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Old 02-13-2012, 10:31 PM   #1001
DoTheMath
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

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Originally Posted by cmack View Post
He cashed 4 times at the WSOP and you don't think he played that many tournaments? With the 50k, 40/25k WSOP events he probably used 150k minimum during the summer
Hendon MOb DB has him cashing in five events for about $315K. He paid just over $210K in buyins.
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Originally Posted by cmack View Post
plus all the other 100k/25k highrollers,
Oh? Which ones?

I presume there must have been some, but what were they?

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Originally Posted by cmack View Post
seems safe to say he hasn't had a winning year since 2008. Do The Math.
Like I said, if he played over 35 events*, he probably lost money. I haven't seen a comprehense list of his entries for the year, but what very little of his tournament-playing habits I have heard of tells me it is entirely possible he didn't play many outside of the WSOP.

*Actually, given that his average buyin in WSOP events in which he didn't cash was so much lower than the average buyin for events in which he did cash, I'll have to revise the number up closer to 40.

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Originally Posted by cmack View Post
Doesn't really mean he is broke or close to it, but I don't think 350k is even break even playing the type of schedule Barry G does.
What sort of tournament schedule does he play?

I had the (quite possibly mistaken) impression that Barry was primarily a cash game player who played tournaments at the WSOP and a few high-profile promotional things. Like I said, if he played over 35 tournaments last year, he's probably losing money at tournament play. Did he play that many?Just because he plays a whole bunch at the WSOP doesn't mean he plays many the rest of the year. Also, are any of his buyins covered by Pokertars?

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Originally Posted by blueodum View Post
Barry played over 25 tournaments in the WSOP/WSOP-E alone.

Did you include the cost of travel and accommodation? Did you include the fact that Barry is a self-admitted big spender?

Guys who play the circuit spend about 300-500k in buy ins a year, not including travel expenses. 350K gross is a terrible year for such a person.
Is Barry such a person?

26 of his 34 cashes since the start of 2009 have been in Las Vegas or LA. Three more have been at the Stars-sponsored Caribbean Adventure, and three have been in London. The leaves two events that involved travelling outside this limited itinerary.

He plays in Vegas for the WSOP. He plays in London in the fall, back to Vegas in December, Caribbean Adventure in January and LA events in Feb/March. What else has he been playing in the last year or two? It doesn't look like he's travelling much of a circuit on his own dime to me. But I don't know what he has entered yet not won. Perhaps he's travelling all over the place and losing. You got any sources for his complete list of tourney entries? Does that data show how much of the entry fees he put up himself?

No, I didn't take into account his self-admitted big-spender habits. I have no idea how much he as spent on chartering private jets to commute between California and Nevada. I also don't know how much he spends in helicopter or limo rides from his home to the LA events. I don't suppose he'd ever get comp'd a room for all or part of the WSOP, nor would he ever stay with friends in Vegas. Do you have any data on what he actually spends in travel and accommodations?

Of the top 1000 money winners over the last year tracked by Hendon Mob DB, only 189 have won more than $500K. There must be a lot more people losing money than makign a prioft among the top money "winners".

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Originally Posted by Punker View Post
Why do math:

http://wsopdb.com/?q=Barry+Greenstein
$211,500.00 total buyins
So, assuming he paid all his own entries, and kept all his winnings, he would have had to find a way to spend over $100K in travel, accommodation, etc., from May to July, to have lost money on the WSOP. Certainly doable. Did he do it?

Any info on whether he covered all the buyins with his personal funds? Nothing covered by Pokerstars? Did he get to keep all his winnings?

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Originally Posted by blueodum View Post
Buddy, it isn't 2008 anymore.

This was true in the past. .... He has stated that big mixed games have all but dried up - and this USED TO BE his main source of income. Has not been known to play in big NLHE live games. Rarely played on the internet - now doesn't at all. So where is all this big cash game income supposed to be coming from?
You seem like quite a knowledgeable guy. How much is Barry winning (or losing) in cash games these days?

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Originally Posted by blueodum View Post
Here's an LA Times story from 2005...

By 1991, ... he left the company... He was faced with piles of debt from living beyond his means in Silicon Valley, so he sold his remaining stock options and paid off creditors.

