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Old 10-02-2019, 04:49 PM   #1276
alecspade
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by SkatingIsTough View Post
They are going live with their regular 5/5 NL stream tonight and just announced it on twitter. You have got to be kidding me.
Featuring new player "Pike Mostle"!
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Old 10-02-2019, 04:50 PM   #1277
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Just chiming in to say I have never played with Mike P EVER at Thunder Valley which is literally 15 minutes away. Even with big games running I've never seen him.
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Old 10-02-2019, 04:50 PM   #1278
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by OMGClayDol View Post
i basically completely agree with this post and this is what i was saying earlier too. most of the hands BY THEMSELVES are barely suspicious, if at all (there are a few exceptions, of course). it's only combined with all of the other hands/lack of losing hands etc. that paint the whole picture. but people often, more so in the beginning, posted random hands that by themselves aren't "that" shocking
No, wtf, they are very shocking. The thing is Mike is the best TAG, LAG and all in between, that is what makes iy clear he is cheating, the 95 hand and the 54 hand where he is a maniac genius shoving stacks with a pair into heavy overpair range where obv he knows its AK AQ and it works , but then he is nit hero folding KK, AQ, 88....., he is god.
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Old 10-02-2019, 04:56 PM   #1279
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

heh, you think you are disagreeing with me but you just proved my point...
the fact those hands are suspicious are because of the other hands combined. e.g. you're essentially saying his play is inconsistent (e.g. maniac bluff/stack off but then nit folding kk pre). if he just did ONE of those hands, it might be surprising, but not even close to proof someone is cheating, let alone suspicious. there are tonnes of hands on youtube where ppl did way sicker plays.
but again, obviously combined together it is overwhelming evidence.
if you still don't get what i mean, imagine if you just saw him fold KK, with zero background to this story or any of the other hands. you might think it's a sick fold, but will it even cross your mind that he is cheating/superusing??
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Old 10-02-2019, 04:57 PM   #1280
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by bc11816 View Post
No, wtf, they are very shocking. The thing is Mike is the best TAG, LAG and all in between, that is what makes iy clear he is cheating, the 95 hand and the 54 hand where he is a maniac genius shoving stacks with a pair into heavy overpair range where obv he knows its AK AQ and it works , but then he is nit hero folding KK, AQ, 88....., he is god.
what he means is, in isolation/vacuum, each hand/session could be explained through variance/hitting the deck/sick read. It is all sessions and hands combined that make it statistically impossible, playing 99% of all hands perfectly as though the cards were face up. A single hand is not irrefutable evidence that he is cheating. on a stream like latb, we might see gman or andy in one or two insane hands a night. with mike, its hand after hand, session after session for months or even an entire year+.
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Old 10-02-2019, 04:59 PM   #1281
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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I think Justin not releasing any sort of statement along the lines of admitting "Mike is very very likely cheating but I had nothing to do with it etc" is quite telling. Yes he would receive a lot of backlash for the 'investigation' they did a while back and Stones would lose customers, but when people are accusing you of cheating with some pretty plausible corroboration, you should probably defend yourself
I was thinking this too. Twenty-four hours ago (after seeing Joey's first video) he had a chance to say "It looks like I made a mistake", and he could have metaphorically thrown Mike Postle under the bus, partly to deflect attention from himself. His silence today might indicate he's missed his chance to separate himself from both Mike and the developing crisis around his "show". I suspect it's not going to end well for him.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:01 PM   #1282
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

