Antonyms: ... vocation, profession, work...

If poker is their main source of income than they're just stating a fact. It should give them status within the poker community, or in other words, if winning pros don't have status in the poker community, then who does? Losing whales?

Maybe it's not glamorous, but if being a pro isn't even admirable on this site...well I dunno, it just strikes me as being on some self-hating kick. (Maybe not hating yourself personally if you aren't a pro, but throwing shade on some of your fellow 2+2ers who are.) As if to say it's cool to like the game as a hobby, but if you're passionate enough, and good enough, to choose to play for a living it's no longer cool.

Matthew Janda is a self-confessed rec (it's right there in the introduction to No Limit Holdem for Advanced Players)

...poker theory remains his favourite hobby...now a fourth year podiatry student...

Kinda ironic some of the gto zoomers on here getting their skillz from one of us part time, casual, recreational, I mypokerzhobby brigade.

Is actually a good description for many. Old guy, can't beat the rake but likes hanging out at the office drafting an occasional will, drinking cofee and sharing old war stories with other hangarounds or some other variation of the standard poker reg.

Fly,

Ask a failing lawyer getting repo'd if he gaf what went into the calculation. Bleeding to the rake, getting sued for malpractice (talk about losing money at your job!), not drumming up enough action. Doesn't make any difference when the bills come due.

That's how silly these rec/amateur/reg/pro/semipro/xyz rants are.

It's easy to pick apart a simple concept if one strives to be obtuse.

My point was pretty simple. A lawyer works an hour for a will, he bills his client for an hours work. I made it pretty clear I'm only talking about the actual work product, not the miscellaneous expenses you keep talking about.

A pro poker player works for an hour, he may lose 100bb. That's before paying for an over-reached mortgage or sky high rent, weekly eight-balls, massage parlors, losing pit action, etc. etc. But I don't care about all that.

Lawyers/Plumbers/Accountants/Machinists work for an hour, they get paid for an hour. Poker Players work for an hour, and may pay somebody else for that pleasure. Really wasn't a tough concept to grasp.

FYP

you should know

It is a stupid concept though. One of the big advantages to pro poker player is low overhead. Lawyers/Plumbers/Accountants/Machinists all have larger overheads (assuming they are on their own - if they work for a firm/company, or even are partners in the firm/company, then that is not the case, but even then the overhead will decrease what they end up making). "Just ignore the overhead for my point" makes it not an accurate point.

Also, lawyers/plumbers/accountants don't even always get paid for the hours they bill.



I get your point though. But it's just a little disingenuous to assume they get 100% of their billable amount and not consider their overhead. Obviously, pretty important to consider overhead when trying to make some money.

Why do we have to be politically correct in what we call them. Either call them fish or whales ffs.

Why not? It's not like you are saying it to their face. It's just what the are. Skip all the politically correct bs.

Hang out your own shingle in any of those professions and see if you feel the same way.

If a lawyer pays a couple hundred k for an add, sits in his office waiting for that call or knock on the door and keeps coming up empty do you really think he "worked an hr, got paid for an hr" any more than your poker player example did?

Any time you strike it out on your own you take major risks. Poker player on his own is n't any more unique to an hourly employee than any other profession.

If two lawyers go heads-up in a court case, they’ll both probably get paid. At least, one isn’t guaranteed to lose money.

Partial grunch, I read most of the first page but I don't understand all the emotions. To me rec is more descriptive than fish or donk as "rec" players often have common leaks. There are many kinds of fish and donks, and I would argue winning rec players can even exist. When I hear "rec" I think it just implies they:

• Play a low volume of sessions / hours

• Do not actively try to improve their game through coaching / reading / etc.

Doesn't necessarily mean they are terrible? As many point out are also regs that aren't pros that can also be quite good or quite terrible. Why isn't more information better when you're describing a V?

We can call recs brothers or wingmen too. I totally agree that rec as definition is very offensive and wrong.

I think the bulk of people are misinterpreting OP. He is implying that 2p2 incorrectly uses the term rec player to describe a bad player. By definition the adjective recreational, does not indicate a level of skill, but instead a level of enjoyment.

I am a recreational player. In my free time I play poker, study poker, and work to improve my game. It is what i do for fun. I also happen to be a winning player, the terms are not mutually exclusive.

A professional player’s primary source of income is poker. There are times when he rather not play, but does so anyway because he needs to make a living. A rec player on the other hand, would never play poker if they rather do something else.

I think we need to stop using rec player to indicate someone bad, and instead use another adjective (take your pick).

I like casual player , sounds better than rec , if i were a fish i would like to be called casual player xd.

Grunching, but I always interpreted the terminology as:

Rec: plays mainly for fun, with no real ambition to use poker as a steady form of income.

Semi-pro: Someone that takes poker seriously and uses it as some form of second income, while maintaining another job.

Pro: Someone that uses poker as either a predominant or entire form of their income.

I don't think referring to a 'villain' as a rec is inferring that you yourself are a pro, but more a way of conveying that your opponent doesn't treat poker as any serious form of income.

Recreational doesn't mean fish.... A rec could destroy a pro.

View: this stupid thread went on longer then it should have. We are all now stupider for having posting in it.

OP tagged as "rec" now.