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Old 10-23-2013, 12:59 PM   #1
johnnyrocket
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ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Hello all, this topic is basically buried in another sub forum and needs to be brought to the forefront.

Goalwin has not paid me on the sum of approximately ~40k euros that I have had on their site for over 5 months now. Almost no players have been paid within this time frame. I will post some emails in the posts to come to help. Goalwin is a "skin" of ongame for those who do not know. They are having liquidity issues at the moment and do not give much more in details to the players. As we all know, ongame is attempting to enter the NJ market on November 26th and has not responded to any questions regarding this from myself or anyone I have seen on the forums. More or less, it seems as though they are trying to disassociate with Goalwin and just breeze in to the US market with a good reputation.

The poker community seems to just accept these things as the risks we are associated with now, and it is not good. We need to take a stand. I am going to be going to the New Jersey news with all this information in the coming weeks before their launch.

I have tried reaching the LGA (Lotteries and Gaming Authority of Malta) who oversees them and has written in clause 37 of their terms for overseeing gambling operations operating out of Malta (goalwin base)...


Remission of
funds.
37. (1) A licensee must, at the request of the registered player
in whose name a player’s account is established, remit the funds
standing to the credit of the account to the player by no later than
five working days, if practicable, after receipt of the request.
(2) An amount may only be remitted by the licensee to the
player, to the same account from which the funds paid into the
player’s account originated.
(3) A licensee may, before remitting funds to a player in
accordance with sub-regulation (1), take such time as is reasonably
necessary for the purpose of:
(a) verifying the player’s registration as a player;
(b) verifying the playing of a game by the player;
(c) conducting security and other internal procedures in
relation to the player’s account; and
(d) ensuring that the rules that are approved relating to the
award of the prizes to players have been complied
with.


This appears to fall under this, however myself and a few others have been unable to reach them. Please post here on it and attempt to help. Also, be wary of them opening in the US Market, it is my belief that the operator, Ongame, needs to be held responsible for their skins and should not just brush it off as they have.
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Old 10-23-2013, 01:02 PM   #2
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Been waiting on a €2k Cashout from Goalwin since mid July now
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Old 10-23-2013, 01:05 PM   #3
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

These are just 3 of the 40 or so emails I've roughly received when asking about it. They just keep sending myself and others generic emails with no explanation or help on it. Ongame continues to not help or reply about their skin


Hi xxxx,

Thank you for your mail.

We understand that your patience is starting to run out. And we really understand that you are disappointed with the service that Goalwin are providing to you right now.
However we can assure you that we are doing our best to process your withdrawal as soon as possible. We have sent another reminder to our Payment department today, telling them to release your withdrawal asap!

We are very sorry that you have been affected so badly.

Once again we want to apologize for this delay.

Best regards,
Goalwin Support.





Hi xxxx,

Please accept our apologies, we will of course honor the payments. However can we not give you an exact date or estimation.




Hi xxx,

We have checked your transaction history and we can see that your pending withdrawals already are divided into more smaller withdrawals. We have sent another reminder to the Payment Department, and we have told them to process your first pending withdrawal ASAP! We really think that they can start process soon.

We want to underline how sorry we are for this situation.

Best regards
xxxx
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Old 10-23-2013, 01:12 PM   #4
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

i could be wrong, but doesnt this company have their logo on the front of Real Madrid's jerseys?
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Old 10-23-2013, 01:14 PM   #5
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrawNone View Post
i could be wrong, but doesnt this company have their logo on the front of Real Madrid's jerseys?
that is bwin who is the team behind Party Poker (they are entering the US market as well)
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Old 10-23-2013, 01:42 PM   #6
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Is this happening only on Goalwin? Do you know anything about other reputable skins like Redkings?
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Old 10-23-2013, 02:03 PM   #7
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Quote:
Originally Posted by madhusudana View Post
Is this happening only on Goalwin? Do you know anything about other reputable skins like Redkings?
I have played on some other skins with no issues, I am not aware of anything with Redkings
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Old 10-23-2013, 02:06 PM   #8
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Goalgaming Ltd is the company behind Pokermambo, Kickmyace, Goalwin and few other sites.

Play2b was designed as a network by Goalgaming to let PIV players clear funds and get them paid, however this obv failed hardtimes.

To sum it up, the company in charge of your funds and operating the skins above is Goalgaming Ltd.

Last edited by Mike Haven; 10-23-2013 at 03:34 PM.
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Old 10-23-2013, 02:37 PM   #9
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

I have ~ 45k usd stuck on goalwin... for about 8 months
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Old 10-23-2013, 02:40 PM   #10
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

waiting for over 4 months for ~ 22k EUR
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Old 10-23-2013, 04:51 PM   #11
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Quote:
Originally Posted by A.ndree View Post
Goalgaming Ltd is the company behind Pokermambo, Kickmyace, Goalwin and few other sites.

Play2b was designed as a network by Goalgaming to let PIV players clear funds and get them paid, however this obv failed hardtimes.