Sold his stock options to pay off his creditors. ...
That's persuasive. I'm convinced he isn't making money directly off of Symantec stock he obtained while working there.

Now, when he sold off his options and paid off the debt, was there any money left over from the sale?

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Originally Posted by blueodum View Post

In 1984, he signed on as the fifth employee at ... Symantec.
-Note: Symatec was founded in 1982...

Also, 1984 to 1991 is seven years, but nice try Do the Math.
Yeah, I figured that fifth employee of a firm founded in '82 meant he was there 9 years, which in my books is nearly a decade. Doesn't change the fact that I was right that he got valuable stock options for being an early employee. I was wrong to presume he still had them. Don't know whether he is still benefitting from the sale proceeds.

QUOTE=RedManPlus;31515399]About 2-3 years ago right here...
Barry claimed to be worth "8 figures" = $10,000,000...
And made a point of mentioning...
His vast California real estate holdings...
[/QUOTE]Given what has happend since 2008 to real estate values in the US, his eight figures might well be down to seven. And if his cash game income has dried up and he's losing hundreds of K at tourneys, his seven figures might be down to...

a smaller seven figures.

Yeah, he's sooooo busto!

Last edited by DoTheMath; 02-13-2012 at 10:37 PM.
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Old 02-13-2012, 10:54 PM   #1002
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

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Originally Posted by hetero_flush View Post
it amazes me how many people still think that the players are going to be made whole in any amount that will even come close to satisfactory.

The players are not the only ones who got screwed over. There are hundreds, if not thousands, of legit employees who were screwed out of salaries, wages, benefits, 401k matchings, and so on that are all rightfully and legally owed to them.
Assuming you mean U.S. players, these two things are unrelated to each other at this point, and the potential resolution of either is also not connected.

Quote:
I can tell you right now, that every single one of these people will be paid in full, or accept a settlement damn close to full, before any player ever sees a single dime.
You can certainly tell us that, but it's still a non sequiter.
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Old 02-14-2012, 12:35 AM   #1003
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

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Originally Posted by hetero_flush View Post
50 cents on the dollar? lol, you mean fractions of a penny on the dollar.

I've posted this a thousand times, and it amazes me how many people still think that the players are going to be made whole in any amount that will even come close to satisfactory.

The players are not the only ones who got screwed over. There are hundreds, if not thousands, of legit employees who were screwed out of salaries, wages, benefits, 401k matchings, and so on that are all rightfully and legally owed to them. I can tell you right now, that every single one of these people will be paid in full, or accept a settlement damn close to full, before any player ever sees a single dime. And this amount of money for this category of recipient is extremely high I can promise you.

In addition, anyone holding a lien against FTP property real or personal, any preceding court judgments, and all FTP attorneys fees will all be paid in full before any players see a dime.

So as long as people like Barry keep withholding money that can get paid to these legit sources, the players will sit and wait. It is understandable for Barry to want to "keep it in the family", but that is not his right, and there are lots of other honest people who are deserving as well, and will come before everyone else in the eyes of the law and the feds.

I said a year ago that the players will never see a dime, and a year later nothing has changed to make me sway from that. There isn't any money, and the people who do have money that will pay it won't do so unless their strings of contingencies are met. Sad.

What's sad is that after almost a year, you are still on here rabble rousing, trying to get people riled up that have a huge percentage of their net worth in nowheres land. Even if the chances of us getting paid is minimal (which I don't know if it is and neither do you I'd bet), you being on here basically mocking people with funds in limbo is silly at best.

Get A Life! Kthanxbye
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Old 02-14-2012, 02:19 AM   #1004
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

I would just like to comment that i have lost all respect for barry, the entire time he was commenting about the FTP situation and talking about how he could not understand how they do not have players money. Its simple why they do not have players money Barry, its because you are part of the scammers who took the money you idiot.
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Old 02-14-2012, 03:04 AM   #1005
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

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Originally Posted by johnnybgood7 View Post
What's sad is that after almost a year, you are still on here rabble rousing, trying to get people riled up that have a huge percentage of their net worth in nowheres land. Even if the chances of us getting paid is minimal (which I don't know if it is and neither do you I'd bet), you being on here basically mocking people with funds in limbo is silly at best.

