well done Joe

Im sorry but you are in a no win situation but u have done the right thing.

Joe, if we're asking things that you don't have the answers to, and your goal is to get answers out, the solution is simple: Please bring someone in here who can get answers out (Paul).

We are only asking you things that you can't answer because the person who should be in here, and should've been in here months/years ago, hasn't been. It's not fair to you, and it's not fair to us.

Joe...correct answer was
" yes i tried to blackmail him, in the name of UB. He could sue me, i hope he won't. I apologize".

Bye

Thank you for being honest about the old ownership still being around. Hope they are keeping everything legit. Just hard for people to trust the new UB. Would help if Paul came here and explained the new safeguards protecting the customers.

I think that as long as Paul realizes that common ground does not mean flat dakota-like highway he should come on here.

Any expectation of level ground being the meeting place in trying to resolve any of it would be absurd though. It's an uphill climb for UB in the online community, and it seems they've never taken to liking that so they choose not to attempt it instead.

[QUOTE=JSebok;25576617]


All I’ll add to this is that in no way, shape, or form was that message an attempt to blackmail Jon or threaten him, and I don't believe he thought that legitimately for one second. I was not telling him I was literally going to expose skeletons in his closet, albeit my choice of words was obviously dreadful in that regard.




This is ridiculous. This is proof that you were blackmailing Jon. And lol at the people saying 'Jon asked why did you bring my girlfriend into this'? How is that a justification? Jon is asking you to explain why you think's its ok to blackmail him and his girlfriend not what information you have to blackmail Jon and his girlfriend.

This apology is for sending a stupid message not for blackmail which Joe still denies.

I originally opened this thread out of simple human curiosity, much like the urge to look when driving past a bad car accident, and I was shocked to read the post (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...1&postcount=38) where you admit to having information about Jon's GF.

In the previous thread, every argument in your favor centered on whether you actually knew something, or whether you were saying, hypothetically, that were information to get out about his GF, it would be embarrassing. For example: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...1&postcount=63

It is perfectly clear that you were trying to intimidate Aguiar (at least) by threatening to disclose information about his GF with your original DM.
Whether Aguiar is really pissed or not is just being results oriented. I find it interesting you are apologizing for your wording, but not for what you obviously intended to achieve with the DM, which was to intimidate Aguiar (aka Blackmail) into s'ing tfu.

This is my last post itt, as I'm not gonna fight Aguiar's battle, but my honest and sincere advice is to stop posting itt yourself, because you're just digging the hole deeper and deeper with every post, and you're doing a better job than Aguiar could ever do of making Joe Sebok seem like a guy to stay away from, business-wise or personally.

Joe, congrats for coming here, BUT, how can you keep saying that posters here have MORE knowledge about the cheating scandal when you told US that you were going there to try to get to the bottom of it? Do you just draw a check and turn a blind eye?

Do you think you are actually talking to a bunch of idiots here?



Mookman

Hey Sebok- out with the story!!
Just admit the blackmail...like OJ, all will be forgiven

Fatal error! Please give Sebok the authorization and consent to come out with the entire story-

Let there be light!

Has a question ever been answered so quickly? Sebok wants you to know he is the ONLY douche-bag, that his original tweet was a very specific threat, and his apology/backtracking are as fake as UB's investigation of themselves.

Everyone who tried to defend Joe by saying he didn't mean to threaten FatalError (as ridiculous as that was even in the beginning) should now groan out load and cover your face.

Thank god Fatal Error had the balls to post the threat, unlike those "it's a private DM" wussies, just so we could see Joe Sebok out himself so perfectly as the clueless jerk he is.

Cliffs:

I'm sorry for making the blackmail threat on twitter even though it wasn't a blackmail threat although I do know some things about Jon's GF that I'm willing not to disclose if he does what I want him to do and I want to help bring all the UB cheating information out and I feel the best way for this to happen is for myself and UB to do nothing at all.

shaniac is gonna flame you for this post

pretty much this

Joe,

If people are ragging on you in this thread, the mods must be deleting it before I get a chance to read it. But yet, I still see more of your apprehension about posting on 2+2 than answering any of the well thought out questions.

I don't want to pry into your business or financial arrangements with UB, but if you in any way consider it a part of your job or mission to get to the bottom of the cheating allegations and clear your company (or unmask something damning and prove they are dirty), how can you not take a week or a day to spend some time pouring over the allegations and evidence on 2+2 (and other online outlets), and find the answers to them?

