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WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

05-12-2015 , 12:36 PM
No. But you can play HULHE here
WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot Quote
05-12-2015 , 03:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tenderloinig
My question then is would Claudico be less effective on a slower computer, say a normal laptop. Does it need a bunch of cores to use the endgame solver?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Ganzfried
Not gonna comment on the approach until after the competition concludes.
Hello Sam ... are you free to answer this question now: is it possible to let Claudico run on standard PC's / laptops ?
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05-12-2015 , 03:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcb08
Doug, I couldn't tell because you had glasses on, but were your eyes rolling when you tried to explain the 99 vs A4 aipf play to the professor?
Since this hand comes up all the time here: does anyone have the link to it ?
WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot Quote
05-12-2015 , 03:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gregorio
No. But you can play HULHE here
Cepheus is probably known to most of us itt, but interest in LHE is probably several magnitudes behind interest in NLHE for the huge majority here ... given Prof. Sandholms remarks in the Sept. CardPlayer interview, the question whether CMU is going to do something similar with Claudico than UoA did with Cepheus stands. Would be fantastic indeed, and hopefully someone from CMU notices the question and likes to answer ... thanks !!
WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot Quote
05-12-2015 , 03:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by redfin
I will take this bet.


Please escrow to my pokerstars account. If you happen to be right in 5 years I will send you $200 back. If the above terms are not met then it is a push. Please do not welch on this bet.
lol
WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot Quote
05-12-2015 , 04:03 PM
i guess the results are relatively good news.

they are at least 1 order of magnitude away from competing against top humans.

With any reasonable time limit imposed, that number is much larger.
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05-12-2015 , 07:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by +VLFBERH+T
Hello Sam ... are you free to answer this question now: is it possible to let Claudico run on standard PC's / laptops ?
Based on the fact that Microsoft sponsored the event, I fully expect Claudico's amazingly powerful and perceptive artificial intelligence will be built into the next incarnation of Windows.
Spoiler:
WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot Quote
05-13-2015 , 04:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adrenalineman
Sorry if it was already asked, but is this bot available on the internet for anyone to play against it ?
No, but a fellow AI is available at Neo Poker Bot. Neo placed third in the Annual Computer Poker Competition in 2012 in the HUNLHE "Bankroll Instant Runoff" section but has not done as well as CMU's Tartanian7 in subsequent competitions.

Last edited by TimTamBiscuit; 05-13-2015 at 04:36 AM.
WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot Quote
05-13-2015 , 04:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimTamBiscuit
No, but a fellow AI is available at Neo Poker Bot. Neo placed third in the Annual Computer Poker Competition in 2012 in the HUNLHE "Bankroll Instant Runoff" section but has not done as well as CMU's Tartanian7 in subsequent competitions.
So rigged. I got it down to $200 in about 10 hands then it sucked out on me three times in a row and I rage-quit.
WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot Quote
05-13-2015 , 10:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by +VLFBERH+T
Since this hand comes up all the time here: does anyone have the link to it ?
Doug would have to chime in with the exact link, as I only heard about it when he was speaking to the Professor. I believe that the crux of the hand was that Doug (99) 4-bet shoved after Claudico (A4o) made it 9K to go.
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05-13-2015 , 11:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerRon247
So rigged. I got it down to $200 in about 10 hands then it sucked out on me three times in a row and I rage-quit.
Bot has some glaring leaks. In an unrelated note, after about 75 hands, I stacked him after I 3b w/95bb stacks w/AxJc and c/minr a AKT all club flop and he got ai w/Ax5c.
WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot Quote
05-13-2015 , 12:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerRon247
So rigged. I got it down to $200 in about 10 hands then it sucked out on me three times in a row and I rage-quit.
confirmed bot is a fish
Spoiler:
WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot Quote
05-13-2015 , 12:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by .isolated
Bot has some glaring leaks. In an unrelated note, after about 75 hands, I stacked him after I 3b w/95bb stacks w/AxJc and c/minr a AKT all club flop and he got ai w/Ax5c.
Bot seems to jam all pocket pairs in the few rounds I played. He stacked me when I got it in with QQ vs his 88 and bot rivered an 8.
WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot Quote
05-13-2015 , 02:42 PM
I'm going to be on Dave Tuchman's "Under The Gun" Twitch podcast on CrushLivePoker tonight at 8pm pst discussing the Brains vs A.I. challenge. If you have any questions, please get in there in chat and I'll try to answer them.
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05-13-2015 , 03:41 PM
Quote:
or years, I've hoped that bot developers would discover unknown (perhaps seemingly heretical) truths about poker.
I don't understand this at all. Bot's will shortly thereafter infest online poker at an exponential rate. WR will drop and so will growth of online poker as a business.

