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2018 Trading Thread 2018 Trading Thread

02-05-2018 , 08:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by calmasahinducow
The math seems to disagree...From Matt Levine's column today:

Just for giggles, Bloomberg tells me that Bitcoin's daily correlation with the S&P 500 Index was 0.047 in 2017, -0.049 in 2016, 0.07 in 2015 and -0.081 in 2014. That is about as uncorrelated an asset as you could ask for -- and a lot of Bitcoin buyers were asking for uncorrelated assets. So far in 2018 the correlation is 0.286.
That is just one measure
2018 Trading Thread Quote
02-05-2018 , 08:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by calmasahinducow
Crypto and short vol both blown up. Admittedly I'm a hater but I'm totally cool with 2018 so far.
There are no bitcoin hodlers in foxholes. Everyone loves their USD when the **** hits the fan, and a digital fairycoin <<<<<<<<< a promise by the US government to kill anyone who won't give you a wholesome amount of goods for your printed paper.

It's really instructive to look at asset classes in 2008 to see what happens to "safe haven" and "uncorrelated" items when a fire sale hits stocks.
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02-05-2018 , 09:19 PM
Guys they are terminating the short vol ETNs, wow holy ****. Escalated so quickly and there were quite a few articles over the past couple years about this scenario. Great read here on this: https://twitter.com/ArtemisVol/statu...0%7Ctwterm%5E0
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02-05-2018 , 10:12 PM
Dow future down 9% at the moment, am I reading this right?
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02-05-2018 , 10:29 PM
What's LLD?
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02-05-2018 , 10:35 PM
Bonds changing directions (to the upside/rates lower) in a massive way overnight, choose your own narrative.
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02-05-2018 , 10:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shuffle
Futures collapsing. LLD watch tonight. Haven't had one of those in 2.5 years.
not quite, we had some overnight LLDs on brexit and trump. they did pop off LLD, so i guess we are arguing semantics

the LLD of aug 2015 was bonkers on the morning reopen
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02-05-2018 , 11:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by juan valdez
feb is a sexy month

anyone else think TLT is a good short?
Uh no
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02-05-2018 , 11:29 PM
S&P down, NDX, DOW Down, RUT down, VIX up

Who am I impersonating?
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02-05-2018 , 11:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoterSmoter
Dow future down 9% at the moment, am I reading this right?


Not sure what you’re seeing. They’re down about 2.5% and imply a 4% drop from the index close since they closed 1.5% lower than index today.
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02-05-2018 , 11:37 PM
Overnight limits
ES: 2515 - 2779
NQ: 6181 - 6830.5

http://www.cmegroup.com/trading/equi...mit-guide.html
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02-05-2018 , 11:44 PM
Nothing wrong with selling vol, unless VIX is 9-11 which basically all of 2017.

But wtf is happening with XIV? Serious question: is this a buy?

edit: Probably not. Looks pretty bad from some prelim Google research. Probably staying away from all ETNs after today.

Last edited by :::grimReaper:::; 02-05-2018 at 11:57 PM.
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02-06-2018 , 12:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by :::grimReaper:::
Nothing wrong with selling vol, unless VIX is 9-11 which basically all of 2017.

But wtf is happening with XIV? Serious question: is this a buy?
Here's a good explanation: https://www.google.com/amp/s/seeking...eration-clause

To put it simply, they can pay you the value at the close (even if it's zero) when it falls 20% below NAV. It's their determination which obviously would be whatever CS views is in their best interest.
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02-06-2018 , 12:16 AM
That's not correct, nothing to do with a % of NAV. When it falls 80% Day over Day they have the option of closing it down and paying 100% of NAV (which will likely be greater than zero barring a major VIX spike tomorrow).

Worth noting that its still just an option they have available to them, its not required. People are treating XIV like it is dead, and while the probability is high its not a sure thing yet. I'm sure they are a lot of conferences going on in CS right now about future revenue value and reputation risk.

It also depends on their current risk profile. In some cases closing the fund could actually be bad for them. Given the $4 NAV its also possible that they have already gotten out of most of the ETN positions.

Will be an interesting day tomorrow.
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02-06-2018 , 12:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ibavly
That's not correct, nothing to do with a % of NAV. When it falls 80% Day over Day they have the option of closing it down and paying 100% of NAV (which will likely be greater than zero barring a major VIX spike tomorrow).

Worth noting that its still just an option they have available to them, its not required. People are treating XIV like it is dead, and while the probability is high its not a sure thing yet. I'm sure they are a lot of conferences going on in CS right now about future revenue value and reputation risk.

It also depends on their current risk profile. In some cases closing the fund could actually be bad for them. Given the $4 NAV its also possible that they have already gotten out of most of the ETN positions.

