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Old 05-01-2015, 07:19 PM   #226
EasyEasyEasy
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Re: Pokerstars closing major affiliate accounts?

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Originally Posted by Sect7G View Post
Furthermore try to consider where that marketing money is going to be spent and what type of customers are they looking to attract? This new wave of customers isn't necessarily going to be poker players... so how does this help you or any of us? Think right now your hard paid rake isn't being necessarily being spent to attract more poker players but Casino players. Is this fair to you?
Precisely this. Poker revenues soon look small fry compared to casino/sportsbook.
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Old 05-02-2015, 01:01 AM   #227
JaxRwild
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Re: Pokerstars closing major affiliate accounts?

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Originally Posted by bjsmith22 View Post
The recurring problem with Amaya is the constant lack of notice to their players/partners, and the disregard they show for their reputation.
Im sure if any of you were an affiliate and had children to care for and a family this would be devastating, It just another example of how when you make money in the poker industry you are on shaky ground and proves people like my great grandfather right that you cant trust people to pay you when your betting "against the computer as he calls it" to people in other countries. Its sad that in so many ways internet poker and business surrounding internet poker can not be seen as a way to make a dependable income as its proven time and time again that you can work hard and have the rug pulled right out from under you.

As BJ mentioned I do think a warning of 30 days would be fair and there is no reason to do things like this in the twelth hour without any notice.
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Old 06-27-2015, 06:34 AM   #228
SerDa
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Re: Pokerstars closing major affiliate accounts?

Can you stop expecting businesses to be angels? The reality is that much like we play to make a buck, they invest money for the same reason. While it sucks for the affiliates that got harmed by this decision, it makes no sense for PS, PS's clients or the future of poker to keep them around insofar as said affiliates do nothing to promote the game now.

In the environment where affiliates actively sign people up, more fish are at the tables, so they do the poker platforms, us and the poker world a favor. In the environment where they do nothing but expect to cash in based on actions they made years ago, cuts are justifiable and not cutting them harms the poker world by being a money pit.

And just like lifetime earnings are a great clause for the affiliate, the cancellation clauses are great for PS. I don't see why either using them is unethical. Did affiliates that stopped doing anything for PS contacted PS to tell them they are being paid too much? If affiliates never thought of the other side of the contract or the poker world in general(in the end, their commissions come out of the rake, so they are a cost to the average player), why should PS? The reason they didn't is because this is business. I don't see why I should grill PS for having the same attitude.

Plus, the only reason most affiliates got any traffic was because poker sites made it preferable to sign up through them instead of directly. If I was running their sites, I would have given poker players that signed up directly the money that is spent on affiliate commissions + bonuses associated with their account. Then they would have seen the true business value of affiliates since many of them simply cashed in on PS making it preferable to use their services.

Basically, in the case of people who shopped around for affiliates, for example, the affiliates brought no added value to PS and merely cashed in rents that PS permitted them to cash in. Sure, it was a gravy train that poker sites could permit during the good years, but now the poker market is far weaker. Also, the rake people they signed up years ago generate today isn't due to them. That rake is paid by the players and has nothing to do with the affiliate. I don't even remember who my affiliate for Full Tilt is, that's how much value they bring.

Sorry, but there's no free lunch in this world where you do nothing and make money. You worked, you got paid. If a contract was breached, sue. If there wasn't, this is a sound business decision, much like your decision to not attract new players was your business decision(the cost of time and effort wasn't worth it; the cost of keeping you around isn't worth for PS).

EDIT: You can think of it this way. PS entered this contract with you and gave you what they did in exchange for you continuously bringing new players to their site. You failed to do it, for whatever reason, so their rationale for cutting you is perfectly valid. You can discuss this on two fronts:
1)the terms of the contract: you signed a contract that either permits them or not to do this. If it does, you didn't get screwed.
2)the rationale of why you became an affiliate(lifetime share of the rake) and the reason why they created the program(you will bring new players to their site). Just because you still like your reasons, while it ceased making sense for them to keep the deal doesn't mean they are unethical. You can't expect you to be held only to the contractual obligations, while you expect PS to do more. You failed in bringing value to PS, why should they bring value to you anymore insofar as they're not contractually obliged to do so? You're not even their client, you're a business partner that brings no added value and is a resource drain on them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JaxRwild View Post
Im sure if any of you were an affiliate and had children to care for and a family this would be devastating, It just another example of how when you make money in the poker industry you are on shaky ground and proves people like my great grandfather right that you cant trust people to pay you when your betting "against the computer as he calls it" to people in other countries. Its sad that in so many ways internet poker and business surrounding internet poker can not be seen as a way to make a dependable income as its proven time and time again that you can work hard and have the rug pulled right out from under you.

As BJ mentioned I do think a warning of 30 days would be fair and there is no reason to do things like this in the twelth hour without any notice.
Affiliates don't bet anything, they are just taking a share of the rake out of the betting of others. And making money anywhere is on shaky ground. Ask all the people who ever got fired from a job from no fault of their own.

Last edited by SerDa; 06-27-2015 at 06:48 AM.
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