Well i really don't know what/where tom dwan at the moment is, i just don't believe he is a bad or a scummy person, based on all that i saw, heard, read about him in interviews and televised poker in the past, i could be wrong but i really think/hope he is not, try to imagine what a roller-coaster of a life this guy got/had the last 9 or 10 years, i tried but i really can't come close i think, the guy became a multi?-millionaire in such a short time, at such a young age, and in the world of gambling no less, that is a world on his own and not a easy one i can tell you that much it's takes a heavy toll on your body and mind, but hey i never met the guy, i can only say time will tel, but almost never the whole story/truth, so to answer your questions, dishonest scammer i think/hope not, a broke sucker i hope not.

He if you don't like what you see or read you just have to click one time, and then the tread is closed, for you at least OL

Go eat pile of poop

Assuming Tom was essentially broke at the time of the LHE bot bets, how was he able to make these bets without freerolling the other parties?

Is there anything stopping you from clarifying Tom's financial status or making logical assumptions from the information you have?

tom did

Jungle, in light of the 400k cross book loss that you're keeping... what do you consider Tom's current debt balance with you?

Wow. So you are claiming Tom told you Ivey vouched for his (Tom's) 1.5M in leu of escrow, but later learned from Ivey himself that he had done no such thing. And now it's impossible to get Tom to agree to anything because the arbitrators have zero leverage against him...

That's rather damning, if true. Are you sure this wasn't just miscommunication? "Don't worry, Ivey can vouch for me" became "Ivey vouched for me," etc., etc.

And perhaps on a slightly related note, if you feel you are getting closer to resolution, it might be time to stop communicating...

like 4 million and counting...

That's not how vouching works.

lol.

So Tom used Ivey's name in vain ... Doesnt the bible say something about it ?

Si

Not sure but I do think I recall that he was one of the people who bailed Phua out.

Also is Tom 20mm+ in debt or in makeup? Those are very different scenarios.

I find it hard to believe that people would extend him that much in loans, but I suppose that based on the size of the games of he's playing in and how obscenely rich some of the people he plays w/ are, it's not out of the realm of possibility. Tom also doesn't strike me as the type of guy who go that far into debt w/o knowing he'd be able to pay it off at some pt, but who knows, could be the old "as soon as I go on a big upswing, I'll be able to dig myself out of my hole" scenario

+1

Is tom dwan a scammer? Let's see, it's taken 4+ years to complete a challenge that should have taken 2-3 months? And hasn't created contact with the person he owes money to and keeps avoiding him? Yep that definitely classifies as a scammer.

Jungle also stated that he called Ivey and Ivey said that he did not vouch. BS BS BS.
My opinion, not a fact is....

Ivey vouched via Trincher. Jungle might of known or maybe did not find out until the end. Not sure. But the phone call in my opinion is BS. Can you see why that it the most ridiculous thing jungle wants fanboys to believe. His Correction. bS.
Let's see Jungle calls Phil.
Hey Philemthis is cates
Hey cates what's up?
Nothing much Phil, just wanted to see if you remember vouching for Durr
No I did not vouch for him
Ok Phil, sorry to bother you I must be wrong and need to make a correction.
Ok jungle see you later man
Ok phil good luck

Really? You guys can't believe this happened. Never happend. I think jungle is fibbing after having to deal with Dwans real backers at the time. Trinchers.
Whatever jungle.
Why you so silent now.

the new figure being reported is actually $400billion of debt that durrrr is in. Nobody is sure if the figure is from backing or loans or a combination of the two, but somebody mentioned the number in an NVG thread, so you should definetly be considering it to be 100% indisputable fact.

Robl put up the $1mm in cash, Tom was just in court with Phua.

I think it was not too long ago (maybe a month) there was a photo leaked of Dwan sitting with over 2mil in front of him at one of the private Macau games. So no matter what, he's still touching millions of dollars and playing in the highest stakes games.

400 billion? Are you sure you haven't added a few too many zeros?

Macau money isn't exactly real money

Yes, HKD is real money. Not sure what you're trying to say.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuDOLeb3e80

I believe, just my opinion that the pic of Tom was over a month ago. Aledgedly, still Trinchers horse. What a terrible spot to be in. Feel bad for him.

Yeah obviously any # thrown around nvg is highly suspect and likely to be pulled out of thin air. One of the guys who mentioned it didn't necessarily seem reliable, but also didn't seem like a clear railbird troll tho.

I guess I should have asked, this 20 million+ he is allegedly in debt, is that money he owes or money he's in makeup for on a stake?

I also have to say, I'm very curious what all this information that people are keeping secret about the situation is, and will be very interested to read about it if it ever gets aired out. (ie the stuff jungle said a day or two ago in this thread he doesn't want to delve into because it involves other poker players he's friendly with)