Like you said, other than data and these couple glitches you guys have mentioned, there's not much else you can showcase that removes plausible deniability. To the untrained eye the bots don't look any different than another reg.

You are correct. I mean the FoxRox clip is just laughable how obvious it was a bot. It is so unlikley for a situation like this to ever unfold. Even if the bot had just snap folded at every decision point where it folded it would still leave a doubt in the minds of the average viewer. The fact that it was time banking every hand was probably truly random. There are some bots at PLO cash that time bank extremely long every decision (eg, Kigdin). And others that act almost instantly most of the time (eg, stoicwise). Others have a decent mix ect. But if this FoxRox bot happened to have fast timing programmed I think there would have been less outrage.

Yes, video would make a big difference. The same thing happens in professional sports. If an NFL football player is arrested for beating up a woman, that's bad. If there's a video, then it's really bad and the NFL punishment is more swift and more serious.

LOL ya, that's a good point.

When I was talking about transparency and multiple accounts not being outed, I find the timing of ACR/WPN's proclamation funny, since a day or so before that Party Poker announced that they had closed the accounts 277 bot accounts.

0 for 8 for double at the end of a tournament
0 for 12 in blackjack

odds are impossible,unless fixed

oh wait I take it all back I just received 1.59 from acr because 2plus2 told them about a bot

It’s a start and I commend WPN for their efforts. Hoping the cash game bots are next.

Having a blast here in the cash games at 10nl and 25nl. The only thing is that it's your turn sound bug is still there and is just as annoying as ever.

Oh yea the “your turn” bug annoys the hell out of me. It’s enough for me to quit a session.

TD_Winning - Please Please Please stop it with the tournaments with late registration 3-4-5 hours until a few players before the money.
People buying in a few minutes before the money is ridiculous.

Don't tell me that's what people like because u offer nothing else.

Good for push Bots of course...but horrible for people trying to play a skill game.

Should we all just join in the last three minutes of a three hour rebuy period with 10 BB's and push away.
Some of us actually like to play the game.

Stop catering to the Bubble-Join crowd already.
Sad!

Dude, you get a ton of +EV spots as a larger stack because of that. Plus we all have the option to take that route.

I view the bubble late registration as an angle shoot, albeit currently a legal angle shoot. But when I watch the World Series of Poker main event on ESPN, when they get to the bubble, there aren't people still registering. In online tournaments, just like live tournaments, there should be a healthy gap of time between the end of registration and the when bubble happpens. The current state of most online tournaments on most poker sites from buy-ins, blind levels, etc.came about through "tournament improvement" threads here on 2+2 between players and site reps. The issue with tournament with some sites is still having bubble registration.

Go search on 2+2 for an extremely old tournament improvement thread from Pokerstars. You will see that what we have today in terms of buy ins, blind levels, heck even bathroom breaks was an evolution.

Overall fixing angle shooting in online poker has been a long process. Trying to fix cash game short stacking, seating scripts, grimming, etc has been a long time to fix in terms of views on topics. But anything used as a angle shoot has historically been bad for the health of games. Bubble registration is an angle shoot.

They offer turbos quite frequently that seem more what you are looking for. 90 minutes of late registration. The bubble is still a ways off. There are even some 2 hour tourneys as well as On Demands. I do think they pay too many places in certain tourneys but there are still significant prizes for going deep.

Any idea on NightSta1ker? Another Latvian grinder I noticed today.

There are def still some Latvian accounts out there. NightSta1ker is one, other guys like Morriarty, Bull5hot all with the same robotic tendencies. I mean should we just report these kinda guys now?

Yes report

I was checking out the beast bonus. I look on last week. It says 179 are projected to cash 100 bucks. so that is supposed to be estimate of around how many get paid from grinding up all those points till they fart dust. I look on players paid it says only 64 were paid. That is not a projection when its off by 115 players. So i was wondering any players outside of the top 64 were you paid at least 100 bucks? Or is Mr. Nagy cutting out 100 players from being paid for grinding the beast? I remember before it was always close to projection and now I look and its not even close. Thats beyond a estimate thats baiting people to grind the beast thinking they will get paid to see only 64 were paid. So the guy in 65th place is thinking he will get paid cause its projected 179 to cash gets nothing. Or is this a glitch and all 179 got paid?

I guess it can't hurt, or at least to pass along names so people can at least be aware.

I have a lot of hands against him, and he seems just kind of TAG. VPIP 19, PFR 17. I played a pot with him, I had AK, he had QQ and he played it more like a thinking player. Flop was QJT, no flush draw and he check called flop, check called turn, and over-shoved the river. The timing of his bets just gave me a feel that he was putting thought in to what he should do. I could be wrong; he is from OGRE...haha

My thought would be most BOTS would be programmed to get QQ AIPF, unless the stats he has on me are SUPER nitty. They are not.

You choose not to play tournaments that are very long with large prize pools, probably because they don't fit into your schedule, along with the problem you already pointed out. I make the opposite choice, but it has nothing to do with angle shooting.

Back when Americans could play on PokerStars I played a $3.30 buy-in tournament with 4,700 players. After about seven hours I made the final table and cashed for $384. I decided right them that I wanted to play long and deepstacked tournaments wherever I could find them.

I have not changed my mind. I would play nothing but that type of tournament if I could. I have the time and the patience to play for seven or more hours without missing a hand. I have an edge over the players that will get tired and make dumb mistakes, or those who will miss hands when I don't. I can bully or pick off the late-entry small stacks. It has nothing to do with angle shooting.

I see your point about very late entries being an angle shoot, but at the same time, I want a lot of people to play the tournament and bloat the prize pool. It's all about the benjamins. About a year ago on another site I saw someone enter a tournament very late late with a starting M < 6. I certainly didn't see that stack as muck of a threat.

its not a few random fish buying into tourneys with <10bb, its rings of accounts buying in one level before the bubble and tanking/disconnecting every hand until they mincash...then shoving nash ranges until they ladder more

but this is okay because you arent going to get tired

got it

Too bad nothing ever gets sent to the top here, 500 unique players and theyll pay out 320 spots..

I received an approx $65 refund from foxrox, was he playing just tournaments?

Has anyone here received refunds from any of the other players in that list? It seems odds that 175k from foxrox was reimbursed yet the next player was 1.8k????

On a side note, i sattelited from the the step 2 6 buck to the 600, and since the step 6 on demands didn't run i emailed them and they made a mtt yesterday on a sunday with 3 seats guaranteed.

It had 10 minute blinds and 5k starting stack yet was labelled as a turbo and had 10 seconds to act preflop and 10 seconds timebank, that seemed ridiculous for a $630 buy in sattelite. i don't think ive ever seen a mtt with 10 minute blinds and 5k chips and 2 hours late reg be labelled a turbo, im pretty sure whoever created the mtt just ****ed up but they won't admit it.

Ofcourse acr won't budge on anything and they are always correct. It seemed ridiculous for that buy in mtt though. Also they never even acknowledged me for my idea to run a scheduled mtt for the step 6 since the on demand step 6's never run.

edit: i have also playeed a fair bit with nightstalker recently, im guessing he is another suspected bot?

This shouldnt be an issue. What tournament are you specifically talking about because i changed all the structures where this happened! thanks.



Names forwarded to security.


It shows as a turbo in the internal lobby because of the settings of the timebank. The time it takes for cards to be dealt etc etc. The steps all have that structure but yes the blind structure is non turbo. You say we wont budge and always correct but i dont see what is wrong here. I havent made it a 5 min blind structure crapshoot.

I admit that i made the preflop action and timebank that way on purpose yes.

Exactly.