Get A Life! Kthanxbye
You took your head out of the sand to post that? I figured you'd know how to deal with my type better than that.

I'm not rabble rousing, I'm explaining why people like Greenstein need to pay their debts to the company they owe it to.

Probably shouldn't be doing any betting. The chances of you getting PAID aren't dismally minimal, however the percentage of what players will recover is. Once again I will ask: where is all of this money going to come from?

Its sad to see you interpret it all as mocking. However, that won't make me stop trying to get deadbeat pros to pay their debts. You sound pretty stung over losing your nest egg, I hope you come out okay some day.
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Old 02-14-2012, 03:26 AM   #1006
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

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Originally Posted by NewOldGuy View Post
Assuming you mean U.S. players, these two things are unrelated to each other at this point, and the potential resolution of either is also not connected.

You can certainly tell us that, but it's still a non sequiter.
They're quite related, and I speak no fallacies.

When banks collapse and they don't have FDIC, you think the unsecured-credit customers who had cash deposited there got paid out before all of the employees and vendors who were owed money?

I lose nothing by educating the people here about how Barry and friends are screwing the players. If you want to say "nah that's wrong" then go ahead, I lose nothing. However you'll be the guy who's logging in another 2 years from now, when nothing has changed, and still saying "nah that's still all non sequitur." I've seen this happen to businesses a thousand times, FTP is no different than all of the rest.

I'm not telling people to kiss all of their money goodbye, because some day they might actually receive some kind of nickel on their dollar, but it wouldn't be a bad idea for people to start slowly leaning in this direction, because there is no money, and it is all out of their hands. I've been in the corporate bankruptcy practice for a very long time, and I've seen families destroyed and torn apart over fraud, swindlers, and risky investments. I'm not having a whole lot of ****ing fun telling people this, however the worst thing that victims of fraud can do is to sit by and have delusions of repayment that are never going to happen. Instead come back down to reality, keep your chin up, and power forward, and if you're going to target the areas that will make a difference, begin with the deadbeats who owe money to the entity.

I'm on the side of the players, but I refuse to let the majority stick their heads in sand and allow Greenstein and his cronys to sit idly by and get off without incident. I wish the best to all people seriously affected by this.
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Old 02-14-2012, 08:11 AM   #1007
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

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Originally Posted by hetero_flush View Post
I'm not telling people to kiss all of their money goodbye, because some day they might actually receive some kind of nickel on their dollar
Perhaps you fail to realize that the FTP company is already defunct and isn't paying anyone, period. GBT is buying the assets, starting a new company under that brand, and will take responsibility for non-U.S. players only. The U.S. players will never get any money from FTP or GBT. Any money they get will come from the funds held by the DoJ. The DoJ has said they will pay out some amount once the GBT deal is done but it isn't known how much or when.
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Old 02-14-2012, 06:17 PM   #1008
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

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Originally Posted by hetero_flush View Post
The players are not the only ones who got screwed over. There are hundreds, if not thousands, of legit employees who were screwed out of salaries, wages, benefits, 401k matchings, and so on that are all rightfully and legally owed to them. I can tell you right now, that every single one of these people will be paid in full, or accept a settlement damn close to full, before any player ever sees a single dime. And this amount of money for this category of recipient is extremely high I can promise you.

In addition, anyone holding a lien against FTP property real or personal, any preceding court judgments, and all FTP attorneys fees will all be paid in full before any players see a dime.
This would all be true IF we were talking about players being compensated by FTP in bankruptcy, but we aren't. The plan is for the DoJ to compensate players, probably through a process called remission, and if the GBT deal goes through, the plan is for the DoJ to only have to compensate US players, while GBT compensates all the other players. GBT isn't buying the FTP companies, so under US law, at least, they won't have any general respnsibility for FTP's debts.

Under remission, the goverment compensates victms of a crime with money from the assets forfeited in relation to that crime. Secured creditors have an opportunity to put in a claim on assets, but AFAIK, that time has come and gone, and we don't have a long queue of lienholders claiming parts of FTP. Unsecured creditors who are not victims of a crime (and failure to pay debts is generally not a crime) are SOL. It would seem likely, however, that players will be seen as crime victims, not merely general creditors.

