If Tether collapses the exchanges will have to sell other people’s bitcoin in order to get cash to pay out cash withdrawals in order to stay afloat. If they are doomed because they are in too deep they can claim hacker and run off with everything.

what an awful, self-righteous post. 3 paragraphs of words that ultimately say absolutely nothing.

This is what is called tether fud and not at all how it works. TheGodson I think you should admit you don't know anything about tether.

Can you explain how it works? I thought Tether was an ERC20 token created by Bitfinex that is supposed to represent a $.

Maybe I've misunderstood and misunderstand but I think you are suggesting that exchanges are obligated to redeem tether for usd (fiat).

Tether is not well understood by most and there is incentive to spread fud about it for people that aren't benefiting from using it (ie private bitfinex investors and exchanges).

You're right, I said that like a dik, I didn't mean to. I was trying to be concise and economical with words, but not in a jerk way.

What I meant was, some of the recent posts that link a thing to another thing... like sentiment getting heated and its relationship to an impending crash, are confusing correlation with causation. Some others are posing false analogies or false dichotomies. My opinion is that if you can learn to recognize those things in arguments you will get better at making decisions.

I think that's true, anyways. I was trying to say that with fewer words. Or better words, or something.

Well sure correlation doesn't mean causation but that doesn't mean it's wrong to look for connections that may be valid.

Ex: you could say when waitresses making $40k a year were flipping $600k homes in Miami Beach, or people with almost no income were getting approved for $700k interest-only subprime mortgages, that those are a solid sign that you are nearing the top of the housing bubble.

Of course the bubble went on for quite a while but that does not mean the causation was not there. It's obvious only in hindsight.

There are many many signs that BTC is in a bubble right now. They are pretty glaring actually. But bubbles can go on far longer than anyone expects. No way I'd ever short this even though I'm almost certain it will burst eventually... because I could end up broke before reality sets in.

It is.

But other exchanges don't own it. You can't deposit USDT onto an exchange and ask them to give you a dollar. You have to go and trade it as a pair. So your trading that USDT with another person/market maker not the exchange itself. This is why USDT pairs differ in price then USD prices. It's a completely different market. So if Tether collapses, those people lose their money, not the exchange and therefore the exchange won't need to sell your bitcoin to cover the losses.

FYP...

Would have been funnier that way imo.

here's some more tether discussion fuel for you, boys

I think Tether smells funny. But the idea that it is what is driving crypto is now obsolete. We can add up the buys of some major companies and grayscale in just the last 6 months and Tether is all of a sudden a drop in the bucket. So it just needs to be put to rest. If it was a scam, it was a scam, but it's not what is driving crypto now. So who gives a **** about 2017.

Well obviously it's "fud" when a bunch of randos operate the bank, the exchange and the token issuer making false claims along the way about basically everything they touch.You would be an idiot to not feel fear, uncertainty and doubt if you do any kind of business with people/institutions that touch Tether.

You are assuming they will choose to let you cash it out instead of taking it to cover their obligations.

Exchanges must hold a lot of Tether for liquidity. Otherwise it would never start circulating. The theory was that Tether customers (exchanges/other institutions) can redeem them. Once it turns out it's not possible the whole system collapses.

Exchanges are not obliged to exchange Tethers for USD for their users but they themselves may need to redeem their Tethers to cover their cash obligations.
Once it's clear it's not possible the exchange collapses and you can bet takes your BTC (claiming a hack or w/e nonsense) with them.

So what exactly is my incentive for example? Or AG incentive? Or tons of other people who won't touch crypto with a 10 foot pole but still warn about an obvious scam that Tether and exchanges connected to it are?

I mean you can disagree with me about the value of crypto currencies but at least take one financial advice from me: don't keep any significant assets anywhere close to entities that deal with Tether.

Says who? Do they need to hold BTC and every single other coin for liquidity too? Every **** coin? Otherwise how would they start circulating?

This is why when an exchange adds a new coin, they allow deposits of the coin in advance of actual trading.

The exchange has 0 need to hold tethers. If their is a lack of liquidity, arbitrage traders will step up and fix that problem.

necessary vs sufficient is an easier way to think about it:

all bubbles involve periods of widespread wild speculation. but not all widespread wild speculation is the result of a bubble.

good reminder particularly for people like me who tend toward the risk-averse side.

That Irieguy post being met by any response on 2p2 other than "well yeah duh we knew that 10 years ago when we played poker" is proof that the games/markets will always be good.

Massive lols at some of the garbage on here like the silver market cap having anything to do with the price of BTC.

