I depend on poker for side income. Because of this game, I am now debt free. Because of this game, I will be able to take my wife on the vacation of her dreams next October. Because of this game, I know that it is not likely that I will ever go hungry. I say this to assure you that I appreciate poker for what it's worth.

However...

Imo, the culture that has derived from poker is despicable. I don't know exactly what it is. I can't quite put my finger on it...just something unsavory. Though I can't express my overall reasoning, here are some petty griefs:

I hate all the intros to the televised poker shows (PAD, HSP, etc.)

I hate poker slang.

I hate the way in which the game is marketed by FTP and ESPN and others.

I hate how so much hype is put on such frivolous matters.

I hate the lore, the ambiance, the spirit of the poker world. It all just seems so artificial and materialistic to me.

The reason I post this thread is to open up a discussion. How can we improve the poker culture in order to appeal more to the general public, the good public? I think we are working to hard to attract the wrong crowd. How can we preserve the integrity of the game--for whatever it is worth, without over-hyping that which matters very little.

Insert your two-cents here.

Are you assuming that your feelings agree with the general public?

i personally hate penguins cant stands those little freaks of nature. BIRDS SHOULD FLY.

just my useless opinion that no one cares about anyone got anything else?

"Dear forum full of poker players,

I hate you all. You are all despicable. Please improve for me, I'm a baller. Please use this thread to list the ways in which you can improve.

Yours truly,

OP"


At least that's what I got out of the OP.

Here.

Man, if you think "poker culture" is bad now that it's a bunch of geeky gamers with no real-world work ethic controlling the Universe, imagine what it was when "poker" consisted almost solely of grifters, degenerates, con men, addicts, felons and thieves, back before the "boom". Considering the era she comes from, Joan Rivers was totally, totally correct in what she said on the Apprentice.

Poker by it's very nature will always draw a 'certain sort' of person and the ethos that evolves will probably be something you hope your kids aspire above, but you'd have to be pretty thin-skinned to 'hate' any of it. Undesirable? Yeah, kinda, maybe. We're basically a pond full of scum, only with a higher mean IQ than randoms off the street. Still, I don't think it's as bad as you're making it out to be.

love how u "depend on poker for side income" and will take ur wife on the "vacation of her dreams" and u "will never go hungry", yet u posted this just yesterday:

guess the vacation of her dreams is 2 days at the holiday inn down the road. but it's ok because in ur long 7500-hand poker career u've obv proven that u will always be able to make a living from poker if the economy gets any worse.

[ ] true story

You can't. Poker is gambling, and the public has the correct opinion of the game. Taking a shot at the WSOP is like going to the casino to play Roulette once a year. People usually don't have a problem with that kind of gambling.
But if you do it every day, you are either a degenerate gambler or someone who exploits degenerate gamblers. You can't and shouldn't have a positive image in public.
You can't have your cake and eat it.

Do you hate that ESPN and HSP etc... emphasize the money so much? I dont really get what your problem is.

A+ for effort and ownage

OMG this is gold from op...

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/78...myself-597482/

ive played for a living for 4 years. when i first started i loved all the tv poker, the cash game shows, i kept up with all of the big tournaments, and who was winning the most online.

now i basically feel the way you do, and think all of it is kinda bull****. i hate poker talk, poker on tv, most poker players annoy the **** outta me. and im also sick of every few months having to hear about some guy who ran hot for a meaningless amount of hands in some high stakes games who is now the new poker god.

...

Pelicans--horrible creatures. What are you: a bird, or a garbage disposal?

there you have it
I'm pretty sure you're not the only one to legitimely dislike that, and nobody really cares..

We're a young culture without a history of values to draw from - most new cultures are unsavory; what more do you expect?

attn all kids... Do not smoke crack! you will start to think like this!

I think this is because of the nature of the game. I mean the game is pretty damn materialistic, wouldn't you say? The marketing: How else would you advertise the game to a potential player? It IS the point, agreed? Would you offer them noble, aesthetic values? I mean you still want to take your wife to a vacation, but guess who's paying for it... "They" wanna take their wife to a vacation too... That much for materialistic. As for FTP advertising (the b/w commercials), I find it to be more tastefull, artistically interesting than %95 of most mainstream... But it is all a matter of taste, of course. Same goes for slang. Sure there is alot of bland stuff going on around, but I assign it to the nature of the game, where money, greed, aggression (emotionally "violent"?), seem to be above all. But so is most life around you. What matters is what YOU get out of it...

because no matter how much work you put into it,you could never convince anyone or yourself that what your doing matters or makes a difference in the world in the long run.
at the end of the day poker is just another game played to exploit other humans beings.

lets face it,if poker didnt exist,most 2p2ers would probably be fatasses playing wow or some other crap.

i would never quit poker though,i appreciate the extra money i get however small.

insert hater song by jay z here

OP dont open your mouth if you got no idea what you're talking about.

Good times

if only the higher IQ translated to real world intelligence.

what made poker cool was guys like farha and the other vegas pros, gamblers, degenerates etc. It gave the game a certain mystique. the general public looked at those guys and think back to the wild west days or whatever. people respect or admire or hold in awe of risk takers or things they cant understand.

......and theres the people that dont like them as well. this also gave it the taboo thing and that can be pretty cool.

but what you have now is night and day different. the game has been turned upside down. its not about the gamble any more. the mystique has been broken down into a mathematical formula. the game has been exposed and taken over by a majority of people that the general public is not fond of.

the image isnt one of risk taking gamblers any more and those that are in the know, really know how things like bumhunting have been taken to the extreme. the common image now is someone under 25 who looks nothing like what most people think of as gamblers. not only that, but their general behavior is not one of calm cool gamblers either.

funny how my cousin, who knows nothing about the game, admired someone like moon. he thought it was funny how the guy nobody respected and was an amatuer, conducted himself more like a true pro, when most of the other "pros" couldnt sit still when they are all in.

theres a lot more to it than just this but i think certain people will get the point. the others who dont are the ones that fall into the criteria of the new breed that isnt appealing to the general public.