I mentioned this in another thread a while back. I played pro for over 10years and now I own ecommerce stores, it has quite a lot of similarities - upswings/downswings, running ads is a gamble basically and you 'move up in stakes' when you scale ads. I have the same sort of lifestyle I did when I played poker, I outsource a lot and don't have to physically be anywhere. I do not dropship. In the leaner months when things arent going very well, I dont pay myself, pretty similar as to when you're in a downswing and dont cash out. I actually think poker has helped me tremendously for business, pyscologically. However I likely have applied some bad habits from poker that have hindered my growth because I think like a poker player too much and maybe not a businessman sometimes. I was actually going to do a thread about it as my stores have done over 7figs in revenue now and I think people would find it interesting but I dont really have the time. It is not easy, it is not a passive income, it's ****ing hard and stressful and very similar in lots of respects to poker.

Caddying

If you did well in math, and can wrap your hands around ICM and even basic GTO, I'd think you'd be well suited to be an actuary.

Yes, that’s the reason you get those jobs with bachelors degree in business.

problem is an actuary needs some credibility

i love these "business" degrees people speak of like that's a thing lol

and setting the bar pretty low assuming no poker players went to college

I know a number of people who have done very well over the past few years selling online. Lots of different models such as wholesale, retail arbitrage and online arbitrage. Here in the US (I'm originally from the UK) things such as credit card/gift card arbitrage and portals to increase margins.
I know some people who are successful with drop shipping but it normally involves direct relationships with the manufacturer or wholesaler rather than buying from a retailer or getting it sent directly from China. A lot of the people I know use virtual assistants to handle a lot of the tasks which I'm sure that's what you mean by outsourcing.

If you have a strong work ethic then running an online business is by far better than being a poker player which has IMHO diminishing returns on effort and a cap on earnings.
I have always said that if the worlds best Poker players put that kind of effort into other types of business ventures they would probably make far more money.
Poker works when there are good games running, the rest of the time you would probably be better doing something else.
That applies from the lowest to the highest stakes.

As for things like poker.

Casino Advantage player, lots of non-public stuff where you can get an edge over the casino from table games to even slot machines. Normally lots of travel and also have to have a thick skin. You will often wear out your welcome and most casinos are bad losers when you have the advantage.

Sports betting, This is my field, this is super tough, things constantly change as markets and bookies adjust. If you don't know WHY you have an edge on a bet, don't make that bet.
SB, like poker because of short term variance can make people believe they can beat it over the long term. (you almost certainly cant!)

Credit Card/ Gift Card arbitrage. This is work, its a grind. You can also wear out your welcome at various Credit Card companies and portals.
Far better to incorporate this into a real business with real expenses rather than using manufactured spending techniques.

FWIW The three things I have mentioned above, if you are good at them, will result in bans and exclusions.

I think the majority of poker players go to college and outside the US most of them don’t even drop out.

In the rest of the civilized world, being in college is somewhere between OK and ideal while playing poker. Took me 10 years to officially finish my MBA. Free quality health care and plenty of other benefits included while being enrolled. And obviously free to attend.

I believe it is becoming an athlete ... because you will dedicate yourself every day to what you love, you will have fun and you can still have great results as follows: the more you train than your opponent or for your competition the more chances you will have to be the best

Its such a long shot in most sports before you even make any money.
Look at what top class triple A players make. (these are in the top few percentile of athletes)

If you had the same work ethic in a business you love your chances of actually making a living are ridiculously higher.
In sports, talent often vastly outweighs work ethic.
In business, work ethic is much more important because people are inherently lazy so you have a big edge if you can out work them.

Even if you do make it to the higher leagues, its a short career and most blow through their money because they don't understand the discipline to build a business or career.

The same comparison is between somebody who is rich and somebody who has a lot of money.
Lottery winners are typical of people who have a lot of money, many go broke because they didn't earn it , build it up or even respect it.

yeah but you said you outsource a lot, so, yeah

Actually there are “General Business” and “Business Admin” programs. So yes Business decrees are a thing.

“Girls to you” card flipper/snapper hander outer dude on the strip.

What do you mean?

I outsource many aspects to professionals in their field (because I dont have the time to do it nor do I have the skills, or tenacity to do it) and pay them on a freelance basis, instead of having them employed. This is pretty common for ecomm. My customer service is in the far east for example. I have coders who can tweak things on an adhoc basis. My ads people are in the EU and I'm in the UK. Whats tough is that its ultra-competitive, ads are hit and miss and you will have a burn rate for periods of time when things dont go well, a downswing if you like.