To sum it up, the company in charge of your funds and operating the skins above is Goalgaming Ltd.
can you expand further on what this means, PIV players? Did they take funds from players to pay whatever PIV players are? Please clarify
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Old 10-23-2013, 05:18 PM   #12
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Re-posting here from a member in the other thread

"Play2b was created as Goalgaming's standalone network to try and push more liquidity into their own hands instead of having to rely on networks paying.

The network was launched in December/January and was integrated into piv skins and other third party skins by march.

When **** hit the fan with PIV, Goalgaming/Play2b did find a solution to try and help players, however it was very miserable and didn't work out.

When Goalgaming says that they are waiting for play2b to settle payments to them, its a load of bulls*it as they are the network owners. They might be waiting for settlements from third party skins or the revolution network, but not Play2b at least."
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Old 10-23-2013, 09:48 PM   #13
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyrocket View Post
The poker community seems to just accept these things as the risks we are associated with now, and it is not good.
This, after AP/FT people just assume that this is a standard part of online gaming. It isn't, its blatant criminal behavior in violation of an EU sanctioned gaming authority.

Link to text of LGA's remote gaming legislation: http://www.snapadministration.com/sn...2081752500.pdf

Ctrl-f "remit the funds" to see the relevant clause.

The sad truth is alot of the poker community will say anything to avoid having to deal with this stuff. They will say the LGA is toothless, that you have to accept risk, that you shouldn't have played on the skin.

That is complete and utter bull****, this is not AP, this is not a nameless company operating off of some indian reservation gaming license. They have an EU office. I have had 10k Euro locked up on goalwin, and no one has been paid in months.

And in lieu of us getting paid, these people need to go prison.

If I don't get my money soon, i'm simply filing a report with the Maltese Pulizijia. I urge everyone else to do the same.

Remember, this isn't AP, these people are criminals operating in broad daylight, and only because of our own apathy are they allowed to do so.

I'm going to be telling them everything, that a rogue bookmaker is running a fradulent business in their country, that they continue to accept deposits and pay their employees. I'll also be including their registered address:

"Goalgaming Limited, Maltese company registration number C53179 having its registered address at Suite 3, 64/1, Agiton Buildings, St. Anthony Street, San Gwann, Malta."
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Old 10-23-2013, 09:57 PM   #14
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Quote:
Originally Posted by MurderbyNumbers234 View Post
This, after AP/FT people just assume that this is a standard part of online gaming. It isn't, its a blatantly criminal action in violation of an EU sanctioned gaming authority.

Link to text of LGA's remote gaming legislation: http://www.snapadministration.com/sn...2081752500.pdf

Ctrl-f "remit the funds" to see the relevant clause.

The sad truth is alot of the poker community will say anything to avoid having to deal with this stuff. They will say the LGA is toothless, that you have to accept risk, that you shouldn't have played on the skin.

That is complete and utter bull****, this is not AP, this is not a nameless company operating off of some indian reservation gaming license. They have an EU office. I have had 10k Euro locked up on goalwin, and no one has been paid in months.

And in lieu of us getting paid, these people need to go prison.

If I don't get my money soon, i'm simply filing a report with the Maltese Pulizijia. I urge everyone else to do the same.

Remember, this isn't AP, these people are criminals operating in broad daylight, and only because of our own apathy are they allowed to do so.

I'm going to be telling them everything, that a rogue bookmaker is running a fradulent business in their country, that they continue to accept deposits and pay their employees. I'll also be including their registered address:

"Goalgaming Limited, Maltese company registration number C53179 having its registered address at Suite 3, 64/1, Agiton Buildings, St. Anthony Street, San Gwann, Malta."
Can you provide email addresses of the organizations we need to write to?
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Old 10-23-2013, 09:59 PM   #15
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That's outrageous. You should be mad.
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Old 10-23-2013, 10:00 PM   #16
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Also, clause 58 from earlier legislation:

"Part XVI
Offences and Penalties
Contraventions,
fines and penalties.
Amended by:
L.N. 426 of 2007.
58. Any contravention of these regulations shall be considered
an offence against the Act and any person so guilty of an offence
shall, on conviction, be liable to a fine (multa) of not less than six
thousand and nine hundred and eighty-eight euro and twelve cents
(€6,988.12) and not more than two hundred and thirty-two
thousand and nine hundred and thirty-seven euro and thirty-four
cents (€232,937.34) or to imprisonment for a term of not more than
two years,
or to both such fine and imprisonment"

This is not a toothless authority, if it's pressed to act.
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Old 10-23-2013, 10:03 PM   #17
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Quote:
Originally Posted by HFSTRH View Post
Why don't you just play on a reputable site like Stars since you don't live in the US?
greed
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Old 10-23-2013, 10:06 PM   #18
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Here is the contact page for the LGA

http://www.lga.org.mt/Contact.aspx?id=85807

Tel: +356 2546 9000

here is the contact page for the Maltese police

http://www.police.gov.mt/en-us/contactus.aspx

I think we should talk to the LGA first. Going to the police should be the final resort, they likely will have no idea what is going on or how to deal w/ it, and if everyone is arrested no one is paid.