From a pure curiosity standpoint I can understand interest in the subject but coming from the Head of Poker Communications at the worlds largest poker site, it's a bit depressing.
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05-13-2015 , 04:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WCGRider
Also to answer another question, Ive been asked pretty constantly if I am going to do this again. I am most likely not going to. It was way too hard for me and I took too much of a hit in what my expected value is elsewhere, not that 210/hr is bad, it just isnt really on the map with where I think I could most effeciently spend my time for how hard I had to work.
meh

You didn't do this for the money and you got more out of this than just 210/h (for yourself and the poker community)

The only thing I wonder is how long poker online will last now that bots are able to beat 99.99% of humans (and some more next year)
WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot Quote
05-13-2015 , 09:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by .isolated
Bot has some glaring leaks.
Yes, Bot has some glaring leaks. It is very easy to exploit. But it is fun to play!
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05-14-2015 , 07:28 AM
Ty 'statistical' Stewart
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05-14-2015 , 08:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimTamBiscuit
Yes, Bot has some glaring leaks. It is very easy to exploit. But it is fun to play!
Neobot's interface already seems so much nicer than the one our four humans had to put up with. Microsoft couldn't even copy that ...?!
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05-17-2015 , 01:37 AM
From UCLA's stats website
Quote:
The one-tailed test provides more power to detect an effect in one direction by not testing the effect in the other direction.
...
So when is a one-tailed test appropriate? If you consider the consequences of missing an effect in the untested direction and conclude that they are negligible and in no way irresponsible or unethical, then you can proceed with a one-tailed test. For example, imagine again that you have developed a new drug. It is cheaper than the existing drug and, you believe, no less effective. In testing this drug, you are only interested in testing if it less effective than the existing drug. You do not care if it is significantly more effective. You only wish to show that it is not less effective. In this scenario, a one-tailed test would be appropriate.
WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot Quote
05-17-2015 , 02:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimTamBiscuit
No, but a fellow AI is available at Neo Poker Bot. Neo placed third in the Annual Computer Poker Competition in 2012 in the HUNLHE "Bankroll Instant Runoff" section but has not done as well as CMU's Tartanian7 in subsequent competitions.
Is Neo Poker Bot a good example of what to expect from run-ins with todays bots at HU deep SNG and cash tables? Or are they much better now?

Seems like quite an easily exploitable tight-passive bot, so don't mind playing these all day.
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05-17-2015 , 04:37 AM
I thnk worrying over a one sided vs two sided t test is neither here nor there. A two sided test tests whether some value is different from zero in either direction and is almost universally used except in rare cases, particularly because it's more conservative. It's fine.

However, we know that if humans lost at 9BB/100 there's no way CMU would be going on about a statistical tie.

Also, it's not clear the assumptions of a t test are even met here. Each hand is not independent and identically distributed, particularly because humans play certainly depended on what came before. See Doug Polk getting tired.

Stats tests are useful but never perfect and not the be all and end all of anything. It's not clear they're appropriate here.

I think a Bayesian approach is better. For now, the evidence tells us humans are better. We can update our hypothesis when another challenge is run.m
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05-18-2015 , 12:30 AM
Are we sure that the bot improved it's play, or learned? After all, the programmers got to watch the action, then tweak the computer after each session. Just doesn't seem like a "true test" after learning that.

Here's the bot, play the bot, live with the results. Seems like there was some leak fixing as it went on.
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05-18-2015 , 08:42 AM
I'm going to start using statistical tie all the time now, anytime I lose.
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05-18-2015 , 09:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tultfill
I'm going to start using statistical tie all the time now, anytime I lose.
jeskola.net / poker (200bb) is another bot that has only pot size bets but is almost flawless otherwise. It is (or should be) virtually unbeatable. Claudico was probably (educated guess) >1000mb exploitable so there is a big difference.
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