*** September 2013 High Stakes Thread *** - Page 53 - Poker News

He bet roughly half pot on every street, and even 4bet pre pretty small.

There are tons of Mid-pp, Qx, Jx h, Basicly the only two hands he is worried about here are QQ and QJ.

09-15-2013 , 03:43 PM

#1302

Masq

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 15,008

Quote:

Originally Posted by exec771

WCG having AQ is indeed very unlikely while he's holding QQ.

Good analysis.

Realised as I was thinking just now that sauce obv didn't know his hand. Got myself mixed up. I meant to say AQ.

09-15-2013 , 03:44 PM

#1303

monkeytilt

enthusiast

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 84

Quote:

Originally Posted by Masq

AQ (Unlikely as he's got QQ) / maybe WCG levelling himself with KJ/Jx and nothing. I thought the same too personally, but some of these thin value bets are "standard" apparently.

Thanks Masq. Obv I'll never be within a million levels of this standard of play but just thought the shove was thin at best. Incredible hu to watch though.

09-15-2013 , 03:44 PM

#1304

13_Xerxes

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 3,968

Quote:

Originally Posted by monkeytilt

Genuine question. The way the hand was played what is sauce's shove ever getting called with by worse. Inb4 no strat in nvg...

AQ / KQ / Jxhh...

09-15-2013 , 03:47 PM

#1305

WhiskyCoke

adept

Join Date: Aug 2013 Posts: 914

i dont know really but the way sauce plays he must have a balance range in that line that allows him to mix bluffs with value hands in a way that WCG has to call hands like AQ, KQ, and maybe other bluff catchers. Also the shove on river is half pot bet so ..

09-15-2013 , 03:48 PM

#1306

Masq

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 15,008

But KQ is less likely as he's blocking the Kx combos. Obviously not impossible, but less probable his hand contains a K.

09-15-2013 , 03:54 PM

#1307

Next Level

grinder

Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 644

Long story short, not valuebetting KK here is a pretty big mistake. In a long Heads-up match like this you DO NOT want to turn your river value-betting range into Nuts or Bluff. In the future, He wants to be called by worse in similar spots. thats kinda another way of saying it.

09-15-2013 , 03:56 PM

#1308

Vanilla Thunder

NVG All-Star

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 16,783

Full Tilt Poker, Holdem NL - $100/$200 - 2 players
HSDB Parser v2.2 - Highstakesdb.com - Hand #1354043

WCGRider (BU/SB): $20000 (100 bb)
Sauce1234 (BB): $88459.05 (442 bb)

Pre Flop: ($300)
WCGRider (BU/SB) raises to $480, Sauce1234 (BB) 3-bets to $1440, WCGRider (BU/SB) 4-bets to $4600, Sauce1234 (BB) 5-bets to $88459.05 (all in), WCGRider (BU/SB) calls $15400 (all in)

First Flop: ($40000) Q

(2 players, 2 all-in)

First Turn: ($40000) 4

(2 players, 2 all-in)

First River: ($40000) T

(2 players, 2 all-in)

Second Flop: ($40000) 5

(2 players, 2 all-in)

Second Turn: ($40000) A

(2 players, 2 all-in)

Second River: ($40000) 5

(2 players, 2 all-in)

Total pot: $40000 (Rake: $0.5)

First Showdown:

First Board: Q 5 4 4 T

WCGRider (BU/SB) shows J J
(Equity - pre: 82%, flop: 61%, turn: 80%, river: 100%)

Sauce1234 (BB) shows T J
(Equity - pre: 18%, flop: 39%, turn: 20%, river: 0%)

Second Showdown:

Second Board: 5 8 T A 5

WCGRider (BU/SB) shows J J
(Equity - pre: 82%, flop: 85%, turn: 95%, river: 100%)

Sauce1234 (BB) shows T J
(Equity - pre: 18%, flop: 15%, turn: 5%, river: 0%)

WCGRider (BU/SB) wins $39999.5

09-15-2013 , 03:58 PM

#1309

Masq

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 15,008

So you make mistakes and call it 'meta-game' to justify it basically?