IF the GBT deal goes through, GBT will be playing out ROW players voluntarily. They will have no legal obligation to do so, beyond any contractual obligation they may have assumed in their deal with the DoJ for the purchase of certain forfeited assets.

IOW, under the process foreseen, the usual ranking of creditors in a bankruptcy will not apply, as we won't be using bankrupty proceedings to dole out FTP's assets.

Threre may be hiccups when it comes to the laws of certain European companies were there may be risk that the government or trade creditors may be able to tranfer a claim along with the transferred assets, but nobody here has a clear idea if that will happen. If it does, GBT could be on the hook for certain debts, or the DoJ may be unable to secure forfeiture of certain assets.
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Old 02-14-2012, 08:12 PM   #1009
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

I personally find this very insulting and persona seeing how Fulltilt still owes me $3,546.89. This may not seem like alot of money to some but to me and I'm sure many others this is a huge chunk of my BR and infact this is the first wsop i missed since 2002.

After emailing FT several times to only get the same B.S. response I even talked personally to a few top FT pro's that are in the loop and have a huge say on the everyday workings of the site. They all told me to stay patient and before I know it all of the issues will be worked out one way or the other and anyone that has money on the site will be payed. This was over 7 months and it's still the same B.S.

Now this comes out that FT is demanding debts to be paid from players that owe the site money ARE YOU SERIOUS! This is a slap in the face and its as if they are laughing at us, this is nothing more than greed!
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Old 02-14-2012, 08:46 PM   #1010
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

I haven't posted here in a while but I am really disgusted at the lack of response from the pros who are indebted to FT at the moment. Guys like Phil Ivey, David Benyamine, Layne Flack and whoever else is hiding in the shadows need to step up.

I could be be totally wrong, but the way I see it, the only way we have a chance of seeing our money back is if this deal goes through. I'm sure there is an element of Laurent Tapie and his crew angling for a better deal but the bottom line is; if this deal doesn't go through nobody gets paid and anybody who is involved in the FT fiasco are going to have a life not worth living.

Please, please if you guys are reading this, just pay back the **** you owe.
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Old 02-14-2012, 09:12 PM   #1011
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

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Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
I would just like to comment that i have lost all respect for barry, the entire time he was commenting about the FTP situation and talking about how he could not understand how they do not have players money. Its simple why they do not have players money Barry, its because you are part of the scammers who took the money you idiot.


That is absurd. Just like everyone here, including you, we all thought FTP was a business making money. When FTP provided him with a casual 400k loan he did not think "omg they must have stole 400 million of player deposits to give me this loan.". Barry assumed FTP was doing well and such a loan was entirely reasonable.

If someone told you two years ago that FTP loaned Barry 400k you would not be claiming he stole your money. You would be talking about how ballah he is and how FTP must be a money printing machine.

Stop acting like Barry did anything to hurt you.
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Old 02-14-2012, 09:41 PM   #1012
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

If Barry G isn't one of the world's great cons then I dunno who is

Lets the world believe he was an exec at Symantec whilst working as a lowly programmer

Worth 8 figures but can't afford a hotel room when shacked up with the poker pixie

Needs to borrow $400k from Full Turd to play their games but doesn't see the need to pay it back for years, and claims FT players owe him loot

Defends Full Turd against claims of fraud when the proverbial sheet hits the fan but keeps quiet about said personal debt..

Mate, I'm only owed a few $ by the full crap boys but I promised last time some peeeaaasant stole from me I would collect... well Barry we can meet in person and you can pay up or better still find 40 young kids owed $10k each by the crims at Fool Tit and pay them personally and then flip the bird to Group Bernard Froggie

Sad part about this is that the real players (young pros) who were happily playing elsewhere were conned into playing on Full Terpitude when the 2 superstar kids (Patrik and Tommy Durrr) were conned into representing these axxholes..... only thing worse then losing loot is losing the opportunity to make loot
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Old 02-14-2012, 09:46 PM   #1013
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

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If Barry G isn't one of the world's great cons then I dunno who is

Lets the world believe he was an exec at Symantec whilst working as a lowly programmer

Worth 8 figures but can't afford a hotel room when shacked up with the poker pixie

Needs to borrow $400k from Full Turd to play their games but doesn't see the need to pay it back for years, and claims FT players owe him loot

Defends Full Turd against claims of fraud when the proverbial sheet hits the fan but keeps quiet about said personal debt..