But if nothing comes from the LGA complaints, after months and months of waiting, we should consider our money gone. At that time people should definitely notify the police. I'll post when I do it myself and what they say.

Last edited by MurderbyNumbers234; 10-23-2013 at 10:23 PM.
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Old 10-23-2013, 10:11 PM   #19
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

the goalwin guys are owed a lot of money from the fallout of play2b. it's taking them a long time to catch up and to find a way to start paying people out on goalwin.

imo this thread is a very bad idea. you can't pressure someone into paying a debt they don't have the money to pay. if you ruin their reputation you reduce their incentive to avoid bankruptcy and find a way to pay players out to keep the site afloat. seems like going public with this stuff shoots us all in the foot.
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Old 10-23-2013, 10:14 PM   #20
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoGGz View Post
greed
It's not greed at all. All of us were patronizing a business that was supposedly 100% legit, with EU sanctioned gaming regulations to back it up.

HSFTHR, you do understand that the LGA is very same issuer of the pokerstars.eu license right?

There is no reason to feel more legally secure with stars than with another licensee when a situation like this arises. Just because stars has acted in good faith once, is not a guarantee they will do it again. Stars is flush with cash right now, but when the **** hits the fan, you need government intervention to help the players.

Are you suggesting that we are somehow in the wrong here?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SEABEAST View Post
the goalwin guys are owed a lot of money from the fallout of play2b. it's taking them a long time to catch up and to find a way to start paying people out on goalwin.

imo this thread is a very bad idea. you can't pressure someone into paying a debt they don't have the money to pay. if you ruin their reputation you reduce their incentive to avoid bankruptcy and find a way to pay players out to keep the site afloat. seems like going public with this stuff shoots us all in the foot.
You are right, we should continue to wait idly by for months and months while they continue stealing deposits from unsuspecting customers, who will also not be paid.

The only way to stop sites from engaging in that sort of risky behavior at the players expense long term, is to bring it up, sorry if you don't agree, but you are beyond wrong. Robbing peter to pay paul is not the way to do business, and will only result in more losses for the community over the long term.

Lol at not having at the very least, a thread on 2p2.

Last edited by MurderbyNumbers234; 10-23-2013 at 10:22 PM.
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Old 10-23-2013, 10:15 PM   #21
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoGGz View Post
greed
lol? ev is ev. earning potential is often far higher on non stars sites even after factoring in risk of losing the money you have on a site at a future point in time.
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Old 10-23-2013, 10:32 PM   #22
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

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lol? ev is ev. earning potential is often far higher on non stars sites even after factoring in risk of losing the money you have on a site at a future point in time.
Isn't patronizing sites that may steal your money because you could achieve more profit greed?

I could have said "people will risk losing their money for the chance at higher returns" but one word seemed simpler.
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Old 10-23-2013, 11:27 PM   #23
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

It's this attitude you people are so deeply entrenched in that needs to stop.

Pay your players, or face fines and go to jail. There is no third option.

I understand the "let the buyer beware" mentality, but not when the sites have been fully licensed by the same authority as pokerstars.eu, an EU sanctioned gaming authority with provisions for punishment for offenders, and (unlike AP) can be easily held legally accountable for their actions.

Last edited by MurderbyNumbers234; 10-23-2013 at 11:38 PM.
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Old 10-23-2013, 11:49 PM   #24
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

Yes, by all means go after these thieves and put them in jail, but that doesn't mean we as players can't protect ourselves by avoiding dark alleys late at night.
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Old 10-24-2013, 12:05 AM   #25
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Re: ONGAME/Goalwin/PokerMambo Cashout Issues for a long time

totally agreed, ask any of my friends, I hate dealing with risky businesses, and it devastates me when I am cheated out of money. That being said, I and a lot of my friends, I know JR well and others are prob in the hole for 100-200k+ here. And we really didn't do anything wrong, other than trust a company that for all apparent reasons was trustworthy. This is important to understand, we were tricked by a seemingly trustworthy company with all the right credentials.

Anyways, I agree with what is said, we should be pragmatic about getting the money. Calling the police, as I said before, is a last resort, but it is definitely the the step everyone should take if it becomes apparent we are totally defrauded. And poker players never take this final step, they just assume "it's all in the game" whatever. That's really just wrong.

I remember when FT had problems, the UK gvt told its players to simply call the police and it ended up working out. Chalking it up to a downswing after the money is totally gone is the worst thing people can do. It's just going to keep happening if companies don't have that disincentive for risky behaviors.

In the meantime, I don't see a problem with everyone calling the LGA, they will understand the issue and be better at pressing it. Their line was busy, I live in the EU but I'm in asia atm so think its the wrong hour.

Again, their info is: +356 2546 9000

and the online form (I think people should do both) is : https://www.playresponsibly.org.mt/C...MFb_3ZwaX8846I

the earlier link was the wrong one, the above is what needs to be sent in.

Last edited by MurderbyNumbers234; 10-24-2013 at 12:28 AM.
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