Does 15,000 hands really constitute a "long heads-up match"

09-15-2013 , 04:00 PM

#1310

.isolated

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 21,495

if they play it all at once.

09-15-2013 , 04:01 PM

#1311

Vanilla Thunder

NVG All-Star

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 16,783

Full Tilt Poker, Holdem NL - $100/$200 - 2 players
HSDB Parser v2.2 - Highstakesdb.com - Hand #1354044

WCGRider (BU/SB): $112302.25 (562 bb)
Sauce1234 (BB): $23090.25 (115 bb)

Pre Flop: ($300)
WCGRider (BU/SB) raises to $480, Sauce1234 (BB) 3-bets to $1440, WCGRider (BU/SB) calls $960

Flop: ($2880) 7

(2 players)
Sauce1234 (BB) checks, WCGRider (BU/SB) checks

Turn: ($2880) 3

(2 players)
Sauce1234 (BB) checks, WCGRider (BU/SB) checks

River: ($2880) J

(2 players)
Sauce1234 (BB) checks, WCGRider (BU/SB) bets $2000, Sauce1234 (BB) raises to $7822, WCGRider (BU/SB) calls $5822

Total pot: $18524 (Rake: $0.5)

Showdown:

Sauce1234 (BB) shows K K
WCGRider (BU/SB) mucks

Sauce1234 (BB) wins $18523.5

09-15-2013 , 04:01 PM

#1312

WhiskyCoke

adept

Join Date: Aug 2013 Posts: 914

hows that line a mistake, lol

09-15-2013 , 04:01 PM

#1313

Mr Blonde

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 3,749

AQ = 12 combos
QQ/JJ = 6 combos total

jesus. i mean thats not even close to his range but that should be simple enough to end the tarding up. lets just rail

09-15-2013 , 04:02 PM

#1314

Testi

Taking care of business

Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 16,545

Quote:

Originally Posted by Masq

So you make mistakes and call it 'meta-game' to justify it basically?

Does 15,000 hands really constitute a "long heads-up match"

you realy think he made a mistake?

09-15-2013 , 04:03 PM

#1315

Next Level

grinder

Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 644

Quote:

Originally Posted by Masq

So you make mistakes and call it 'meta-game' to justify it basically?

Does 15,000 hands really constitute a "long heads-up match"

No, I dont. Not at all.

I dont think Sauce does either.

Value-betting KK here is NOT a mistake, not Value-betting it IS a mistake.

This is all imo

Edit:and yeah ^^ what they said.

09-15-2013 , 04:03 PM

#1316

superdivine

banned

Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 263

Sauce tilting a bit in the JTs hand?

09-15-2013 , 04:06 PM

#1317

WhiskyCoke

adept

Join Date: Aug 2013 Posts: 914

jesus ***** raider cant miss

09-15-2013 , 04:08 PM

#1318

Vanilla Thunder

NVG All-Star

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 16,783

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhiskyCoke

jesus ***** raider cant miss

Full Tilt Poker, Holdem NL - $100/$200 - 2 players
HSDB Parser v2.2 - Highstakesdb.com - Hand #1354047

WCGRider (BU/SB): $99447.25 (497 bb)
Sauce1234 (BB): $35941.75 (180 bb)

Pre Flop: ($300)
WCGRider (BU/SB) raises to $480, Sauce1234 (BB) 3-bets to $1440, WCGRider (BU/SB) 4-bets to $4600, Sauce1234 (BB) calls $3160

Flop: ($9200) T

(2 players)
Sauce1234 (BB) checks, WCGRider (BU/SB) bets $4000, Sauce1234 (BB) calls $4000

Turn: ($17200) 6

(2 players)
Sauce1234 (BB) checks, WCGRider (BU/SB) bets $90847.25 (all in), Sauce1234 (BB) calls $27341.75 (all in)

First River: ($71883.5) 4

(2 players, 2 all-in)

