What a load of BS that is.

If I took a loan from a friend I would pay it back as fast as possible, especially if it's interest-free. These are basic foundations of both morale and friendship. If you beg to differ I hope you are not involded in any staking. From past staking deals I know it's very uncomfortable to loan money and having to wait for it because of whatever reason

However using your comparison: What I certainly wouldn't do after borrowing money from a friend:
a) not paying back for ages when my friend is dead or seriously ill
b) stating that I won't transfer the money because my friend is not able to receive it due to illness etc and I don't trust his relatives
c) using the word 'morale' or 'obligation' anymore after a) or b) happened

Plus 400k is a significant part of a million, especially considering the other players at least had some connection to FTP.

Twist things the way you like. You obviously are not seeing things the way they went down. Your analogy to a sick or dead friend was a nice touch. What a bunch of BS your a) b) c) list was. 382K is a small slice to the enormous problem FTP has created. You guys are making Barry the fall guy for everything....

!


People that owe FTP money need to pay, not doing so is hurting every player on FTP that has a balance there

Unfortunately the pros are only looking out for themselves and don't care about the 10,000s people of lives they hurt/ruin

Barry I love you but your OP sounds more like a lame excuse in order to save some money.
Just pay your debts, FTP issue is very sensitive and can hurt your great reputation that you've been buidling for decades.
Not worth 400k imo, pay up and be done with it.

Barry, with all due respect there is fluff in your defensive argument that doesn't hold weight. The moral obligation crap would never hold up in court.

It's plain and simple. You owe money in the amount of 400k. It needs to be paid. Pay it.

I applaud you for being on the side the US players but this is not the way to do it.

always respect for barry

no it doesn't, reading is hard

BARRY,

Please understand that there are many ways for you to make a public display of your effort to make good on this debt and a lot of time has gone by.

Instead, the poker community has seen nothing but avoidance from you and your friends. We are the people who made you guys legends and this is how we are treated. I've come to the conclusion that you guys either really don't give **** or you're broke.

Obviously you're role is not as bad as others, but there is no way for us to separate you from Phil Ivey or Chris Ferguson when we have seen you sit on the same tables. For that matter, you're now in the same group with the scammers that took advantage of phantom deposits.

This group that your involved with needs to do something now. Your accomplishments got you to the top, but the community made you legends. I know that is probably more significant than any of your many business feats. Las Vegas didn't kiss your ass when you were a computer geek. I know which I'd rather have.

Anyway, to summarize: If you or your friends ever want to come close to the status you guys achieved for so many years, than you need to do something to remedy your public opinion NOW. If you guys ever want to be able to play poker in this country in public, than you need to do something NOW.

I know that seeing an escrow fund established next week to pay US players back would make me feel all warm and tingly inside.

IS THIS A SICK JOKE, PERHAPS?

Seriously.. who would authorize large loans to Layne (let alone 2 million), and what would their motive be?

If the site was short players money when they did any of these loans...

Who at FTP would loan out money in this manner, and why?

Why has this thread got 400+ posts? I doubt anyone would ever think that Barry would ever be less than 100% trustworthy. Chillax people, he's a good guy...

You started the analogy. Nobody knows the exact details of the deal between greenstein and ftp. All we know is that Greenstein received a significant sum and (even according to himself) can't be bothered to pay it back, offering some lame-ass excuses. You said everybody would act the same which I find to be quite insulting.

Nobody blames Barry for everything. We blame him partly because we thought he would be somewhat different from the main villains. Yet in this thread he offers nothing but excuses and only offers information which already went public. The other reason people criticize him for is the fact that he talks about 'morale' and 'obligation' when in his position he probably shouldn't.

well, although i agree with you, a year ago i thought this about some other players too

Yeah, good luck collecting from layne and matusow, hahaha. Makes u wonder what life at fulltilt must have been like when the gravy train was still rollin. As for those who say they all need to pay up bc its hurting poker 'community', lol, they owe big sums of money, im sure they go 'mmm.... yeah, might not pay cause this is a ****load of dough but yeah, dont want all the nice grinders to get hurt so yeah ok, heres my 500k or what ever...'

Some people have morals though

is there a list somehwere what players owes what kind of money?

I have questions about those at FTP who authorized large player loans.

Was FTP in the red at anytime in the "Player Balance" when they paid dividends to owners or made these "player loans?"

OP, if you want to clear up $1.3k of this debt, pm your preference stars, cake or merge and I will send you my SN to ship to.

On a more serious note, I don't think anyone should care about how much Tapie gets if they aren't going to pay out to the player's money they owe.

What a mess

you borrow money from the company of fulltilt so you have to pay back the company of fulltilt. if the owner of the company switches, you owe money to the new owner. the new owner of fulltilt will not be us american players. i think your patriotism does not connect with logical thinking.

i dont see a reason why you can switch freely who to pay.
also i dont see a reason why you prefer players with the nationality USA.
have to say it, it feels kind of racist vs everything else then USA.

Barry you lost me man. Selfish old sad man.

#

sounds like a fckn joke, lame excuse, whatever. I already lost all my respect for the whole FTP "pros" and now for you too Mr Greenstein. Doesn't seem like you are really trying to get players reimbursed. Surely there has to be some way for you and your dear friends to work out a solution w/ GBT that satisfies both US/non US players. You keep talking about morale and the right thing to do while some of us are sitting at home waiting for our money for 6 months now and have a hard time paying bills while you make 400k out of nothing. The way i see it: you partly owe ME money and the best way for ME (and i think im speaking for most ppl here) getting my money back is by FTP coming back. If you decide to stand in the way of a potential comeback you are partly responsible for us getting scammed.

also, how do you think you are going to pay back players directly? how are you supposed to know how much each individual had on their accounts etc.? you think every1 will say the truth about their balances and get reimbursed accordingly? what about ppl who dont post and read on 2+2 and dont have sources to contact you? even if you were to make a pool for former ftp players there would be no way to gaurantee fairness. the only right thing to do for you is pay back what you owe. same goes for anyone other involved in this mess, our former 'idols' who are practically stealing from us. you got some nerves talking about morale here. seriously.

Mr Greenstein

you are a serious threat to a society....

Regards

Please don't tell me FTP made loans to their buddies and allies when they did not have ALL of the player money on hand.

What a scummy betrayal this would be by FTP (whoever that was). What Ponzi-work this stealing would be- if true.

Tell me FTP did not pay ANY dividends to the owners, or make ANY loans to anyone, when they were short player money.


I am open to evidence that FTP had ALL the players money on hand every time they cut the owners a dividend check, or made an interest free personal loan.

I'm just curious what was going through peoples minds when they decided it was ok to loan true loser degens like layne flack and mike mattusow huge sums of money??

Ivey i get, but he turned out to be just as much of a scumbag if not bigger than those 2.

I don't have money stuck on FTP but I think it's very good of you to come out and explain your situation, thanks