Will be an interesting day tomorrow.
Thanks for the correction, just learning about this process as well. This is from the article I posted: If CS Does Prepay, What Do I Receive?"

An important misconception we have come across as it relates to Event Acceleration is that if the ETN experiences early termination, its holders will end up with nothing. Here's what the prospectus says (PDF pg. 2, originally stated in bold):

..upon acceleration you will receive a cash payment in an amount (the "Accelerated Redemption Amount") equal to the Closing Indicative Value on the Accelerated Valuation Date.

To illustrate, if Credit Suisse decides to accelerate XIV upon it falling below 20% of the previous day's Closing Indicative Value, but then the futures fall back down before the end of the day, they will be obligated to pay holders whatever the underlying index is worth as of that day's close (the accelerated valuation date). This amount could very well be zero, but it could also be significantly higher.

While We're At It…

It is worth mentioning that because the ETN is a long instrument, the holder's max loss exposure is just the value of the ETN. That is to say that if the ETN is trading at $100/share, for instance, it is impossible for the holder to lose more than that amount. More on this below as it relates to potential risk to CS as the sponsor.

Obligatory Acceleration
Freeze in the Underlying:

Potential acceleration events other than dropping below 20% of the previous day's closing indicative value center around legislation that might hinder their ability to manage the ETNs, such as if the government " makes it illegal to hold, acquire or dispose of the applicable underlying futures (Prospectus PDF pg. 53)." While we do not find this eventuality to be likely, we do harken back to Fall 2008 when it became illegal to short the banks, or the Summer of 2015 where China put severe restrictions on shorting stocks or even taking new short futures positions.

As we mentioned previously, Credit Suisse is not obligated to take the positions in VIX futures that the performance of XIV or any of the other ETNs in the series are based on. In other words, we cannot be certain as to what Credit Suisse's overall volatility positioning looks like, and in the event of a VIX spike, acceleration could certainly be to their benefit.


Placement Breaks

A different form of potential type of acceleration has to do with a contract between Credit Suisse and Janus Henderson Distributors who assists them with the placement of VIX related ETNs. Here's how it is worded in the prospectus (pdf pg 54):

..if JHD exercises their right to cause an early acceleration due to a termination of our agreement with them in certain circumstances, we will be obligated to accelerate all of the outstanding ETNs within ten (10) calendar days of such termination.

Again, the likelihood of this happening is probably not significant, but it is worth knowing that XIV could be accelerated even if Credit Suisse has no desire to do so.

CS Product Exposure and Current Profit Profile
Risk Exposure

We assert that the decision as to whether or not to accelerate would boil down to whether CS sees the continuation of XIV as having favorable risk/reward tradeoff. As pointed out in the Forbes article we mentioned earlier, if XIV's underlying index looks like it is going to decrease more than 100% in a single day, " having a trigger mechanism that leaves them plenty of buffer (20%) to unwind their hedges is prudent risk management."

As discussed above, the maximum drawdown for a holder of XIV amounts to a 'mere' 100%; it is certainly not impossible that the index to which XIV is inversely tied could increase by more than 100%: CS may or may not carry net short exposure to F1 and F2 VIX futures. In other words, if the value of the implied underlying futures should double, XIV would go to zero and any losses beyond that would theoretically be shouldered solely by Credit Suisse.

In reality, CS's overall net volatility exposure is considerably more complex than what is indicated by XIV's underlying index. In furtherance of this notion, CS manages several ETNs in the volatility space (nine total for US equity), most of them long. This means that the sponsor very well may consider some of these products to be naturally offsetting in terms of the company's short-term exposures.

While it is safe to assume that CS has hedges in place to protect themselves in the event of a VIX spike, we maintain that their decision to accelerate could go either way on the sole dimension of risk.

Profit Profile

To assess the likelihood of CS exercising its prepayment right, it is imperative to put the hefty revenues associated with this note in perspective.

Considering the amount of money Credit Suisse is earning from XIV, we do not think they are very likely to arbitrarily exercise acceleration in the near future. XIV's AUM as of October 9th was just shy of one billion:

Source: VelocitySharesETNs

With an annualized cost of 1.35%, if the market AUM stayed constant (not likely), the ETN would bring in approximately $13.5 million per year in revenue.

Clearly, Credit Suisse would not just arbitrarily elect to rid themselves of such an income stream for what might amount to a severe but temporary headache. As such, we believe that the decision to accelerate would occur only under a market environment of great and extended distress, where clean and liquid hedging was rendered next-to-impossible.