Second River: ($71883.5) A

(2 players, 2 all-in)

Total pot: $71883.5 (Rake: $0.5)

First Showdown:

First Board: T 8 2 6 4

WCGRider (BU/SB) shows J K
(Equity - pre: 46%, flop: 7%, turn: 16%, river: 100%)

Sauce1234 (BB) shows T T
(Equity - pre: 54%, flop: 93%, turn: 84%, river: 0%)

Second Showdown:

Second Board: T 8 2 6 A

WCGRider (BU/SB) shows J K
(Equity - pre: 46%, flop: 7%, turn: 16%, river: 100%)

Sauce1234 (BB) shows T T
(Equity - pre: 54%, flop: 93%, turn: 84%, river: 0%)

WCGRider (BU/SB) wins $71883

09-15-2013 , 04:08 PM

#1319

SW_Kaizer

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 2,192

Since the Kk v Qq hand was 200bb deep WCG can have all those pairs <JJ in his range so they would sometimes call also

09-15-2013 , 04:09 PM

#1320

Vanilla Thunder

NVG All-Star

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 16,783

Full Tilt Poker, Holdem NL - $100/$200 - 2 players
HSDB Parser v2.2 - Highstakesdb.com - Hand #1354048

WCGRider (BU/SB): $123880.6 (619 bb)
Sauce1234 (BB): $21037.5 (105 bb)

Pre Flop: ($300)
WCGRider (BU/SB) raises to $480, Sauce1234 (BB) calls $280

Flop: ($960) J

(2 players)
Sauce1234 (BB) checks, WCGRider (BU/SB) bets $600, Sauce1234 (BB) calls $600

Turn: ($2160) 3

(2 players)
Sauce1234 (BB) checks, WCGRider (BU/SB) bets $3800, Sauce1234 (BB) calls $3800

River: ($9760) A

(2 players)
Sauce1234 (BB) checks, WCGRider (BU/SB) bets $119000.6 (all in), Sauce1234 (BB) calls $16157.5 (all in)

Total pot: $42075 (Rake: $0.5)

Showdown:

WCGRider (BU/SB) shows 8 8
(Equity - pre: 54%, flop: 74%, turn: 82%, river: 0%)

Sauce1234 (BB) shows T Q
(Equity - pre: 46%, flop: 26%, turn: 18%, river: 100%)

Sauce1234 (BB) wins $42074.5

09-15-2013 , 04:09 PM

#1321

exec771

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 17,484

lol 16%'er twice, that's like a one outer on the river.

09-15-2013 , 04:09 PM

#1322

Exothermic

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 16,804

they should play on stars, screw tilt

09-15-2013 , 04:10 PM

#1323

WhiskyCoke

adept

Join Date: Aug 2013 Posts: 914

Quote:

Originally Posted by exec771

lol 16%'er twice, that's like a one outer on the river.

feeling pretty happy that i dont have forum reputation right now

09-15-2013 , 04:12 PM

#1324

exec771

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 17,484

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhiskyCoke

feeling pretty happy that i dont have forum reputation right now

lol

09-15-2013 , 04:13 PM

#1325

Vanilla Thunder

NVG All-Star

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 16,783

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vanilla Thunder

34 minutes played, 149 hands played.

Code:

WCGRider 149 hands +$40,458
Sauce1234 149 hands -$40,498

1h 20 minutes played, 348 hands played.

Code:

WCGRider 348 hands +$48,260
Sauce1234 348 hands -$48,353

1h 54 minutes played, 480 hands played.

Code:

WCGRider 480 hands +$46,195
Sauce1234 480 hands -$46,322

3h 2 minutes played, 818 hands played.

Code:

WCGRider 818 hands +$79,588
Sauce1234 818 hands -$79,804

3h 35 minutes played, 972 hands played.

Code:

WCGRider 972 hands +$133,636
Sauce1234 972 hands -$133,889

4h 13 minutes played, 1154 hands played.

Code:

WCGRider 1154 hands +$155,702
Sauce1234 1154 hands -$156,003

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