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shady dealings from partypoker LIVE shady dealings from partypoker LIVE

10-09-2018 , 05:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Logical user
I wonder if the primary beneficiary of this arrangement (BRS) has deleted it's online profile because of the publicity this is getting. What are the legalities of Party having such an agreement? I'm going to go out on a limb and say they are probably breaking some rules of their gambling license and this is why BRS has deleted their website and social media etc. The BRS guys are however still playing.
This is shady as **** if true (not doubting, just haven't verified it). Any self respecting poker journalist should be asking these questions to Tom Waters, Mike Sexton or John Duthie next time they talk to them.

The "new" party are obviously using a lot of Stars c. 2011 strategy, so they should also be as transparent as the old Stars was. There's obviously something underhanded going on here and they never discuss it publicly. It's occasionally touched on, I think Duthie did on Joey's podcast, but in a vague and completely dismissive manner.
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10-09-2018 , 12:13 PM
i won a seat to german millions.. through a free ticket.. then realized i couldnt cash it in.. and left forever. like people in canada playing 5 dollar buyins are going to be like, okay, off to germany
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10-09-2018 , 01:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NooooBingo
This is shady as **** if true (not doubting, just haven't verified it). Any self respecting poker journalist should be asking these questions to Tom Waters, Mike Sexton or John Duthie next time they talk to them.
The "new" party are obviously using a lot of Stars c. 2011 strategy, so they should also be as transparent as the old Stars was. There's obviously something underhanded going on here and they never discuss it publicly. It's occasionally touched on, I think Duthie did on Joey's podcast, but in a vague and completely dismissive manner.
I'd like to see a journalist with the courage to do this. Of course it could be the end of their own careers and in this business no one's going to help you then so think wisely.
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10-09-2018 , 01:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Logical user
This has been going on for a few years in almost every mid-high stakes mtt on party every single day of the week. They are essentially running a stable both online and live. At least some of the guys in these stables are getting very preferential treatment online (high rake back percentages, multiple accounts, and generally more leeway from party to behave in an unethical manor).

I wonder if the primary beneficiary of this arrangement (BRS) has deleted it's online profile because of the publicity this is getting. What are the legalities of Party having such an agreement? I'm going to go out on a limb and say they are probably breaking some rules of their gambling license and this is why BRS has deleted their website and social media etc. The BRS guys are however still playing.

I'm not sure how party expect regs to keep using their own money on the site while a huge percentage of the player pool is getting 30-40% roi completely risk free in so many tournaments. Whats fair about that? How do you think the recs feel about that?

The whole business plan as it is seems to be extremely high risk, very amateurish and short sighted. Some naive people in the upper echelons of party management have in my opinion been manipulated by some greedy stable owners.

I do still play on party, but myself and many other regs are seriously re considering whether its worth the risk. I sincerely hope that party is a long term success, but their current business practices are very unlikely to lead to that.
Excellent post and agree with all of it.
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10-09-2018 , 01:48 PM
+1
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10-09-2018 , 03:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sect7G
I'd like to see a journalist with the courage to do this. Of course it could be the end of their own careers and in this business no one's going to help you then so think wisely.
Hi. I'm a poker writer who is published on affiliate websites that promote licensed real money online poker games offered by Partypoker and others.

The regulated iGaming media landscape is rapidly shifting following last year's fines issued by the United Kingdom Gambling Commission (UKGC), in which operators such as BGO Entertainment were fined in part due to "marketing" and "news" content that was published on affiliate websites.

https://www.gamblingcommission.gov.u...vertising.aspx

https://www.gamblingcommission.gov.u...customers.aspx

Media sites (at least those that promote iGaming companies such as Partypoker in a formally licensed environment) are under regulatory scrutiny and investigations (that involve content from over 1,000 media/affiliate sites), so I don't think anyone -- operators or media -- is looking to push the envelope on what may or may not be misleading advertising.

There's really not a first-hand account of the allegations in this thread, so it would be difficult to provide a truly informative recount one way or another until some clarification is provided -- hopefully by a Partypoker or Partypoker LIVE executive.

Whether that's here, via a media outlet, social media, or doesn't happen at all isn't really in the hands of media, as it's up to Party's main decision makers whether to progress communication.

Because allegations in this thread deal with potential "social responsibility" topics, it is advisable that players and fans interested in learning more (particularly in the UK) become familiar with the UKGC Licence Conditions and Codes of Practice (LCCP - linked below - effective April 4th, 2018).

https://www.gamblingcommission.gov.u...f-practice.pdf

There is massive political pressure in the UK right now when it comes to "gambling" and "social responsibility," including calls for "whistle-to-whistle" bans on all gambling advertisements during football (soccer) matches that would be almost as restrictive as Italy's blanket gambling ad ban for all products excluding the lottery.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-45574180

http://www.igamingbusiness.com/news/...ambling-ad-ban

Some would argue that the activities alleged in this thread are at least partly responsible for such drastic measures being taken to curb the influence that gambling services' marketing initiatives have over "vulnerable consumers," (which I believe an argument is being made in this thread that some casual players and fans could fall under this category when it comes to social responsibility).

