Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

News, Views, and Gossip For poker news, views and gossip.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-29-2009, 08:53 PM   #201
Qualia
journeyman
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 206
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Hey, I go to college in MN, would you guys recommend transferring most of my roll to a friend back home
Qualia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 09:20 PM   #202
PBJaxx
2010 WSOP November 9er
 
PBJaxx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,329
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Qualia View Post
Hey, I go to college in MN, would you guys recommend transferring most of my roll to a friend back home
I sure as hell won't be and I play high stakes. IF this goes down, we should have more warning, and I don't see any reason why we couldn't cross state lines in a worse case scenario and withdrawal. They aren't changing any laws as far as I can tell regarding this, they are just pushing for the ISPs to block IPs of certain sites.
PBJaxx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 09:21 PM   #203
MrFizzbin
old hand
 
MrFizzbin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Mostly Harmless.....
Posts: 1,442
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cheer View Post
I live in MN and have some questions to clarify the direct impact on us poker players:

1. What is a VPN and has anyone used one to get around a block like this? What is the legality of something like this?

2. Will my account get sized if I try to play?

3. Can I still connect to FTP/Stars without getting frozen access? Is this only for xxxxx.com which means I still can play and access the client to play on?

4. What does this mean for me?
1) A VPN is a Virtual Private Network which encrypts your connection (thus the state and ISP have no idea whats being transmitted) and will do NOTHING for you on this issue unless you have a network that will route your to PS or Tilt. Having VPN software and no network to connect to will do you no good SOMEONE has to accept your VPN connection and allow you to route to the internet.

2) Probably not (more likely your ISP will block connections and the inability to get access will force you to cash)

3) if the order goes through then the IP addresses for stars and tilt will be blocked, (this is what the www.fulltiltpoker.com resolves to so we dont have to remember 101.99.175.233 or whatever tilts ip address is...

4) If the PPA wins... nothing. If the state of Minnesota and the Gambling intrests in the state win, then your are totaly screwed....
MrFizzbin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 09:24 PM   #204
Prospace
banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: New york
Posts: 1,091
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

You guys have to stop saying "our government" because its not yours. It's not a democracy and your not getting representation for your taxation.
Prospace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 09:32 PM   #205
spadebidder
Actually Shows Proof
 
spadebidder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: This looks interesting.
Posts: 7,906
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LoWBaLL DS View Post
http://www.parkrapidsenterprise.com/...x.cfm?id=16981
Quote:
Online gambling is illegal in all U.S. states.
Why is no one pointing out that this statement in the press release is false?

The applicability of the Wire Act to online poker has never been decided in any court afaik, and the plain wording of it doesn't seem to apply to poker. Some state laws do prohibit online poker, in some states.
spadebidder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 09:39 PM   #206
Skallagrim
PPA Board Member/LSN Dir
 
Skallagrim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: It's a PPA post only if so stated
Posts: 6,713
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spadebidder View Post
Why is no one pointing out that this statement in the press release is false?

The applicability of the Wire Act to online poker has never been decided in any court afaik, and the plain wording of it doesn't seem to apply to poker. Some state laws do prohibit online poker, in some states.
The PPA keeps trying to point out that the statement you referenced is false.

The only problem is the opposite isnt true, either: no one say with certainty that online poker is legal. The Supreme Court may rule differently than the 5th Circuit; the applicability of state laws has not yet been considered.

The lawyers doing work for the PPA believe we can win on the legal issues as they concern online poker, but we cant say we have fully won on them yet (we are off to a good start though).

Skallagrim
Skallagrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 09:42 PM   #207
Prospace
banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: New york
Posts: 1,091
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

In PA at least every ISP pays Verizon to have use of the telephone polls. This constitutes a monopoly IMO. In addition if you do enough research you will see that that William Barr who is Verizons lead council, was attorney general and in CIA. His address is still mclean Virginia where the CIA is (Langley is same area). He was more campaign contributions than any person Ive ever seen. He was in CIa in 70's but still live in that area. Maybe he is their lobbyist so that make sense. What doesnt make sense is how people talk about democrats or republicans like it makes a difference. The USA has been socialist country for years, and slowly but surely we are losing all of our rights and being enslaved to to government/corporate alliance.

