EDIT*** title should say *televised* FTs

This can't be true , can it? Make a final table and have to wait weeks/months and travel to Las Vegas?

This is terrible, mind blowing actually.

https://www.pokernews.com/news/2018/...bles-30915.htm

Just as the World Series of Poker pivots away from delayed final tables, the World Poker Tour is pushing all in on them.

When the WPT announced a partnership with Esports Arena Las Vegas to host a series of final tables closing out Season 16, most figured it was an interesting one-off experiment. Take the state-of-the-art arena designed to host some of the biggest gaming competitions on the planet and plant a poker table in the middle. You've got a ready-made arena where poker fans could get a unique viewing experience, while Luxor gets some extra use out of the venue they spent over $25 million to build.

According to company brass at a dedicated media forum a few hours before the WPT Tournament of Champions final table, this is the start of a new direction for the tour's live final tables. Starting in Season 17, all televised WPT final tables will take place in Esports Arena.

"As soon as we saw this space, we knew this could really be a great opportunity," said WPT CEO Adam Pliska. "It allows us to give that sport experience. We are so proud that we will be able to use this facility in the future and do some innovative things coming up."

The Logistics
The WPT will have nine televised final tables in the upcoming season, Vice President of Global Tour Management Angelica Hael revealed. Hael said pending gaming commission approval meant she couldn't reveal which stops would be televised just yet, but the selections wouldn't come as a surprise to most poker fans.

When televised tour stops reach an official final table of six, play will halt, similar to the way things worked with the November Nine. Unlike the Nine, players won't be paid sixth-place money. Instead, they'll wait an unspecified period — Hael estimated three to six weeks — and then travel to Las Vegas courtesy of the WPT. There, they'll play out the final table and be paid at Luxor with Luxor handling applicable taxes.

Final tables can be expected to play out in groups in this fashion. That is, if there are a handful of televised WPT events in January and February, final table participants from those events will all convene in Las Vegas in, say, early March for consecutive final-table play downs.

As an example, look no further than this past week. The WPT Bellagio Elite Poker Championship $25K High Roller began in early May with the final six on pause until Friday. Then, Tom Marchese christened the venue with a victory worth $432,000. The very next day, the Tournament of Champions final table plays down to a winner.

"It makes total sense for the home of WPT final tables to be here," Hael said. "We firmly believe that by having our televised final tables in this facility, it will open a world of possibilities for the World Poker Tour."

Angelica Hael (L)
Angelica Hael (L) said it makes total sense for the WPT to bring final tables to the Esports Arena.
The Rationale
Everyone involved understands this represents a huge change and won't be popular with everyone. European players, for example, may not wish to fly back and forth across the ocean more times than needed. Recreational players with a busy working schedule may not be able to finagle two different blocks of days off.

WPT decision-makers took turns passing the spotlight around and explaining the reasoning for the move from various angles.

"We look for a win-win," said WPT Vice President of Marketing David Gitter. "Win for the players, win for the WPT and win for the sponsors."

For the players, especially recreational players, there's the opportunity to find coaching and get better in the intervening weeks. Many will also likely save money on taxes with Nevada having more favorable tax laws than most other states. There will be player parties and other activities set up by the WPT.

"You are going to feel like a star if you make a final table and you come to town," Pliska said.

Sponsors, of which the WPT has racked up an impressive amount — Gitter cited over 2,000 partnerships the company currently counts — will also find the Esports Arena an amenable venue. Video screens throughout the arena, including a massive 50-footer adorning the wall across from the viewing section, can provide a high-value platform for brands like Hublot, Zynga and Rockstar.

WPT sponsors
The WPT has built an impressive portfolio of sponsors.
For the WPT, and for poker as a whole, the arena represents an opportunity to cross-sell to a wider audience. Savage likened appealing to the esports demographic to online poker connecting younger audiences with the game in the early 2000s.

Pliska concurred.

"They are very complementary in a very unique way," he said. "It's a symbiotic relationship."

Hael said she didn't know how many esports fans would be interested in poker but she feels sure she sees crossover.

"I don't know if it's 50 percent or one percent," she said. "But if it's one percent, that's one percent we didn't have. As stewards of this industry, it's incumbent upon us to try to look for these sources."

Finally, Pliska added, broadcast partner FOX is fully on board.

Nearly every globally popular game, Hael pointed out, has a storied destination venue. Horse racing has Churchill Downs. Basketball has Madison Square Garden. Golf has Augusta National. The WPT hopes the Esports Arena Las Vegas becomes that destination venue for poker, and the company has pushed all in on it for Season 17.

It's an interesting idea. I wouldn't outright dismiss it. It sounds similar to the sort of thing GPL was trying to do, but superior in every way.

Maybe it's just a cost saving measure on WPT's part, so they don't have to build and break down sets all over the country. Still, there are other upsides to having a dedicated arena. Maybe they could hold other poker events there as well.

Maybe the Luxor could re-open a poker room even.

how is it a win for the players

Breakfast comped in Vegas.

super whack if true

I'm surprised gaming regulations even allow this for tourneys that start outside of Nevada.

Imagine being the short stack in 6th place, having to wait 4-6 WEEKS, then then you MUST FLY from X to Vegas to play, then busting in 6th and getting exactly what you would have got if the format remained the same.

Like rec players even play 10k lol, that arnt getting coaching or give a **** already. I like how they dismiss EVERY POKER PLAYER in europe as, "this idea might be unpopular to euro players" Yeah no **** it would be. Im canadian even but its just awful to read.