Mate, I'm only owed a few $ by the full crap boys but I promised last time some peeeaaasant stole from me I would collect... well Barry we can meet in person and you can pay up or better still find 40 young kids owed $10k each by the crims at Fool Tit and pay them personally and then flip the bird to Group Bernard Froggie

Sad part about this is that the real players (young pros) who were happily playing elsewhere were conned into playing on Full Terpitude when the 2 superstar kids (Patrik and Tommy Durrr) were conned into representing these axxholes..... only thing worse then losing loot is losing the opportunity to make loot
And Barry likes to defend Russ Hamilton, too.

http://www.pokernewsdaily.com/barry-...scandal-2-180/
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Old 02-14-2012, 09:56 PM   #1014
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

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And Barry likes to defend Russ Hamilton, too.

http://www.pokernewsdaily.com/barry-...scandal-2-180/
The best dodgies are always those most covered in credibility

"I donate my winnings to charity" but I can only afford my buy-ins because PokerNEwsStars pays me a few hungy a year plus buy ins...

"There is no fraud at Fool Turd burglar" cause I know Howard and the self-styled Jesus

"I have owed $400k for years but will only NOW pay if the govvie asks for it"..

but he is respected
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Old 02-14-2012, 11:52 PM   #1015
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

The fact is, no one is stepping forward to pay up! These poker players are not financially secure. In the world of gaming, its all constant risk. How some of you can defend them is beyond me...

Let me say it one more time, these guys, the silent ones, are not worthy of your respect!

Greenstein, you have borrowed 400,000.00 from an entity that is asking for money back. Stop playing games. You have acknowledged the debt, now pay it back.
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Old 02-15-2012, 12:31 AM   #1016
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

These guys are just scumbags and they don't give a damn about the thousands of players who will be screwed if this deal doesn't get done, that's the reality. The sad thing is that there will be still a lot of tards who will look at some of these disgusting human beings as their poker heros.
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Old 02-15-2012, 12:49 AM   #1017
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

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This would all be true IF we were talking about players being compensated by FTP in bankruptcy, but we aren't. The plan is for the DoJ to compensate players, probably through a process called remission, and if the GBT deal goes through, the plan is for the DoJ to only have to compensate US players, while GBT compensates all the other players. GBT isn't buying the FTP companies, so under US law, at least, they won't have any general respnsibility for FTP's debts.

Under remission, the goverment compensates victms of a crime with money from the assets forfeited in relation to that crime. Secured creditors have an opportunity to put in a claim on assets, but AFAIK, that time has come and gone, and we don't have a long queue of lienholders claiming parts of FTP. Unsecured creditors who are not victims of a crime (and failure to pay debts is generally not a crime) are SOL. It would seem likely, however, that players will be seen as crime victims, not merely general creditors.

IF the GBT deal goes through, GBT will be playing out ROW players voluntarily. They will have no legal obligation to do so, beyond any contractual obligation they may have assumed in their deal with the DoJ for the purchase of certain forfeited assets.

IOW, under the process foreseen, the usual ranking of creditors in a bankruptcy will not apply, as we won't be using bankrupty proceedings to dole out FTP's assets.

Threre may be hiccups when it comes to the laws of certain European companies were there may be risk that the government or trade creditors may be able to tranfer a claim along with the transferred assets, but nobody here has a clear idea if that will happen. If it does, GBT could be on the hook for certain debts, or the DoJ may be unable to secure forfeiture of certain assets.
I spoke about bankruptcy proceedings because with all of the facts that I have gathered, I think that is more than likely where this is headed.

I'm curious about where you got some of your information to come to different proceedings. As far as I have known, the DOJ was not investigating FTP as a fraud case, but that their interest was solely tax related. It was not until they took over and had accountants look at the books that it was determined there was no money.

Once there was no money, it was reasoned by the poker community that it was all a giant Ponzi scheme. However, I have not seen any official DOJ documentation saying that their investigation aims have shifted, and it is now being investigated as a criminal enterprise, rather than just a tax evasion case.

