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News, Views, and Gossip For poker news, views, and gossip |
06-30-2010, 08:48 AM
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#1
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grinder
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 561
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Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
With a rake of 7% up to 3€ and a preflop rake of 2%... So pokerstars took 0% of the governement taxes in charge and made any cash game form unprofitable. Just for information on pokerstars.com rake is 5% up to 2€ without preflop rake.
GG Cashgame
PokerStars Game #46167091537: Hold'em No Limit (€0.05/€0.10 EUR) - 2010/06/30 14:24:34 CET [2010/06/30 8:24:34 ET]
Table 'Pirola' 6-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: enzo093 (€7.71 in chips)
Seat 2: Admin17100 (€8.44 in chips)
Seat 3: flavinio563 (€2.95 in chips)
Seat 4: Milouser (€2.48 in chips)
Seat 5: Gui03200 (€10.91 in chips)
Seat 6: jiph (€15.73 in chips)
enzo093: posts small blind €0.05
Admin17100: posts big blind €0.10
*** HOLE CARDS ***
flavinio563: raises €0.40 to €0.50
Milouser: folds
Gui03200: folds
jiph: folds
enzo093: folds
Admin17100: folds
Uncalled bet (€0.40) returned to flavinio563
flavinio563 collected €0.24 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot €0.25 | Rake €0.01
Seat 1: enzo093 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 2: Admin17100 (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: flavinio563 collected (€0.24)
Seat 4: Milouser folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: Gui03200 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: jiph (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
PokerStars Game #46166991641: Hold'em No Limit (€0.05/€0.10 EUR) - 2010/06/30 14:20:39 CET [2010/06/30 8:20:39 ET]
Table 'Pirola' 6-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: enzo093 (€6.66 in chips)
Seat 2: Admin17100 (€7.75 in chips)
Seat 3: flavinio563 (€5 in chips)
Seat 4: Milouser (€2.63 in chips)
Seat 5: Gui03200 (€11.87 in chips)
Seat 6: jiph (€14.92 in chips)
Admin17100: posts small blind €0.05
flavinio563: posts big blind €0.10
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Milouser: folds
Gui03200: folds
jiph: folds
enzo093: folds
Admin17100: calls €0.05
flavinio563: checks
*** FLOP *** [Qd Tc Ts]
Admin17100: checks
flavinio563: bets €0.20
Admin17100: calls €0.20
*** TURN *** [Qd Tc Ts] [4h]
Admin17100: checks
flavinio563: checks
*** RIVER *** [Qd Tc Ts 4h] [8h]
Admin17100: bets €0.20
flavinio563: calls €0.20
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Admin17100: shows [6h Th] (three of a kind, Tens)
flavinio563: mucks hand
Admin17100 collected €0.93 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot €1 | Rake €0.07
Board [Qd Tc Ts 4h 8h]
Seat 1: enzo093 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: Admin17100 (small blind) showed [6h Th] and won (€0.93) with three of a kind, Tens
Seat 3: flavinio563 (big blind) mucked
Seat 4: Milouser folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: Gui03200 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: jiph folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Last edited by Tib; 06-30-2010 at 09:03 AM.
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06-30-2010, 08:53 AM
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#2
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journeyman
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: where the best beer's from
Posts: 362
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables
epic fail from pokerstars.
absolutely
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06-30-2010, 09:01 AM
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#3
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centurion
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: orgrimmar
Posts: 104
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables
pokerstars is getting really greedy lately, problably want to gather as much $ as possible before online gambling gets banned everywhere
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06-30-2010, 09:06 AM
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#4
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veteran
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,929
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
they've always been greedy. stars is run by a family in europe. ftp is run by poker players. ftp doesnt **** people over as much as stars
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06-30-2010, 09:07 AM
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#5
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adept
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 744
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
Quote:
Originally Posted by sinner
they've always been greedy. stars is run by a family in europe. ftp is run by poker players. ftp doesnt **** people over as much as stars
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I disagree. Pokerstars has better support, much lower rake and reward system.
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06-30-2010, 09:10 AM
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#6
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NOT SCANDI
Posts: 9,061
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
Is that 7% rake on all stakes or just micros?
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06-30-2010, 09:12 AM
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#7
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stranger
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 12
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
While I do think that rake in online poker is high this time you are targeting the wrong institutuion. If it wasn't for the french government to make the changes it made you would have still payed normal rake. Also aren't you french guys protesting about everything, there weren't any protest about the new online gaming regulations(or where there?) so obv you want to be screwed over,or am I missing something?
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06-30-2010, 09:16 AM
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#8
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veteran
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,636
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
wtffffff
they charge rake with no flop??????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!???????????
FFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU!
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06-30-2010, 09:19 AM
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#9
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 11,900
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
Quote:
Originally Posted by two2brains
they charge rake with no flop??????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!???????????
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"they" is the french government. Stars didn't change the rake, they just added what france is demanding.
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06-30-2010, 09:26 AM
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#10
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journeyman
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 251
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
Simple. Don't play.
Vote with your damn feet.
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06-30-2010, 09:34 AM
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#11
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adept
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: baath time
Posts: 983
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
yeah its the legislation not PS. still think pokerstars.fr will host the most profitable games around though. thinking about moving there but keeping british bank account. no tax-maximum fish, simples.
