are already testing internal blockchain technology for bank to bank transfers but this has no consequence for bitcoin. I don't see how banks can convince normal users that their crypto is better. Business to business is another story and concentration of mining in China is not helping here.