William B. Petersen
http://www.kimmelcenter.org/about/petersen.php
Associate General Counsel for state regulatory matters in the eastern United States.
Here is William crying about Comcast when they are huge monopoly themselves.
http://www.senatorwonderling.com/pag...son-080806.pdf

Past legal head
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Barr
CIA


These companies were mentioned in Reuters article:
AT&T Internet Services, San Antonio, TX
Charter Communications, St. Louis, MO
Comcast Cable, Moorestown, NJ
Direct TV, Los Angeles, CA
Dish Network, Englewood, CO
Embarq, Overland Park, KS
Sprint/Nextel, Overland Park, KS
Frontier Communications, Stamford, CT
Qwest, Denver, CO
Verizon Wireless, Bedminster, NJ
Wildblue Communications, Greenwood Village, CO

IMO it is unconstitutional for the state to tell an ISP to block a poker site. Especially when poker is a game of skill blah blah blah.

Last edited by Prospace; 04-29-2009 at 09:57 PM. Reason: forgot links
Prospace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 09:58 PM   #208
spike420211
banned
 
spike420211's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: putting that s**t on everything
Posts: 9,515
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

>has there been any further response from Minnesota's AEGD,
such as why they achieved an erection over internet gambling in the 1st place?
[besides indian casinos and the lotto]

>I just informed an old and dear friend, a long-time Tilter who lives in semi-rural MN [like 3 stoplights in town].
his response?
"f**k me"
spike420211 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 10:07 PM   #209
GameTheory
adept
 
GameTheory's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Tokyo
Posts: 941
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

WTF! I just got back home to MN yesterday, after being gone 8 months--The Fukkkkkk is this shttttt!!!!!!!
GameTheory is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 10:11 PM   #210
max_em87
grinder
 
max_em87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: MN
Posts: 592
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

what about on indian reservations? Their laws aren't the same so would the state try to enforce the ban on reservations too?
max_em87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 10:14 PM   #211
bentonja
old hand
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Austin
Posts: 1,534
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kk405 View Post
can't believe it's 2009 and a new president and we're still fighting/debating this in America... THAT is sad
meet the new boss: same as the old boss
bentonja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 10:16 PM   #212
MrFizzbin
old hand
 
MrFizzbin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Mostly Harmless.....
Posts: 1,442
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Feel free to move on to the reservation if they'll have you....
MrFizzbin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 10:17 PM   #213
MPK
grinder
 
MPK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 548
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

KFAN was talking about this today, which is good of course.

But I had to call in because Lake was stating "Online Poker is illegal, what is the big deal" so I called in and explained that it's NOT ILLEGAL, his response was stating that it was a loophole.

I love the show, but telling people its illegal in the US isn't correct.


Anyone else listen to KFAN talk about it today?
MPK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 10:21 PM   #214
Halstad
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Halstad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,561
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MPK View Post
KFAN was talking about this today, which is good of course.

But I had to call in because Lake was stating "Online Poker is illegal, what is the big deal" so I called in and explained that it's NOT ILLEGAL, his response was stating that it was a loophole.

I love the show, but telling people its illegal in the US isn't correct.


Anyone else listen to KFAN talk about it today?
What is a "loophole"?
Halstad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 10:24 PM   #215
Minneapolis Ace
journeyman
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 285
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Don't get me wrong, I listen to my fair share of KFAN. But it's a complete waste of time to listen to Sludge and Lake...you're better off listening to 3 hours of Common's bumper music.
Minneapolis Ace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 10:29 PM   #216
JeffOkinawa
newbie
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Okinawa, Japan
Posts: 31
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Hi all,

I'm a journalist (and longtime poker player), and this news comes at an interesting time. I had earlier pitched a story about MN high stakes players to MinnPost, and there was significant interest -- but I just didn't follow up to make it happen at that time.

This new development makes the story even more timely. I'm fairly sure they'd still want me to do a piece, provided I could get access to several high stakes players based in MN that would make good interview subjects.

Naturally, I'd like to talk to some of the higher-profile folks (Schneids and theASHMAN are two I had thought of). But I'd be interested in talking to any high stakes player in MN, especially limit hold 'em pros, with good stories to tell.

This would be a broader feature about the life of young, successful poker players in Minnesota, but to write it well, I would definitely have to explain why this type of anti-poker policy reflects a deep misunderstanding of how the game works -- and it would be necessary to show the human impact of this policy should it be enacted.

