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Old 06-07-2006, 06:44 AM   #201
bernie
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
as I was under the impression you are a top-notch limit player,
Your impression has changed?

I see a big part of his bad run was losing a good portion of his roll due to non-poker related events. Even great players will be psychologically affected by that sudden turn of events. Not sure what that has to do with being a top notch limit player.

b
Well, his roll appears pretty low for a top-notch player, and at stakes where he can't make all that much $$$ live, which brings me to why is he playing live for a living when online is so much more profitable? I thought he was playing 40-80+ for some reason.
I can imagine a few 'personal situations' that could cripple a BR. Again, this has nothing really to do with being a top-notch player. However, money-wise, it could be said that maybe some more advantageous opportunities weren't taken advantage of(online, as you mentioned. However, many players that started out as live players like live better than online even though they can still make more online. I'm one of them. Online compared to live is like watching paint dry). Or one may not play as often as one would think(one nice thing about playing higher limits is you don't have to grind as many hours to make the same amount on a lower limit table) I don't know. Who knows. But that has nothing to do with playing ability.

b
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Old 06-07-2006, 06:48 AM   #202
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

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now at the end of 5 years you are playing 1/2NL at Caesars???
I'd guess he's at that limit because he's getting used to NL and learning more about it. One shouldn't just jump into a higher NL game after concentrating on limit for so long.

He might also still be alternating between his normal limit game and NL.

b
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Old 06-07-2006, 05:33 PM   #203
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

Very nice posts Dynasty, enjoyed reading your story. Best of luck in the future, I'm sure you will be crushing 10/20 NL in the future.
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Old 06-08-2006, 06:01 PM   #204
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

surf,

"no hating here...I just want to confirm this timeline...b/c this is some very depressing $hit..."

The thing is, Dynasty's story is probably way more common than people think. It's just that most guys who are in his situation (grinding as a pro for five years as a winning, but not top-level player, making enough to pay the bills but not much more) aren't prominent posters who are writing about their experiences.

A lot of the aspiring pros around here should pay attention to Dynasty's story.
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Old 06-09-2006, 12:13 AM   #205
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

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surf,

"no hating here...I just want to confirm this timeline...b/c this is some very depressing $hit..."

The thing is, Dynasty's story is probably way more common than people think.
Not only that, but good players who go broke after some years of playing is way more common than many people probably think, too.

Quote:
It's just that most guys who are in his situation (grinding as a pro for five years as a winning, but not top-level player, making enough to pay the bills but not much more) aren't prominent posters who are writing about their experiences.

A lot of the aspiring pros around here should pay attention to Dynasty's story.

Yes, and there are many worse stories out there, too. We just don't read them on the forums for the most part.

Here are a few more things aspiring pros might want to consider:

-Most players underestimate the "long run", as well as how long they can run bad

-Most players underestimate how much their own play deteriorates when they are under the weight of running bad. That deterioration in play can greatly affect expected win rates, and therefore it can greatly affect how long the bad run can last.

-Most players have leaks or "personal management flaws" in some way or another.

-Just because someone is a good player, does not "entitle" them to win 1 big bet per hour (live) or 2BB/100 hands (online) or whatever. It's not like being a carpenter.

-Beating the other players *and* beating the rake for enough to pay the bills is not all that easy in the long run. Sure it looks and feels easy when you are running pretty decent. Sure it looks and feels easy when you are sitting with donkeys and you are not running bad. Will the games always be this good? I don't think so.

-There are a lot of good players who have started playing poker in the last five years and are now playing professionally. A high percentage of them are destined to go broke at some point in the future.

edited: (FWIW, I don't think Dynasty is one of those destined to go broke at some point. But I would also guess that few of today's recent crop of pros are as level-headed and methodical as Dynasty).
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Old 05-10-2007, 12:39 AM   #206
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

Year 6?
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Old 05-10-2007, 01:01 AM   #207
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas


Someone needs to tell this guy about online poker. I cannot fathom why anyone would play something like 10-20 live, let alone 1/2 NL.

(And yes I skimmed enough to know he has some online experience.)
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Old 05-10-2007, 01:26 AM   #208
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

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Someone needs to tell this guy about online poker. I cannot fathom why anyone would play something like 10-20 live, let alone 1/2 NL.