Speaking on behalf of myself only, I'm not running this story as-is because there is a clear lack of complete information. I may reconsider once (and if) more information becomes publicly available, but regardless there are plenty of competent competitors of mine who may be keeping an eye on this thread as well.

So if there's a story that needs to be relayed, especially if it could potentially expose content published on an affiliate site or direct operator communication in terms of social responsibility rules, I wouldn't bet against it getting aired.

BTW, Daniel Negreanu covered this topic along with the MTT Community thread in his recent podcast episode (45:40-58:00), so it's not like there's any huge industry cover up at this time -- more like readers are waiting for more facts and opinions to come in.

Last edited by dhubermex; 10-09-2018 at 03:20 PM. Reason: Corrected UKGC LCCP link to updated version
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10-09-2018 , 04:20 PM
Quote:
Speaking on behalf of myself only, I'm not running this story as-is because there is a clear lack of complete information.
I don't want to tell you how to be a "journalist" but isn't filling the gap what you are supposed to be doing?
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10-09-2018 , 04:55 PM
It's debatable whether at this point this is media's "gap" to fill. The information is public, it's getting discussed, but it's third-hand recounts without a player or (preferably) a Partypoker executive having come forth so far. Hopefully some official communication is forthcoming, but media sites don't control this.

Everybody knows how to turn on a webcam, and iGaming operators have infrastructure in place to communicate via their own proprietary methods with or w/o affiliate sites. So like I said in the quote below from Post #31, it's really up to the operator as far as being responsible for relaying first-hand info (imo).

"There's really not a first-hand account of the allegations in this thread, so it would be difficult to provide a truly informative recount one way or another until some clarification is provided -- hopefully by a Partypoker or Partypoker LIVE executive.

Whether that's here, via a media outlet, social media, or doesn't happen at all isn't really in the hands of media, as it's up to Party's main decision makers whether to progress communication."
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10-09-2018 , 09:43 PM
Media should wait for Party to confess and only then report on it?

What utter nonsense. If I was a site and I had absolutely nothing to do with these allegations I'd be itching to respond publicly to as many reporters as possible that the allegations are categorically false.

Since they are not taking that line it's up to members of the media to start writing articles based on the info that is out there... about a month ago nearly every Party MTT online was reaching the guarantee within 1%. It was posted in their MTT thread. This isn't coincidence... and nearly all reporters being linked to an affiliate/advertising arrangement also isn't a coincidence.

As I said have some balls and write about it as it is news worthy or realize that having a job as a reporter is more important even if you have to dodge certain topics. But what you can't do is make up bs excuses on why you can't do your job.

btw I am a fan of your articles.
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10-10-2018 , 01:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sect7G
Excellent post and agree with all of it.
+1
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10-10-2018 , 01:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sect7G
Media should wait for Party to confess and only then report on it?

What utter nonsense. If I was a site and I had absolutely nothing to do with these allegations I'd be itching to respond publicly to as many reporters as possible that the allegations are categorically false.

Since they are not taking that line it's up to members of the media to start writing articles based on the info that is out there... about a month ago nearly every Party MTT online was reaching the guarantee within 1%. It was posted in their MTT thread. This isn't coincidence... and nearly all reporters being linked to an affiliate/advertising arrangement also isn't a coincidence.

As I said have some balls and write about it as it is news worthy or realize that having a job as a reporter is more important even if you have to dodge certain topics. But what you can't do is make up bs excuses on why you can't do your job.

btw I am a fan of your articles.
Good post, but it's nothing new there isn't a single "journalist" in poker that's to be taken seriously, as in investigative journalism with strong integrity. Plus, the majority can't write a paragraph without numerous grammatical/spelling errors.
Honestly, the only one that comes to mind is SrslySrs, but he does funny stuff and memes.
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10-10-2018 , 03:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barry Urinstein
Good post, but it's nothing new there isn't a single "journalist" in poker that's to be taken seriously, as in investigative journalism with strong integrity. Plus, the majority can't write a paragraph without numerous grammatical/spelling errors.
Honestly, the only one that comes to mind is SrslySrs, but he does funny stuff and memes.
what about Flushdraw or Poker Industry PRO (and there are others, but these where first to come to my mind) ... oh wait, no body cares for smaller sites and no body wants to invest a dime in quality, too

the problem is the laziness and greediness of the readers. everyone wants to have the big investigative articles, but thinks writers don't need to get paid. it's also laughable to think these articles have the budget to get proofread by an editorial.

and poker is btw only a micro cosmos ... cheap and fast is the rule everywhere. even if you study journalism, chances are good, that you end up working online, writing articles without leaving your desk. the "investigative journalism" (contacting people, following the 'facts trail', waiting for confirmation*) is limited to a very few outlets, just b/c there's almost no money.

it's also about sources and the credibility of them. what we have so far is one anonymous post and some approvals itt. not saying it's nothing, and i'm pretty sure there are some ppl digging into this story, but it's kinda cute, that ppl think there's time/money to fill the gaps in the story (w/o getting the every day work don first).
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10-10-2018 , 03:47 AM
Can someone explain to my idiotic friend who or what "BRS" is?