If it is not being investigated as criminal fraud, the players will not be paid restitution. The business will just be determined to be a poorly run business, that made poor use of its customers deposits, similar to a bank that does not have FDIC, and the players will be SOL like I've said. If it is not criminally deemed, there will be no restitution paid out. In addition to this, I have not seen any Federal warrants for any of the FTP leaders or holders to indicate this has now become a fraud investigation. It isn't against the law to make millions while driving a company into the ground with poor management, which is overwhelmingly what this seems like, rather than a giant Fraud scam from the get go. To be fair, if the DOJ had not stepped in to investigate tax evasion a year ago, FTP would still be operating today, and people would still be able to make withdrawals and operate as they did for years and no one knew the better. Poorly run business by clueless people doesn't always mean criminal.

Also, if FTP is deemed to be a criminal operation, there is no way the DOJ would entertain GBT attempting to acquire it only a year later. I do think that they are trying to acquire the entire company, because that is Tapie's business. He doesn't acquire auctioned assets, he acquires bankrupt businesses, turns them back around, and sells them for massive profits. Their acquisition is contingent on the pros settling their debts, because GBT has said they are not willing to acquire and then sacrifice those lines of credit (basically the only ones that FTP has). Which is why they want the pros settled before they acquire. They are willing to take on the rest of the debts in the acquisition, they have said this. The only losses they are not willing to take are the pro's lines of credit.

I don't think GBT will acquire FTP. The problems between the pros not willing to settle their debts, and the DOJ being in the picture make it more work than it is worth. They expressed interest, which was a nice ray of hope, but I think eventually they will walk.

Not said in any of this, but just as important, is that now that the Feds have control of the situation, it may be 10 years before they wrap up. They move very slowly, because first, they are the government, and second, because they don't lose. Ever. If they sit on it for ten years, the only thing left will be bankruptcy when they release it to the wolves.

However out of all of this, I still think bankruptcy is where it is all headed, because that seems to be what the facts are steering toward.
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Old 02-15-2012, 01:21 AM   #1018
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

So many words with basically no factual understanding. I'll let dtm correct you though since it will take a textbook.

It's clear you haven't read the legal documents regarding this case. If you want to continue writing walls of text in these threads, you should invest the time and spare yourself the humiliation of being laughably wrong.
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Old 02-15-2012, 02:04 AM   #1019
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

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So many words with basically no factual understanding. I'll let dtm correct you though since it will take a textbook.

It's clear you haven't read the legal documents regarding this case. If you want to continue writing walls of text in these threads, you should invest the time and spare yourself the humiliation of being laughably wrong.
Links to factual understanding otherwise, please.

I won't wait for you with a lot of hope, though.
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Old 02-15-2012, 02:05 AM   #1020
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedsToBeSaid View Post
being laughably wrong.
This. On virtually everything he posted ITT.
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Old 02-15-2012, 02:09 AM   #1021
NeedsToBeSaid
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

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Originally Posted by hetero_flush View Post
Links to factual understanding otherwise, please.

I won't wait for you with a lot of hope, though.
http://dockets.justia.com/docket/new...v02564/377900/

http://www.subjectpoker.com

http://www.diamondflushpoker.com

Start at the beginning.
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Old 02-15-2012, 02:19 AM   #1022
sqwerty12
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

So did Barry ever post again in this thread after his first reply about 2 weeks ago?
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Old 02-15-2012, 05:49 AM   #1023
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

If someone like Barry wouldn't pay his debts to FT you can pretty much guarantee nobody else will, not even rich guys like Ivey let alone fail pros in financial troubles or ****load of losers from which FT failed to collect a deposit.
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Old 02-15-2012, 11:29 AM   #1024
runLOLArun
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Re: Response regarding money I owe to Full Tilt

Here's an idea: have all the pros (like Barry G) who owe FT money pay into an account that can be held by an independant accountant. Then have those funds distributed amongst all of us that are owed money. Even if it's cents on the dollar, I'd still like to see some money back as I'm sure most others would as well.

And before anyone says it, monies owed should not go to Tapie, as he's taking care of ROW players. The money should go to Americans who won't get jack from Tapie, and prolly very little from DOJ, if at all.
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Old 02-15-2012, 12:05 PM   #1025
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markksman View Post

Stop acting like Barry did anything to hurt you.
Stop shilling for Barry...He has 400k debt from "years ago" that he needs to pay...bottom line.
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