(And yes I skimmed enough to know he has some online experience.)
Good point--I guess people who are 8-tabling need to be told about that online option. Did you miss the post where he said:

By the end of May, I had invested about $3,000 in a new computer and two of those ever popular Dell 2001FP monitors. I intended to jump into 8-tabling. First, I would do it at low-limits to get used to the mechanics of it. Then, I would move up when I thought I had the mechanics down pat.

In June and July of 2004, I played exclusively online except for a road trip I made to the Commerce with Clarkmeister and Ed Miller. It was just 3-6 on Party Poker (and skins). But, by 8-tabling, I was making more than $60/hour. Considering it was just 3-6, I had to be happy with the win rate. It was already more than I could reasonably expect to make in a live 20-40 game and it had considerably less variance.

Parts of online play were fun. Getting 10-12 times as many hands per hour ensured there weren’t any dead periods. If I wasn’t dealt a good hand at the moment, I only had to wait a few minutes before one would show up. On the other hand, there wasn’t the social atmosphere of the live game. Online play was definitely going to be a part of my career repertoire. But, it was only going to be a part. I intended to mix in live games as well after sorting out what I wanted to do online.

and the one where he said:

Entering the summer of 2005, I was in a comfortable bankroll situation. I had been playing exclusively online and having steady success as an 8-table full ring game limit player (3-6 and 5-10 with the occasional 15-30).
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Old 05-10-2007, 01:33 AM   #209
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

Quote:
Quote:

Someone needs to tell this guy about online poker. I cannot fathom why anyone would play something like 10-20 live, let alone 1/2 NL.

(And yes I skimmed enough to know he has some online experience.)
Good point--I guess people who are 8-tabling need to be told about that online option. Did you miss the post where he said:


Yeah I should have spent two hours reading this monstrosity of a thread before dropping a sarcastic one-liner.
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Old 05-10-2007, 03:45 AM   #210
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

cool, i just read all the 3 past years. they've been good reads but have only convinced me more that anyone who plays poker professionally must be sadistically insane.

year 6!
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Old 05-10-2007, 05:39 AM   #211
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

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cool, i just read all the 3 past years. they've been good reads but have only convinced me more that anyone who plays poker professionally must be sadistically insane.

year 6!

Meh... all I can say is experiences greatly vary.
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Old 05-10-2007, 10:30 AM   #212
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

I find it interesting that so many people struggle with the idea of taking the plunge. For anyone who has started their own family I make an exception. But really what do you risk?

I made the decision to become a professional at the start of the year and don't regret it a bit. Most of my friends think I'm a nutty gambler and it doesn't bother me (though my closest friends are beginning to acquire an understanding).

I often try to explain to people that I am not a risk-taker. That I am in fact risk-averse. To me the proposition of working 9-5 and hating my life for the next 40+ years is an extremely risky play. Taking a shot at something I enjoy and may provide some long-term fulfillment? A shoe-in.

People say oh my god, what if you lose your whole bakroll? Big deal. Having just graduated from college, if I'd taken a crappy job I'd spend a lot of my money on new clothes and piss the rest away on booze out of frustration and unhappiness. If I lost my bankroll I'd have the same amount of money I'd have working a job. Effectively $0.

Someone suggested that taking this big "chance" could lead to one being homeless? WTF.

If you lose your bankroll (which should be fairly improbably with correct bankroll management) you GET A JOB. If you're an intelligent person with a degree I'm sure a company somewhere will give you one.

My advice is to take the decision to turn pro seriously, but take a shot if others aren't dependant on you. What do you really risk? Not much. Follow logic and never go into debt and you'll be fine. Just accept that you'll have to go back to a job if things don't pan out.

But, if you truly are an intelligent person and a reasonable poker player wirh discipline, you won't go broke. Seriously, you might not make any money, but you won't do much worse than break-even.

Yes sometimes poker gets boring and I think, maybe I should get one of those job things. But then I realize that I'd have to get up each morning and face the stresses of employment.

To the poster who said discipline cannot be learned, I believe you are incorrect. Disipline is not genetic in the least. Discipline can be learned through exercise, desire and practice.

"Man can do what he wills, be he cannot will what he wills."

If you truly have the drive to succeed in a given field and make x amount of $ I believe it can be done. But a passing thought of, "Geez I'd love to make 10 million" is not enough. If you will something strongly enough it will happen, within reason.

I'm drunk and rambling, but there is some truths in my thoughts.
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Old 05-10-2007, 10:57 AM   #213
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:

Someone needs to tell this guy about online poker. I cannot fathom why anyone would play something like 10-20 live, let alone 1/2 NL.