It does sound like you are operating on thin margins. That's the problem in highly competitive fields/markets, its often a race to the bottom with prices, leaving little left over for expenses such as marketing and VA's.
One guy I know has a niche market of buying discontinued products so he doesn't have to worry too much about competition. He essentially makes his own market.

Lol you know nothing about my business. It's completely unique and we have a healthy GP and NP. The issue is CAC and the intricacies of that.

If you ever had the time I'd be really interested in this.

Any tips on where to look to start for someone completely brand new to that space?

this wasn't the point i was trying to make

an undergrad business degree doesn't open any doors that any doors that any other college degree opens

nobody hiring an entry level business analyst cares whether or not the person majored in philosophy or chemistry, they just want someone who can do well in the interview and prove themselves in the probationary period

People quit poker because there's no money left in it for them. If something is just like poker but they can make money, they will do it.

As far as poker players being able to do fine in most professions, I agree. However I'm guessing it's hard to get a job with poker as a resume and they are all simple minded people who can't see that being a poker player actually makes you more qualified then the rest.

Thank god for crypto. **** the man. I didn't feel like working for them anyway.

hard disagree on this for anyone < 30 and even then i know a number of people who wilingly left to pursue other things after 30, it's just a lot more difficult when you get older

it's a cliche and cliches often have a lot of truth behind them because we all know people who played for years, went busto, and now do something else

but we also all know a lot of people who transitioned out for non financial reasons

i personally made 1/4th the amount in my new 9-5 as i did in my last year in poker and don't regret it at all as I knew about this before making the transition

sure i'll always wonder where poker would have taken me if i stuck with it but even had i done that, I know it wouldn't have been permanent but rather just continuing another 2-3 years and the longer i stayed in the game the more difficult the transition would be

It is insanely hard to get a solid corporate job with an undergrad degree in 2021 if you're a recent graduate. I recently graduated near the top of my class from a very solid well-known school and spent a long time looking with no luck (obviously had many BS low paying offers that had no chance of upwards mobility, but why pick that over poker?). If you have a resume gap for poker you legitimately have no chance at getting a job at any reputable place without insane connections lol. I am only speaking from an American perspective here, but have European friends with similar struggles.

while i agree, this sounds pretty self fulfilling and just a pity party

1. competitive jobs are hard to get so should just play poker
2. it's now even harder to get those jobs because i chose poker

you sounds like homer


for what it's worth, this is 100% why i got out, i knew short term it was -ev but 20 years from now it would pay dividends

those who stayed when i left made far more money than me as a result

life doesn't come easy, it's a constant struggle and to expect for things to simply just work out without grinding for the results you want is absurd

i find it incredulous that as a group we are so good at taking responsibility in terms of investing in ourselves with paying for coaching, setting time aside for study, putting in the hours, living absurd schedules to grind the optimal winrate hours, etc etc and then once you stop talking about poker everything is so futile and pointless and all our problems are due to societal failure

it just shocks me how many people on 2p2 just lose all cognitive liberty once they remove poker from the discussion

if someone posted about how difficult it was to beat nl200 was and how so few of the pool actually succeeded and how awful everything was that person would be laughed at ridiculed here, yet the same people ridiculing those who claim the poker ecosystem is rigged against the masses make the same exact argument over the the actual ecosystem of life

remember fgators

Lol lots of psychoanalysis and assumptions here. Sure I likely would have found a job if I kept grinding it out and settled, but you make it sound like people can waltz into the office of a major corporation and get a job with just an undergrad degree. You are especially far removed from reality if you think a resume gap for poker HELPS your case.

Congrats on finding fulfillment in your career, but no need to hit me with an unsolicited motivational talk.

i never argued it helps, in fact i agreed with you

i'm just saying the "man it's so hard to get a job doing x" is so common here and finds very sympathetic audience but if someone made same complaint about beating nl200 everyone would laugh at him and say he isn't putting in the work to make it happen

at some point you gotta realize that what you're doing as a poker player is incredibly difficult and requires a massive amount of work and sacrifice

i'm merely pointing out that if you're able to overcome the difficulties and be a winning poker player, you can overcome the difficulties of transitioning into a non poker career as well - it's just not in your wheelhouse so it seems inaccessable

it's like the whole thing of people who grow up in neighborhoods where nobody suceeds will not suceed either because they just don't view it as a possibility, they'll see what their neighbors, family and peers do and do the same whereas the son of a doctor will grow up assuming they too will become a doctor - like college, few people make a conscious decision of whether or not to go to college when they graduate high school, they either grew up taking college as a given or grew up thinking find a job after high school was a given - very few make an actual decision

you are mostly around poker so only see poker

NL 200 is meritocratic. You cant "know a guy" and become the end boss.