Maybe I totally misunderstand what your job is and what you were hired to do, but responses to the effect of "that's a good question, I wish I knew the answer" just blow my mind! Paul denied a cover-up, you later said they made a big mistake and they know it by committing a cover-up. What exactly did they do? --I'm just pulling that out of the many many questions, as an example, because as a totally naive outsider, I just can't imagine how you could a.) not know, and b.) think that shrugging your shoulders closes the book on that kind of question. It seems imminently knowable. It doesn't require you to divine the true nature of anyone's heart, it doesn't require you to be in contact with cheaters who are allegedly no longer associated with the company; it just requires you talking with the current management and getting a run down of the mistakes they made / cover-up efforts they made. Is that really impossible for you to do?

I am left shaking my head and wondering what is really going on. You ask over and over for everyone to cut you some slack - not here, but in interviews - and you hear from people over and over how terrible 2+2 is... You know you can read 2+2 without joining, right? You could still cull it for relevant facts and good questions to send up the ladder to Paul or whomever. Anyone who is even slightly observant reading this thread will see that you are ignoring or dodging all of the substantive questions. So your fear that posting on 2+2 will make things worse seems like a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy if you can't just shut up about your apprehensions, ignore any potential stupid questions or idiots posting garbage, and really dig into the meaty questions that are being asked, often after having been posed to you on your own forum years ago.

Also, we get it - you don't think you were blackmailing Jon, and you don't think Jon thinks so either deep down. The reason it makes you look stupid is because, think about this, having implied now that you actually do have some dirt on Jon's girlfriend: if you had intended to blackmail him, how could you have done it? Guess what, you could have done it by writing the exact same message you wrote. It implies the threat, but is non-threatening enough that you could argue later, if you ever needed to, that it was just a poor choice of words. Get it? So I don't know what you meant; you want us to believe it was not a thread, fine. Whatever. Let's move on. But seriously you must acknowledge to yourself, if no one else that a blackmailer doesn't start a blackmail letter by writing, "Hello Jon, I will be your blackmailer today." they start it by writing something indistinguishable from what you wrote.

of all the public apologies I've ever read or heard, this may have been the worst. "gee I wasn't really threatening to release anything about your poor innocent bystander girlfriend, but now you're bugging me so I'm willing to." way to taint her name. now everybody assumes she has some kind of huge skeleton in the closet. that's okay though, it's on the internet. it'll never get back to her.
and then this: Originally Posted by JSebok
maybe you can start to think about why some people have certain thought about 2+2 with a comment like this.
this is coming from a guy who works for UB.
comical. all respect gone.

excellent post -
Sea-Biskit, please respond

Can you ask Paul to ask Greg Pierson if he has a public statement on Haley's blog? Or is the "visionary" anti-fraud expert's response, "no comment"?

Why didn't UB take legal action against those who hacked their software and nearly destroyed their company?

lol this is exactly how it came across to me as well.

If you're referring to the Ray Davis hand in the ike vs sebok thread on here then I'm pretty sure that snaggle's recollection of the hand was proven to be right by live reporting of the hand at the time. Nice try though.

When trying to get answers I think we have to remember that Joe is merely a sponsored pro that has pledged to try and get more info for the public. What they release to him and what he is able to uncover is out of his control. But that doesn't mean that we shouldn't stop pressing him.

And please, people, look at things realistically. He didn't blackmail Aguiar. He apologized and Aguiar wanted more of an apology for his GF. By Joe firing back that he knows what skeletons he was referring to does not mean that he was initially blackmailing or going back on his apology. He was saying the message was private and yo made it public, I apologized and you made it public about your GF again. So if you want to keep making a public thing about it than we can make it public. These aren't threats, people. Wake up.

With that being said, is there anyway to get some kind of round table discussion with yourself, Phil, Annie, and Paul with a mediator to ask questions and brig up points? Phil and Annie have not been implicated in anything but they were the face of the company for a long time - before, during, and after the scandal so they might be able to speak on things that when they look back on it might make sense as to why certain things might have been what they were.

So what have we learned through this thread: Joe knows less than we thought, has people skills yet very good at dodging the point. Seems like the perfect front man for UB

@joesebok
looks like he might be done with this thread

don't give up now joe

Glad you showed up Joe. The best thing you could offer is your support to Haley's ongoing efforts. If you could help her get the documentation that your management has then she could help with your wish of getting the entire truth published so we can all move on.

bingo