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06-30-2010, 09:41 AM
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#12
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grinder
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 561
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
they could at least take half of the governement taxes with their " huge profit margins " (quoted from pokerstars)
anyway in a few months CG will dies because poker isn't like loto player can stand playing in -EV game if the perspective of a huge reward exists but they won't be playing in a game that slowly grind their bankroll
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06-30-2010, 09:45 AM
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#13
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veteran
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Tripmining with 42o
Posts: 3,185
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
YOU'RE PLAYING AGAINST FRENCH ONLY.
I'd pay 25% rake to have that privilege.
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06-30-2010, 10:00 AM
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#14
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banned
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: i c
Posts: 663
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
rake preflop is absurd, specially for micro grinders putting some big volume
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06-30-2010, 10:07 AM
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#15
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grinder
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Euroland
Posts: 434
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
Quote:
Originally Posted by soapdodger
yeah its the legislation not PS. still think pokerstars.fr will host the most profitable games around though. thinking about moving there but keeping british bank account. no tax-maximum fish, simples.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d0nk3y
YOU'RE PLAYING AGAINST FRENCH ONLY.
I'd pay 25% rake to have that privilege.
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You guys grossely overestimate the skill difference between french players and others...
Look at the stats: french are not losing significantly faster/more than players from others countries...
http://www.pokertableratings.com/top-countries
Country and Winrate/100 hands
Norway $-11.80
Denmark $-11.63
Sweden $-8.20
Australia $-9.77
Netherlands $-8.00
United Kingdom $-7.37
France $-9.97
Germany $-3.95
Canada $-9.12
United States Of America $-7.44
=> Not very likely to have winrate improve, and WAY higher taxes = not much money left to be won...
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06-30-2010, 10:36 AM
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#16
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: California
Posts: 13,684
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
Is the preflop rake uncapped?
That seems like it'll make almost everything up to MSNL unprofitable.
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06-30-2010, 10:41 AM
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#17
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grinder
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 561
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
preflop probably capped to 1€
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06-30-2010, 10:50 AM
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#18
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journeyman
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 235
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
Quote:
Originally Posted by pokouz
You guys grossely overestimate the skill difference between french players and others...
Look at the stats: french are not losing significantly faster/more than players from others countries...
http://www.pokertableratings.com/top-countries
Country and Winrate/100 hands
Norway $-11.80
Denmark $-11.63
Sweden $-8.20
Australia $-9.77
Netherlands $-8.00
United Kingdom $-7.37
France $-9.97
Germany $-3.95
Canada $-9.12
United States Of America $-7.44
=> Not very likely to have winrate improve, and WAY higher taxes = not much money left to be won...
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You can quote PTR all you want, but take out micros and i'd happily bet the MEDIAN $/BB tells a different story. I know as a heads up player if a french player sits with me as i'm closing out tables to go to sleep, I will stay up indefinitely to play them. They. Are. Horrible.
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06-30-2010, 10:54 AM
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#19
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veteran
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 2,052
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
wow think of all the FPPs nom nom nom
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06-30-2010, 10:58 AM
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#20
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banned
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: France / Netherlands
Posts: 6,912
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
http://www.pokerstars.fr/tournois/calendrier/
Best tournaments schedule ever..
Quote:
23:00 200 € Hold'em NL 6 max HIGH ROLLER
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It's impossible to deposit more than €470/day and €1750/month and to play more than 10k euros a month. (there is no way to make supernova playing SNGs)
Last one is my biggest concern.
By the way the PTR top-countries thing is only for FullTilt and Party poker.
Last edited by DamienT; 06-30-2010 at 11:05 AM.
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06-30-2010, 11:20 AM
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#21
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grinder
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Euroland
Posts: 434
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
Quote:
Originally Posted by anakedcowboy
You can quote PTR all you want, but take out micros and i'd happily bet the MEDIAN $/BB tells a different story. I know as a heads up player if a french player sits with me as i'm closing out tables to go to sleep, I will stay up indefinitely to play them. They. Are. Horrible.
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No offense but I would rather trust statistics on a 400 million hands sample than your impressions...
And I dont understand why you would think that french players are more likely to play micros than another population (make no sense to me).
As additional information: preflop rake effect vary a lot depending on the format, according to simulation in HU midstakes CG it would be something like a 400% increase of the rake.
As a consequence it seems that no .fr poker site will offer HU tables...
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06-30-2010, 11:29 AM
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#22
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veteran
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: internet
Posts: 2,928
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
Do like the french farmers and dump cowdung infront of the government institutions. Tons of cowdung.
It's fkn insane how these incompetent ******* politicians ran by old money is so fkn all the time in the way of the internet revolution. Post the names so we can piss on their family graves.
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06-30-2010, 11:34 AM
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#23
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grinder
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Euroland
Posts: 434
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
Lets wait for an US regulation of online poker, it will obviously be tax free... erm wait ?
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06-30-2010, 11:40 AM
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#24
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delicious bread apples
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: No solicitors plz, I'm agnostic.
Posts: 3,708
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
Quote:
Originally Posted by tultfill
Do like the french farmers and dump cowdung infront of the government institutions. Tons of cowdung.
It's fkn insane how these incompetent ******* politicians ran by old money is so fkn all the time in the way of the internet revolution. Post the names so we can piss on their family graves.
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I like this fckn post +1
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06-30-2010, 11:42 AM
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#25
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grinder
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 625
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Re: Pokerstars.fr just started cash games tables and made them unprofitable
Quote:
Originally Posted by pokouz
Lets wait for an US regulation of online poker, it will obviously be tax free... erm wait ?
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Well the US market is different in a major way than the French market. Our market is so huge that Pokerstars will likely pay for the deposit tax's that our government will require. France on the other hand has maybe 1/10 the market size we do....just totally different ballgame.
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