Conclusion
No matter the exact cause of acceleration, the key point to keep in mind is that XIV carries no guarantee of longevity. Whether holders of the product are given an advance notice of one day, five days, or ten days, determining the best way to handle acceleration on your instrument of choice probably is not something you would want to be doing on the spot.

Therefore: if you regularly employ XIV in your trading or investment tool kit, it is worth your while to consider (and document) how you will handle acceleration. Our suggestions include looking into other volatility related products such as SVXY, as well as evaluating strategies such as shorting VXX or taking positions in VIX futures. We emphasize here that the convexity profile of shorting VXX is quite different from going long XIV."
2018 Trading Thread Quote
02-06-2018 , 01:14 AM
Yeah. It is the % change in indicative value of VXX that matters, not the change in price. Also, it is important to note that they are not required to accelerate the note. They have the option to do so if they want to.

SVXY is less clear about what % change in NAV would precipitate liquidating the fund. The same thing applies as to it being a voluntary action on their part.

Not going back through all the comments, but anyone who was holding these because they thought it was some magical free lunch is just silly. They are trading vehicles.

Also, if they do continue to trade and you want to trade them for some reason, make sure to check the premiums to iv/nav. They were out of whack after hours today, and there is a very good chance that they won't be trading close to iv/nav in the immediate future.
2018 Trading Thread Quote
02-06-2018 , 01:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ASAP17
My favorite argument from crypto bulls was in a correction or worse like scenario for global markets crypto (specifically Bitcoin) would serve as a hedge and go the opposite way. The short term evidence is pretty lol on this front not to mention the rise of crypto coinciding with the ten year bull run and never trading outside of it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by calmasahinducow
The math seems to disagree...From Matt Levine's column today:

Just for giggles, Bloomberg tells me that Bitcoin's daily correlation with the S&P 500 Index was 0.047 in 2017, -0.049 in 2016, 0.07 in 2015 and -0.081 in 2014. That is about as uncorrelated an asset as you could ask for -- and a lot of Bitcoin buyers were asking for uncorrelated assets. So far in 2018 the correlation is 0.286.
Uncorrelated is not the same as anti-correlated (i.e. you're both right).
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02-06-2018 , 01:26 AM
daily stock market chart

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02-06-2018 , 01:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clayton
daily stock market chart

Nice. The fun thing is that we got to see what two short vix futures funds collapsing to 5% of their previous day's size from 4-4:15 this afternoon.

Next time we'll all be all, "heh. I got this."
2018 Trading Thread Quote
02-06-2018 , 01:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rafiki
-Do you guys just use market orders to make sure you fill in a situation where a few cents either way won't mean a thing? Seems like the answer is obviously yes.
In trading as in fencing there is the quick and the dead. -Linda Raschke
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02-06-2018 , 02:42 AM
After nearly 2 years of being done with insurance, I finally bought some S&P put spreads in Dec. I expected a lot of typical Jan volatility, it never happened. Then a small blip last week, bought some UVXY and SDOW, not nearly enough...very painful.

Not sure what the next play is, thankful to have enough alternative hedges but do NOT feel comfortable buying any dips.

Economosists predicted bear market 2018, they're not always right but they're not far off. Hike cycle, full employment, climbing p/e, diminishing GDP, tax cuts. Could be time for it to end in a year or so....

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
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02-06-2018 , 02:48 AM
No matter what you did today or in the last week, part of you is gonna feel stupid.
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02-06-2018 , 04:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clayton
im in the same boat as TS. i've been touting anti short vol for a while now. it's professional martingaling. black swans murder it. black swans inevitably happen. praise taleb. etc.
We didn't even have a black swan here. A black swan is a major earthquake hitting CA and wiping out a few big cap tech companies (2%/year?) for a year and disrupting the US economy. Or a sudden Asian financial crisis that no one predicted. And even the first would barely qualify as it's a predictable tail risk of known magnitude.

This was ultra low rates slowly shifting as the economy got into high gear, and the short vol trade unwinding with plenty of warnings as it gained speed. It's something that was guaranteed to happen sooner or later. That's the exact opposite of a black swan.
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02-06-2018 , 04:35 AM
I'm just surprised that a 40 VIX was enough to bring down these ETNs. Aug 2015 was worse. They should've calibrated risk of ruin to something on the level of the financial crisis, e.g. 80+.

And good to know Brian's still alive.
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02-06-2018 , 06:52 AM
Anyone that has been holding cash, the time to enter the market will be in the next few days to weeks. I would recommend buying soon before the market bounces back as most corrections don't last more than a few months at most. Sorry that you still missed out on the last 8+ years. Complete collapse is not going to happen.

Last edited by Shoe; 02-06-2018 at 07:00 AM.
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