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Originally Posted by Jackontheturn
I've seen Mason's writings on the "skill game" vs. "knowledge game" idea before, and I always felt it was a false dichotomy.
I've never written anything like "skill game vs. knowledge game." What I have written is that any game can be divided into two components. The (1) execution component and the (2) knowledge component. I've also said that in a game like tennis the execution component dominates and in a game like poker the knowledge component dominates, and that these differences makes the games very different.
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Of course there are sports with little or no strategic element like power-lifting or sprinting, where it's almost all down to physical conditioning. But in a complex sport like tennis, the "skill" elements like technique, coordination, and timing are mediated through mental circuitry. It isn't really that different from a mind-sport like chess or poker, the essence of the game is to process information about the game state and execute the optimal action.
Of course it's different. To be a top tennis player expect to spend thousands of hour just hitting backhands until it's automatic. This is almost all part of the execution component with the knowledge of how to execute a backhand being relatively small. Specifically, a good instructor can show you exactly how a backhand should be hit, and then you'll know. But it'll still take thousands of hours to become top notch at doing this. Poker is not like this.
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In tennis, factors such as physical prowess and conditioning influence your success, for which there is no analogue in poker. But I don't think there is really a fundamental distinction in terms of the nature of the mental processes at play in-game.
One quick counter example. In tennis, when an opponent hits a 120+ mph serve at you, how much time do you have to return it. Compare that to poker where at times players will take a relatively long time to make a decision.
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Arguably tennis also has a "knowledge" component in terms of the physical mechanics of executing the shots. You can spend hours hitting the ball against the wall to master the forehand and backhand. But it doesn't mean you'll be able to return your opponent's serve on set point - that's the mental game, being able to process information about your opponent's tendencies, his positioning on the court, the trajectory and spin of the ball, and so on, in real time. Similarly in poker, players memorize starting hand charts and learn the optimal bluffing frequencies in certain spots, but what separates the best from the rest is not the ability to recall such information from memory, but the ability to implement a decision-making algorithm in novel situations.
As a kid, I spent much more than just "hours hitting against the ball against the wall." You become able to return a quality serve, whether it's match point or not, threw thousands of hours of practice where something like this becomes automatic. Again, this is much different from tough poker situations.
Mason