Upshot:

1. If you play high stakes and live in MN, please PM me if you'd be interested in being an interview subject for such a story;
2. If you can put me in touch with other such players in MN, especially the two guys I mentioned above, please let me know.

Thanks!
JeffOkinawa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 10:37 PM   #217
spadebidder
Actually Shows Proof
 
spadebidder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: This looks interesting.
Posts: 7,906
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFizzbin View Post
1) A VPN is a Virtual Private Network which encrypts your connection (thus the state and ISP have no idea whats being transmitted) and will do NOTHING for you on this issue unless you have a network that will route your to PS or Tilt. Having VPN software and no network to connect to will do you no good SOMEONE has to accept your VPN connection and allow you to route to the internet.
You would need the VPN host to be outside the state of MN for that to be helpful. I don't know of anyone selling this service commercially, but I can guarantee someone will be doing so soon if the block goes through. There will be a hundred ways around this thing. One very simple one is to just dial in to a dialup ISP number in another state, but that would be slow. It would be fine for playing one table I think. You could also set up a remote controlled computer using software like VNC at your mother/father/brother's house in another state and do it over your normal Internet connection, running the poker software remotely. All kinds of ways around this stupid thing.

Last edited by spadebidder; 04-29-2009 at 10:45 PM.
spadebidder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 10:38 PM   #218
absoludicrous
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
absoludicrous's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: You like the stache?
Posts: 10,091
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Would it be worth sending out mass emails to the heads of local ISPs like Comcast, and Qwest? I'm thinking ones that essentially explain the differences between poker and gambling ala something off the PPA website as well as instilling the possibility that they could lose tons of business from the thousands of poker players in Minnesota, etc?

Last edited by absoludicrous; 04-29-2009 at 10:46 PM.
absoludicrous is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 10:50 PM   #219
MicroBob
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
MicroBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 61,580
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

MrFizzbin - Are you sure your take on it is correct? I thought it was blocked in other places too (like Italy perhaps?) but that it was relatively straight-forward to get around it by ISP masking or VPN or whatever. standard disclaimer that I don't know what the hell I'm talking about of course. Maybe it's a lot more complicated than what I had heard.

And fwiw I think this is a VERY important discussion to have right now. Will blocking the sites in Minnesota just make it more cumbersome to play (and cash out I assume) with a couple extra steps in there to get around the block? Or will it really make it much closer to impossible to play there?
MicroBob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 10:55 PM   #220
lodgeistics
enthusiast
 
lodgeistics's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 60
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Quote:
Originally Posted by absoludicrous View Post
Would it be worth sending out mass emails to the heads of local ISPs like Comcast, and Qwest? I'm thinking ones that essentially explain the differences between poker and gambling ala something off the PPA website as well as instilling the possibility that they could lose tons of business from the thousands of poker players in Minnesota, etc?
I was just thinking the same thing. I think letting the ISP's know that they will lose significant business may help us out on this.

Does anyone know where the appropriate place to send such an e-mail would be? The customer service department of your ISP perhaps? Has anyone wrote up such an e-mail yet so that I can use it as a template for my own e-mail?

Last edited by lodgeistics; 04-29-2009 at 11:22 PM.
lodgeistics is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 11:00 PM   #221
MicroBob
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
MicroBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 61,580
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Be sure to say they will "loose" significant business when you contact them. That will really leave an impression.
MicroBob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 11:09 PM   #222
bennyb56721
centurion
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: ND baby
Posts: 169
more of the Minnesota Gambling Enforcement Agency

Published January 31 2007
A dicey situation
A 20-year-old tradition at Whitey's has been called into question after Minnesota gambling enforcement officials Monday night confiscated four antique slot machines the historic restaurant and bar uses for its annual "Good Old Days" promotion.

Cups and dice used for the bar's Monday night drink special were also taken during a compliance review, which was conducted during a multi-agency sweep of East Grand Forks bars.

The incident has sparked a gimmick versus gambling debate between Greg Stennes, Whitey's owner and general manager, and Minnesota gaming authorities.

Scott Stewart, a senior special agent with the Alcohol and Gambling Enforcement Division of the Minnesota Department of Public Safety, said he could not comment on the incident at Whitey's because it is under investigation.

However, he said officials from the Minnesota Gambling Control Board, the Department of Revenue and the Alcohol and Gambling Enforcement Division toured East Grand Forks' licensed liquor establishments Monday night to conduct compliance reviews.