(And yes I skimmed enough to know he has some online experience.)
Good point--I guess people who are 8-tabling need to be told about that online option. Did you miss the post where he said:


Yeah I should have spent 30 minutes reading only Dynasty's posts in this thread before dropping a sarcastic one-liner.
Yeah, pretty much.
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Old 05-10-2007, 11:15 AM   #214
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

thanks for the bump, I never read this before.
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Old 05-10-2007, 11:58 AM   #215
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

six!
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Old 05-10-2007, 12:38 PM   #216
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

That post f'in rawked. Well done man, all the best.
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Old 05-10-2007, 02:05 PM   #217
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

Im looking forward to the 07 update
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Old 05-10-2007, 08:24 PM   #218
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

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Year 6?
I wasn't planning on writing anything up. With so many people having gone pro over the past three years, the story isn't nearly as unique.

If I had written "Two Years in Las Vegas" in 2003, my story would have been remarkably rare on the forums. In 2004, the boom had been well under way but my story was still fresh. Today, we apparently have some people running the equivalent of poker sweatshops.

But, if there's genuine interest, I'll get to it in the next week.
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Old 05-10-2007, 08:29 PM   #219
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

Not a whole lot of these people are living in Vegas and (assuming this is still what you are doing) playing live for a living... I for one, would definitely love to read it...
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Old 05-10-2007, 08:38 PM   #220
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

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...I for one, would definitely love to read it...
as I have loved reading the others!

--------------Meow

PS. Would also love to learn what you have learned, the biggest mistakes you have made and the top 5/10 things you would do if you were to go pro today, know what you know now. Thanks!
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Old 05-10-2007, 08:54 PM   #221
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

<---Also would love an update

Great thread
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Old 05-10-2007, 10:03 PM   #222
Bubba Versace
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

Quote:
I find it interesting that so many people struggle with the idea of taking the plunge. For anyone who has started their own family I make an exception. But really what do you risk?

I made the decision to become a professional at the start of the year and don't regret it a bit. Most of my friends think I'm a nutty gambler and it doesn't bother me (though my closest friends are beginning to acquire an understanding).

I often try to explain to people that I am not a risk-taker. That I am in fact risk-averse. To me the proposition of working 9-5 and hating my life for the next 40+ years is an extremely risky play. Taking a shot at something I enjoy and may provide some long-term fulfillment? A shoe-in.

People say oh my god, what if you lose your whole bakroll? Big deal. Having just graduated from college, if I'd taken a crappy job I'd spend a lot of my money on new clothes and piss the rest away on booze out of frustration and unhappiness. If I lost my bankroll I'd have the same amount of money I'd have working a job. Effectively $0.

Someone suggested that taking this big "chance" could lead to one being homeless? WTF.

If you lose your bankroll (which should be fairly improbably with correct bankroll management) you GET A JOB. If you're an intelligent person with a degree I'm sure a company somewhere will give you one.

My advice is to take the decision to turn pro seriously, but take a shot if others aren't dependant on you. What do you really risk? Not much. Follow logic and never go into debt and you'll be fine. Just accept that you'll have to go back to a job if things don't pan out.

But, if you truly are an intelligent person and a reasonable poker player wirh discipline, you won't go broke. Seriously, you might not make any money, but you won't do much worse than break-even.

Yes sometimes poker gets boring and I think, maybe I should get one of those job things. But then I realize that I'd have to get up each morning and face the stresses of employment.

To the poster who said discipline cannot be learned, I believe you are incorrect. Disipline is not genetic in the least. Discipline can be learned through exercise, desire and practice.

"Man can do what he wills, be he cannot will what he wills."

If you truly have the drive to succeed in a given field and make x amount of $ I believe it can be done. But a passing thought of, "Geez I'd love to make 10 million" is not enough. If you will something strongly enough it will happen, within reason.

I'm drunk and rambling, but there is some truths in my thoughts.
Good post.
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Old 05-10-2007, 10:04 PM   #223
Bubba Versace
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

Dynasty...update for sure...

Good read today while I was at work.
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Old 05-11-2007, 04:15 AM   #224
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

Another vote for an update.
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Old 05-11-2007, 04:39 AM   #225
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Re: Three Years in Las Vegas

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Another vote for an update.
Yep
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