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Old 04-29-2015, 11:51 PM   #876
Clayton
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

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Originally Posted by dodgybob View Post
Pretty sure they are Gunnar Optiks. I've got a pair and don't find them much good at all to be honest, although I got the clear lenses rather than yellow tinted.
yellow tint is clutch. similar logic with the program "flux" for PCs.
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Old 04-30-2015, 12:01 AM   #877
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

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Originally Posted by watergun7 View Post
It seems like one problem is vs a minbet the bot cannot check in position- so it has to calculate whole new ranges for bluff raising and is just overbluffing.
For sure and it seems like instead of being able to check back it is just folding to the minbet way too much on the river in 25bb+ pots
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Old 04-30-2015, 12:03 AM   #878
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

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Originally Posted by mythrilfox View Post
so...it seems we're seeing the bot show up with a lot of strange hands on these massive overbet shoves. most of these spots probably involve some shoving some weird (i.e. "bad" blocker) hands a very small % of the time, but - and i could just be succumbing to selective memory bias - that % feels like it's higher than it should be. it also feels like the humans are calling the shoves more than the 5-10% or whatever it would be at equilibrium.

also i don't really know how the algorithm works aside from the very general description of "the bot learns by playing against itself."

with those two qualifiers out about how ignorant i am about this, is it reasonable that these massive river overbet spots occur rarely enough and have a high enough standard deviation that it's going to take a very long time to converge to equilibrium on them, and that might explain why the bot screws them up?

if the bot is indeed overbluffing in these spots, it would also stand to reason that the bot is overfolding when the positions are reversed, otherwise it wouldn't perceive itself to be at equilibrium. that would indicate that the humans should be employing more massive overbet bluffshoves, but i don't think i've seen the humans 11x pot as a bluff a single time so far.

just spitballing here since i don't have much info to go off of
Actually the players have employed some overbet shoves much like the bot in certain spots. Well not like the bot but they do it lol
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Old 04-30-2015, 01:40 AM   #879
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

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Originally Posted by Frankie Fuzz View Post
If he folded there it seems pretty obvious that its strategy in that spot simply hasn't converged to equilibrium yet. In the hands it has played against itself (which is how it learned), it simply has not accumulated enough data to realize that calling is a dominant strategy to folding. Not really that surprising. Since Claudico is still far from GTO, there will be many of those spots. That one is just a bit more obvious to us humans.
I could be that bot folding some percenteges of KT.
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Old 04-30-2015, 01:53 AM   #880
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

Yes, the bots have a non-zero prob of every option on every street (except nuts presumably never folds or checks back on river).
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Old 04-30-2015, 02:06 AM   #881
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

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Yes, the bots have a non-zero prob of every option on every street (except nuts presumably never folds or checks back on river).
If by 'every option' you mean check, bet etc, then of course that's probably right.

If you mean 'every option with every hand' that's clearly wrong, or at least it should be. It should never employ a strategy that is strictly dominated. I'm sure it does, but it shouldn't.
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Old 04-30-2015, 02:37 AM   #882
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

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Originally Posted by dodgybob View Post
If by 'every option' you mean check, bet etc, then of course that's probably right.

If you mean 'every option with every hand' that's clearly wrong, or at least it should be. It should never employ a strategy that is strictly dominated. I'm sure it does, but it shouldn't.
The first is not even true. For example, i'm sure the bot does not have a triple check raise range on all board run outs. (As an extremely obvious example)
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Old 04-30-2015, 02:55 AM   #883
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

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Originally Posted by Nick_AA View Post
It's so funny when Doug is talking poker with the programmers and spectators....they try to (and probably think they do) know what they're talking about, but it's like Einstein discussion physics with a 5th grader.

He's doing a good job of not coming off condescending or sarcastic though.

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ahahah doug coaching a 60y old woman now this guy is funny
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Originally Posted by restorativejustice View Post
He really is coming off incredibly well.

He has more distractions than any other player, is crushing the game, and considers the stream and anyone around him when up against a big decisions in a way that both informs and entertains. I believe I have learned so much from this event that I feel fortunate to have come across it and been hooked by it. Congrats to all the players, but special well wishes to Doug here and for the rest of his career. He will be giving jcarver a good run as the new "KidPoker" for the Twitch age.

p.s.-- DC, please note that poker at the highest levels is still a game and can be fun win or lose. As Polk's passion for the game and life really is infectious, you may want to bump into him at the next High Roller.

This. Ive been a huge WCGhater but that have completely turned around now. I absolutely cheer for the guy nowadays, Ive given him mad respect as a player(you cant really look pass that no matter how much you dislike a person when you are as skilled as him) for a long time but hated him as a individual but his online persona =/ his irl persona and his irl persona is awesome, he is even over the top friendly with all the staff thanking several times for every service he recieves, I get that it is "std" but he doesn´t slip/forget once. WCGmom did a good job on that one.

Officially a WCGfan, no more dog pork for me.



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+1, an oasis amid the ******ed slapfights.
lol
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Old 04-30-2015, 03:11 AM   #884
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

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Originally Posted by TouchOfEVil View Post
This. Ive been a huge WCGhater but that have completely turned around now. I absolutely cheer for the guy nowadays, Ive given him mad respect as a player(you cant really look pass that no matter how much you dislike a person when you are as skilled as him) for a long time but hated him as a individual but his online persona =/ his irl persona and his irl persona is awesome, he is even over the top friendly with all the staff thanking several times for every service he recieves, I get that it is "std" but he doesn´t slip/forget once. WCGmom did a good job on that one.