For those saying he wont be caught/charged because there's no physical evidence of cheating...you're overlooking the tried and true way financial-type criminals get caught - by following the money trail. If Mike had a partner on the inside, which he mostly likely did, then there's no way investigators wont be able to find where money exchanged hands, whether it be directly via bank transactions or indirectly through evaluation of their standard of living and discretionary cash purchases in case they were smart enough to keep everything in cash. Investigators will ask why they passed money between each other and I don't think they'll accept "he staked me" as a believable answer.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:05 PM   #1283
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by pocket_zeros View Post
For those saying he wont be caught/charged because there's no physical evidence of cheating...you're overlooking the tried and true way financial-type criminals get caught - by following the money trail. If Mike had a partner on the inside, which he mostly likely did, then there's no way investigators wont be able to find where money exchanged hands, whether it be directly via bank transactions or indirectly through evaluation of their standard of living and discretionary cash purchases in case they were smart enough to keep everything in cash. Investigators will ask why they passed money between each other and I don't think they'll accept "he staked me" as a believable answer.
Good point. Also with how brazen the alleged cheating was I wouldn't be surprised if there are incriminating texts and emails that could be uncovered.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:08 PM   #1284
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by ejames209 View Post
So...........are we raiding the stream tonight ladies and gents?
Certainly we should and post links to this 2p2 thread for the viewers who won't know about it.

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Originally Posted by ArtyMcFly View Post
I was thinking this too. Twenty-four hours ago (after seeing Joey's first video) he had a chance to say "It looks like I made a mistake", and he could have metaphorically thrown Mike Postle under the bus, partly to deflect attention from himself. His silence today might indicate he's missed his chance to separate himself from both Mike and the developing crisis around his "show". I suspect it's not going to end well for him.
The players need to rally to get Justin fired imo. At this point moving forward the cheating will be less obvious and much harder to catch. And any game run by Justin Kuraitis will be open to possible cheating. Even if Mike Postle is run out of town on a rail, Justin could just cheat with another accomplice.

Anybody playing in a game run by Justin Kuraitis and having read through this thread is an idiot or an accomplice.

If you play at Stones or have played at Stones let it be known that Justin Kuraitis is not to be trusted to his higher ups.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:09 PM   #1285
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by pocket_zeros View Post
For those saying he wont be caught/charged because there's no physical evidence of cheating...you're overlooking the tried and true way financial-type criminals get caught - by following the money trail. If Mike had a partner on the inside, which he mostly likely did, then there's no way investigators wont be able to find where money exchanged hands, whether it be directly via bank transactions or indirectly through evaluation of their standard of living and discretionary cash purchases in case they were smart enough to keep everything in cash. Investigators will ask why they passed money between each other and I don't think they'll accept "he staked me" as a believable answer.


Yep and also the fact of taxes, did Mr Postle and accomplice report and pay taxes on the winnings? How do they explain mike transferring money to his friend who never sent him money in the first place. I doubt they would pass an IRS audit. This thing has too many legal strings hanging out there. Plus, a cheating situation like this needs to get particularly bloody, otherwise it’s worth it to the next cheat to try and get away with it.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:09 PM   #1286
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by kerr View Post
Numerous pros with multiple WSOP bracelets and 10MM+ each in career tournament earnings would disagree with you. To me, that speaks volumes.
On his tweeter he is saying that he is actually watching the stream on his phone and i am pretty sure that it is at least partly true. Is he looking at anything else? Most likely. I mean with some effort you can explain every single hand in question. The only thing that can't be explained or justified is his win rate. Nobody is winning almost $1000/hr one-tabling life 1-3\5-5 games for over 250 hours straight. It is just so statistically improbable that at some point we have to convict him of the crime even in the absence of any other real evidence.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:10 PM   #1287
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by Utopia View Post
100% agree. Each vid will be near 3GB in 720p. Might be difficult for one person to archive everything.

I made a spreadsheet for easy access to Postle streams, among other things. This is 2019 only, which is plenty of evidence. I am starting at the bottom of the list on working my way up.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...ZMA/edit#gid=0
FYI, I just noticed this list is missing a stream. It was probably missed because Postle doesn't show up until the 3hr 30 minute mark (seat 5): https://youtu.be/C_pfxYldsfM?t=12600

This is July 6th, 2019.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:11 PM   #1288
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

If we find out he’s not cheating, does Hellmuth lose his White Magic title?
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:14 PM   #1289
DevoGKT
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by persianpunisher View Post
If we find out he’s not cheating, does Hellmuth lose his White Magic title?