That is simply cancer. You know NONE of the TV ad revenue will go the players either. Disgusting.

How is this "win" to anyone but the cum guzzling ad sponsors of the WPT and the WPT themselves?

All valid points. Condescending to the industry, which is unfortunate -- but your feedback/reaction as a player/customer is 100% reasonable imo.

^^^
They get a free trip to Vegas and accommodation, but I can see this change discouraging more recs (especially Euro ones) from entering because of limitations on their time.

From their perspective (WPT), they probably feel as though the final table can secure sponsors with favorable deals considering these events are more of an anticipated spectacle than before and probably have big plans in mind with tv coverage at the arena.

Imho, whatever benefits the players do get from this change better be good to offset all the negatives (and they are big ones) as stated above by WateryBoil. I'm still indifferent about the whole poker as a sport thing and this trend is becoming more apparent in any new poker related companies/events such as the GPL and other tournament series played out in that fashion.

Vote with your wallet. If you don't like it, and I can see why, don't play. Make it costly for them.

Seems like a really dumb idea

I actually don’t like seeing the same damn set every episode. They travel around to all of the different casinos and it’s all the same at the end.

I liked the episodes in Atlantis that had final tables outside. They don’t have to be outside but would be cool if different venues had their own unique thing.

Are expenses taken from the prize pool?

Couple of issues here:

1. I can't add much to what WateryBoil wrote other than to reinforce a few small things. In short, it's a tough sale for recs. No, I don't think most employers would punish a person for wanting to go, but it's a harder thing to justify taking time off for when the money is way less life changing than it was a decade plus ago. Euro players now have to do a transatlantic flight, which sucks horribly.

2. The tax issue is dishonest. It is not a black/white issue as presented in the release.

3. The desire to create a "storied venue" is probably misguided.

A) Poker already has storied venues, and not all in Las Vegas. Limiting myself to America, off the top of my head: Binions, Bellagio, The Commerce, Foxwoods, Borgata. All of these are, objectively speaking, highly important in the history of the game. They're trying to create our of whole cloth something which already exists several times over.

B) WPT used to have several events in Vegas a year. In 2006, I believe, they had tournaments at The Mirage, Mandalay Bay, and Bellagio 3 times. Back then, in that setting, this might have made sense. Now, it just feels like they want to cut costs.

4. And I'm sure they do. WPT is on a hodgepodge of affiliate channels with no real set schedule. Like all poker programming, it isn't as lucrative. They seem to have overextended and lost some of the prestige they (at least appeared) to have.

If this is a cost-saving measure and the choice is between this or no televised final tables, who prefers the latter?

Care to elaborate?

As long as WPT is comping all of the travel & accommodation expenses with those fat ad revenue dollars why not.

I'm on a tablet, so I'll post some basic stuff and hope someone can help expand:

1. Some states require you pay tax on the state of residence.

2. Players who claim poker as income, at best, gain nothing. They are still earning money and are still going to have to claim federal, even if their state doesn't double dip.

3. I'm not sure it's clear where you earned it anymore. States could conceivably claim (I think) that the money was earned in their state.

Honestly, I thought that was the weakest of my four points so I'm a little embarrassed getting called on it and hope I didn't come off like an ignoramous.

At least it’s not a cruise.

Who cares? If they get the same attendance levels it's redundant but still all that really matters is ratings.

It's cost effective for them to have 1 permanent set and it will likely look a lot better.
It's possible it will get more people watching it on tv. That's better for the show than the actual attendance of the events.

The trouble with televised poker is it needs to be entertaining more-so than player friendly or the ratings will decline and you get diminishing returns. Television friendly and player friendly are not parallel interests.

There was a game company in the late 70's called SPI that sent out questionnaires asking their customers what types of games they wanted the company to make. They received the input and specifically catered to those returned questionnaires and soon they went out of business. The post mortem was that only the hardcore customers actually filled those things out and sent them back. The "vocal" community was small and dedicated but it wasn't close to a majority of the customer base who became alienated and stopped supporting the company.

Poker has similar problems. Rec players are critical to the game and rec players mostly want to play cause of television and television Poker generally sucks nowadays. That Esports Arena might help.

This is dumb, not sure a more elaborate post than that is required. This will lose lots of the players you would like to have in these.

Presumably all these televised tournaments will have started in USA, and not any other country. I can see people who do not need to pay taxes on Poker/gambling winnings being slightly miffed if their country doesn’t have a tax treaty with USA.

example, IF Barcelona is one of these events, and a citizen of a South American country makes the FT, they would likely not had to pay any taxes (legally). However, now instead the FT is in Vegas and all of a sudden they have to pay 25-35% (whatever it is) there, which they either won’t get back, or it will be a ton of hassle and cost them $$$. A player like this, especially short stacked, might be better off busting in 7th and getting paid out in Barcelona

This sounds like a terrible idea.

Here is a breakdown of the twenty WPT Season 16 events.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_...son_16_results

UNITED STATES
4 - Las Vegas, Nevada
3 - California
3 - Florida
2 - New Jersey
1 - Oklahoma
1 - Maryland

INTERNATIONAL
2 - The Netherlands
2 - Canada
1 - Germany
1 - China

The article linked in OP says that Season 17 will have a total of 9 televised final tables at the ESports Arena. From what I've seen on Twitter, it is assumed most (if not all) of the int'l final tables will still play out in those respective countries.