Stewart said the goal of the sweep was to examine charitable gaming operations and records, as well as look for untaxed cigarette sales, illegal gambling and compliance with Minnesota liquor laws.

The event has left Stennes a little puzzled. He said the slot machines and dice that were taken have a gimmicky appeal for patrons, and no betting is involved.

"The key to this thing is that there is no wager being made," he noted.

The slot machines are used during the annual Good Old Days promotion, which is the restaurant's biggest marketing event of the year. "This is a promotion we've been doing for 20 years or more," Stennes said.

He added that the antique slot machines are novelty items from the 1920s and 1940s that do not dispense money. The Good Old Days promotion, which was slated to begin Thursday, is a tribute to the history of Whitey's a history that did involve gambling activity in the 1930s and 1940s.

During the promotion, everyone who walks into the restaurant gets a chance to take a pull on one of the slot machines. Depending on the outcome, patrons have the opportunity to order off menus from the 1950s, 1960s, 1970s or 1980s and also pay the price listed on those menus.

In addition to the Good Old Days promotion, Whitey's bar-goers have been able to roll dice against the bartenders Monday nights for about the past three years. If the bartender rolls a higher number, the customer pays full price for a drink or round. If the bartender rolls lower, the drinks are on the house.

Stennes described the practice as a "pricing strategy" because he said customers have nothing to lose. It's similar in nature to pull tab specials at other local bars, such as Bonzer's Sandwich Pub.

What's next?


After the compliance review, which occurred at about 9 p.m., Whitey's patrons were offered two-for-one drinks this week as an alternative to the usual Monday night special. Stennes spent Tuesday working to get the slot machines back.

Initially, he was hoping to get the them back in time to start the Good Old Days promotion Thursday, but plans changed when he discovered they were transported to St. Paul on Wednesday.

Now, he's aiming to clear everything up and start the promotion next week. It is still scheduled to run through the month of February, he said.

Stennes has been working with East Grand Forks officials to resolve the issue, but City Administrator Bob Brooks said there isn't much that can be done at the local level because it is a state issue. "We'll aid him in finding someone he can talk to to get this thing resolved," he said. "It's an unusual situation."

Brooks added that he was not aware of the dice and slot machines being an issue in the past.

Despite the uncertainty surrounding the future of his promotions, Stennes felt confident the investigation would end favorably for Whitey's.

"I think we have a good leg to stand on," he said.
bennyb56721 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 11:09 PM   #223
LetsGambool
banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 26,578
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFizzbin View Post
1) A VPN is a Virtual Private Network which encrypts your connection (thus the state and ISP have no idea whats being transmitted) and will do NOTHING for you on this issue unless you have a network that will route your to PS or Tilt. Having VPN software and no network to connect to will do you no good SOMEONE has to accept your VPN connection and allow you to route to the internet.

2) Probably not (more likely your ISP will block connections and the inability to get access will force you to cash)

3) if the order goes through then the IP addresses for stars and tilt will be blocked, (this is what the www.fulltiltpoker.com resolves to so we dont have to remember 101.99.175.233 or whatever tilts ip address is...

4) If the PPA wins... nothing. If the state of Minnesota and the Gambling intrests in the state win, then your are totaly screwed....
Your money isnt getting seized on any reputable site, at worst they'll decide not to serve the state and cash you out. Minnesota isnt taking your money. The answers to the other three questions are unclear. We havent even seen the list of sites yet.
LetsGambool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 11:21 PM   #224
MicroBob
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
MicroBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 61,580
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

If I were in Minnesota there is absolutely no way I would panic about my money or anything like that. The site will send you a check in the mail if they have to. Your money will be just as fine as it was before. If you are playing on some smaller and/or rogue site where sometimes the cashouts can be sketchy then that's not going to change of course.

But it's not like you won't be able to get your money back from PokerStars whenever you want it regardless of this legislation. They are just blocking the play to the sites. You can e-mail them and say, "hey, I can't play anymore. I would like to cashout now but can't access the lobby" and you'll be fine.
MicroBob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2009, 11:22 PM   #225
Gazillion
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Gazillion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: volume failing
Posts: 8,721
Re: Minnesota to Prohibit Access Between Residents and Gambling Sites.

I wonder if this is one of the 200 sites on the ban list...
Gazillion is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:53 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2020, Two Plus Two Interactive