I mean obv I know what it is, but he's got to learn this lesson on his own.

Also, if someone can tell him what variants are offered. I can only do so much for the guy.
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10-10-2018 , 04:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barry Urinstein
Good post, but it's nothing new there isn't a single "journalist" in poker that's to be taken seriously, as in investigative journalism with strong integrity. Plus, the majority can't write a paragraph without numerous grammatical/spelling errors.
Honestly, the only one that comes to mind is SrslySrs, but he does funny stuff and memes.
Haley Hintze, Nick Jones and Chris Grove all do great work.
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10-10-2018 , 10:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZoomyBoy
There is defo something suspicious going on with party and BRS, I personally know some BRS players who are like maybe 10% ROI 33 abi players who are being put in these 5ks with no makeup and given 30%, I can't see how its a sustainable business model unless party are giving them some kind of money back or discount on the actual buyins. I'm not even a BRS player and someone from BRS asked me if I wanted to travel to notts last week if I wanted to fire the 1k and some 5k satties. I don't see why they are trying to inflate these gte's so much if they cant reach them, surely its not sustainable and is going to mean that party live ends up crash and burning?
Hi, what does BRS stand for please?
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10-10-2018 , 10:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NerdSuperfly
but it's kinda cute, that ppl think there's time/money to fill the gaps in the story (w/o getting the every day work don first).
And who said that? No one. Of course no one gets paid because no one gives a **** about poker in the grand scheme of things. And rightfully so. Still, poker “journalists” are a joke.
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10-10-2018 , 10:59 AM
BRS = BR Staking or something like that.
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10-10-2018 , 11:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Genetikfreak
Party Poker are a class act compared to how scummy n gross pokerstars has become.
Party Poker will NEVER be a class act of any kind! They have repeatedly stolen money from players (including me) for no reason whatsoever. They made up a story about me using a bot to calculate odds which was totally untrue and took my money with no other explanation. Not only did they close my account on Party Poker, they closed my account on Empire Poker and took that money too.

I stopped playing online after that as I realized that there was no governing body to control these websites. They can pretty much do what they want with no accountability. That remains true to this day, so let the buyer beware!
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10-10-2018 , 01:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by swissodds
Hi, what does BRS stand for please?
Bankroll supply. UK based stable.
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10-10-2018 , 01:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sl8a
Bankroll supply. UK based stable.
Ooh ok. Didn't know that. Ty for your time.
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10-10-2018 , 05:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toupee Jay
I stopped playing online after that as I realized that there was no governing body to control these websites. They can pretty much do what they want with no accountability. That remains true to this day, so let the buyer beware!
Except there are governing bodies that regulate these licensed and regulated online poker sites.
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10-11-2018 , 03:40 AM
Future partypoker live events will be no re-entry, single day 1, reduced late registration. So that somewhat mitigates some of the things people are suggesting has been happening ITT (not all obviously)

https://www.pokerstrategy.com/news/w...-poker/104451/
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10-11-2018 , 06:51 AM
I'm going to be writing an article about this very issue before November 1st.

I'm not sure at this point what direction the article will take nor have I decided on what platform or platforms that I will publish it.

As of right now I am collecting feedback, 1st hand accounts, and paper evidence of what is transpiring between Party Poker Live, BRS staking and the players involved.

As of now I can confirm that Party Poker as a company is not being honest on this forum in regards to its relationship with BRS Staking. (perhaps out of ignorance on the site reps part)

If any player with direct knowledge wants to reach out to me with the strictest of confidence or with your name to be made public please feel free.
If anyone from Party Poker, Party Poker Live, Paul Jackson from BRS Staking or Rob Yong from Dusk Till Dawn want to offer their input I will be open to their version of events.
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10-11-2018 , 07:23 AM
What you need is to find some disgruntled BRS ex-horses and get them to spill the beans.
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10-11-2018 , 08:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerPlayingGamble
What you need is to find some disgruntled BRS ex-horses and get them to spill the beans.
I already have that... but more can't hurt as I'm interested in the origins of BRS and its relationship with PP.
I'm interested in the various staking offers in a timeline from the beginning of BRS to its current state of trying to dodge scrutiny.

As for PP things are vaguer but money doesn't come out of thin air and legitimate staking companies don't put low stakes players in 5ks when they are paying the cost.
But a company poised to lose via overlay might if they get a slice back from winnings. More on this later.

Last edited by Sect7G; 10-11-2018 at 08:09 AM.
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