Officially a WCGfan, no more dog pork for me.

LOL.
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Old 04-30-2015, 03:13 AM   #885
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

laugh, its the truth, as of for the most diehard isi fans
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Old 04-30-2015, 03:14 AM   #886
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

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laugh, its the truth, as of for the most diehard isi fans
LoL.
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Old 04-30-2015, 03:19 AM   #887
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

Yippee ki-yay mother****er

Spoiler:
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Old 04-30-2015, 04:00 AM   #888
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

shoutout to big dik dong for being a bit up overall while bjorn is up 272k with the mirrored hands
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Old 04-30-2015, 06:03 AM   #889
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

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Originally Posted by feedmykids2 View Post
dafuq, dong has J6 facing a river overbet on a J6432 board and says "I'm going to soul read it, it never has a straight here, it always value merges me, I think it has J4 or J2" and calls. Bot shows...J4.

SOULREADING THE BOT
Dong is so sick
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Old 04-30-2015, 08:48 AM   #890
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

i thought dog pork was a friendly nickname?!
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Old 04-30-2015, 08:49 AM   #891
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

Are the videos saved somewhere/a highlights show, or is it live stream only? Just found out about this, looks amazing.
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Old 04-30-2015, 08:50 AM   #892
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

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Are the videos saved somewhere/a highlights show, or is it live stream only? Just found out about this, looks amazing.
Yeah, if you go to twitch there will be links where you can replay past sessions.

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This message is hidden because mack's is on your ignore list.

Last edited by tultfill; 04-30-2015 at 09:11 AM.
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Old 04-30-2015, 09:54 AM   #893
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

All the random questions from curious casino guests are gold on Dan Polk's stream.
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Old 04-30-2015, 11:10 AM   #894
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All the random questions from curious casino guests are gold on Dan Polk's stream.
Yeah Diego Polk is truly awesome.
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Old 04-30-2015, 11:13 AM   #895
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

Just incase this wasn't already posted:

100k sponsorship money for the event
10k fixed payment for each of the 4 players (40k)
Remaining 60k to be distributed amongst the 4 depending on amount won from bot

Seems very low for these top players to accept but I assume they make up the value in whatever information they learn from playing the bot, and whatever sidebets they may have
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Old 04-30-2015, 12:00 PM   #896
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

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Originally Posted by ironandwine View Post
Just incase this wasn't already posted:

100k sponsorship money for the event
10k fixed payment for each of the 4 players (40k)
Remaining 60k to be distributed amongst the 4 depending on amount won from bot

Seems very low for these top players to accept but I assume they make up the value in whatever information they learn from playing the bot, and whatever sidebets they may have
I assume the rooms are also comped (along with all those redbulls).

Don't forget they also get an opportunity to learn more about AI and make valuable contacts for the future that can only help their own play.

As for Doug, he has rehabilitated his reputation tremendously (I believe outside of his play I only knew him as someone people called a d-bag) by how personable he has come across and passionate for the game.

Certainly, I can think of no better ambassador for the game from the high stakes levels than him and PStars or someone else would be wise to lock up almost unarguably the best Heads Up No Limit player who also happens to have a great personality (Sorry, DC but guys who win 18Million and can't break a smile don't qualify. Sorry, Jungle, but guys who keep finding themselves indirectly associated with scandals, are rude to hotel staff, or come across after a loss as someone that might actually snap and try to kill his opponent are not in high demand).

Go humans: good for the game and good for the species.

Last edited by restorativejustice; 04-30-2015 at 12:07 PM.
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Old 04-30-2015, 12:04 PM   #897
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

Doug just got it in preflop with K3o, claudico had A3s
Hand 99 or 100, I didn't see all the action because the stream just loaded but assume it was a misclick somehow?
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Old 04-30-2015, 12:05 PM   #898
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchOfEVil View Post
This. Ive been a huge WCGhater but that have completely turned around now. I absolutely cheer for the guy nowadays, Ive given him mad respect as a player(you cant really look pass that no matter how much you dislike a person when you are as skilled as him) for a long time but hated him as a individual but his online persona =/ his irl persona and his irl persona is awesome, he is even over the top friendly with all the staff thanking several times for every service he recieves, I get that it is "std" but he doesn´t slip/forget once. WCGmom did a good job on that one.

Officially a WCGfan, no more dog pork for me.


lol
Most impressive for me is not that he "doesnt/slip forget once" but more that it looks verry natural to him and he don t have to force himself, the guy looks genuinly cool and that s much cooler than someone trying to look cool.
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Old 04-30-2015, 12:13 PM   #899
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

Being confident of one's abilities =/= dbag.

Doug has come across as someone who believes he is the best NLHE player on the planet, but never as a dbag.
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Old 04-30-2015, 12:14 PM   #900
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Re: WCGRider, Dong Kim, Jason Les and Bjorn Li to play against a new HU bot

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Originally Posted by TouchOfEVil View Post
Yippee ki-yay mother****er

Spoiler:
Some of claudico's play reminds me of isi, actually (ironically?).
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