I'm suggesting the opposite. The example I had in mind was healthcare

If a person chooses a job they don't want the most, specifically because it provides them healthcare they need and can't get elsewhere, or chooses a job vs not working (Because they don't need income, they need the coverage. Or they need the time for other responsibilities like another job or caring for family), then they are not functioning optimally within a society and its subsequent economy. Lack of fluidity in the labor market is a drag on the economy

Healthcare tethered to employment gives people less choices, not more. Also, universal healthcare allows people to return to work immediately rather than spend years fighting with insurance companies, doctors, and hospitals over money and optimal care

Well, you didn't imply a specific policy, you made a broad generalization which implies put money into the capitalists' hands and keep it out of anyone deemed less productive. The US, as constructed, is cemented in a manner that that remains true, making UHC virtually impossible at the moment. This means that people die and go bankrupt yearly. Dead people cannot be productive. They're dead. Bankruptcy over something like a hospital bill or life saving treatments means crushing debt. That affects individuals, their family, the community they live in, quality of life for those affected by that ripple, utility...

Even something like cancelling debt on student loans will make students entering the workforce and their prime productivity years that much more productive. Wouldn't you rather have innovative people with an abundance of capital rather than spending years paying down debt? Cancelling debt in this status quo is akin to surgically removing a cancerous tumor. Remove the tumor, overhaul education so that this tumor does not grow back

Hence my point that the money doesn't always need to go to the most productive. That is like saying a pro sports team needs all veterans and no developing rookies/inexperienced talent, and don't invest any time and money in them, because "it's better that money is in the hands of the most productive rather than the least productive"

Hmm I can see your point here, but "immoral" and "negative effects" are really slanting it one way and ignoring the counterfactuals...

I personally am skeptical of raising the minimum wage, but data suggests it is not quite the picture you paint. Raising the minimum wage doesn't seem like the big deal that people make it out to be. Just because that is an anticapitalistic thing to do doesn't mean it ruins capitalism. Capitalism just functions like water, taking the shape of its container (laws/regs). Businesses will evaporate, others will flourish, new businesses will only function if robust enough to meet new barriers to entry, blah blah blah

However, I've mentioned this a few times before, that I think we should have UBI + no minimum wage at all. That might be a better mix, I really don't know. That is just a thought in my head with no cite behind it

fyp

Not sure why this is in the bitcoin thread but I feel like commenting on it.

Whether the known effects are a big deal is a matter of policy preference, but the effects aren't really disputed by any economists. When you artificially fix prices above of the supply/demand equilibrium, for anything, you get less of that thing. In this case labor. Quantity demanded at that price will exceed quantity supplied. This creates higher unemployment. The market will not magically allocate more money towards labor due to price fixing. This has been proven over and over around the world.

You won't get higher average wages because when you average in the $0 unemployed, you still have the same or lower average wage. This fact is not even controversial among economists, only politicians believe otherwise.

I always find the most significant amount of ignorance comes from strong opinionated people that speak about things they know little about.

don't know what you mean in the above

To be clear the exchanges and whales are the primary customers of tether.

Why do they need redeem tether to cover cash obligations?
You aren't one of the people that I was referring to that has incentive to spread tether fud. I have no idea what would motivate you to do this.

I don't even think you would claim to know what tether is about beyond a superficial level. I've been studying these subjects very intensely for many years now. I spent a year in a group chat with a bitfinex employee at the height of the fud craze.

I don't think you know what you are talking about and I don't think you claim to...do you claim to?

Sure. But what if the system via crony capitalism is not allowing for an unimpeded market to set wage prices on the low end fair and to market rates and it is artificially held low through collusion and maximizing purposely created power imbalances?

If you believe corporate lobbying can and does effect that balance then minimum wage adjustments could be a justified means of correcting that and returning things to a more of an equilibrium.

The above could be true and in no way in conflict with what you say is 'established'.

Okay the people still talking about Tether conspiracies are the crypto version of people who think Trump won.

Do you really think the NYAG would let them off with a minuscule fine + no admission of wrongdoing if the whole thing was a ponzi? Look at the recent growth of USDC... is that also a ponzi?

The answer is stablecoins are extremely useful, so people demand them. Tether is extremely useful for people from countries with capital controls like South Korea and China.

Tether Truthers are lol

https://trezor.io/shamir/

I only scan this thread so apologies if this is a repost, but this seems like a snap-buy for anyone holding significant amounts of crypto - substantially more secure to not have a single point of failure for your backup

Like comparing bitcoin with gold market cap right ?

Thank you for posting this. Have had ledgers for years but this looks very promising