If he’s not cheating and can be proven innocent I have a feeling the line to the game may get a lot longer..

Of course this will never happen haha


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Old 10-02-2019, 05:15 PM   #1290
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by Halo_P1 View Post
**** THE JUSTIN & MIKE LIVESTREAM ANALYSIS***

Alright bros, Mike is cooked, he is done. This Justin guy however, is not. And Im here to make it worse for him. Below is an update to a former post I made just to give the complete breakdown. What I have below is showing that when Justin is on camera, Mike is not godmoding, so on top of the Vegas controversy we also have this. (Edit: Some people in the comments are thinking this means I think this vindicates Justin, I mean the exact opposite).

Im sifting through the Stones Live Poker YouTube here for a stream where he is commentating and MP is playing (first one I found is ALL the way back in May 6th- he hasnt been commentating with Mike at the table since then which is pretty weird because he commentates very regularly but NOT when Mike is playing).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBTJkgd7YsQ

This was what I was looking for, and I went through 5 f*cking hours of streams so someone better read this:
(i) shady sh*t coming from the booth when Justin is commentating---> None, I looked for
(ii) Mike Godmoding any hands (or rather, if he isnt!)---> Zero Godmode plays in fact if anything a lot of tentative play. Very mortal.
(iii) Any Mike Crotch sniffing (or the lack thereof)---> Outcome: There wasnt any.

Here is the play-by-play:

HAND 1: Mike has a boat and his opponents have total air in PLO. He turned bottom boat and checked back turn for pot control. Then river, Mike BETS FOR VALUE with opponents having J high and K high respectively. AKA human play. Also no crotch sniffing.
https://youtu.be/mBTJkgd7YsQ?t=1559

WTF THE F*CKING CROTCH PHONE IS NOT IN PLAY RIGHT NOW AND JUSTIN IS COMMENTATING!!

UPDATE 2: Justin confirms when he is gone to Vegas May 25th to July 16th
https://youtu.be/mBTJkgd7YsQ?t=2832

Hand 2: Mike incorrectly bets a set into a flush and a made low in PLO HiLo so Mike has the worst equity in this hand and INCORRECTLY CALLS ON THE RIVER. THIS MAN IS HUMAN ALL OF A SUDDEN.
https://youtu.be/mBTJkgd7YsQ?t=2908


HAND 3: F*CK ME THIS IS SO DAMNING. MIKE FOLDS THE CHOP! STRAIGHT UP on the TURN. JUSTIN IS COMMENTATING ONSCREEN.


https://youtu.be/mBTJkgd7YsQ?t=3211

HAND 4: Postle LOSES 1k chasing an openender into an overpair and rivered set. Postle Rebuys for 1.3k. Not a CROTCH in sight. This guy is FULLY MORTAL right now. https://youtu.be/mBTJkgd7YsQ?t=4482

HANDS 5&6: Mike wins both of these with effective coolers (for these games) having two pair vs TPGK both times. Very legitimate hands. Of note he goes for a reasonable minimum raise sizing on river rather than some massive jam that he would do if he knew he had his opponent coolered in godmode, but opponent folds anyway.
https://youtu.be/mBTJkgd7YsQ?t=4947

HAND 7: Mike folds 30% equity on the flop with a pair and a gutshot. Very unPostle-like. https://youtu.be/mBTJkgd7YsQ?t=5735

HAND 8: Another hand where mike makes the wrong river call. 10 bucks for me Mike (per twitter). https://youtu.be/mBTJkgd7YsQ?t=7393

CONVERSATION INTERLUDE: Justin starts harping on about how Mike is very good at understanding human behaviour and is excellent at putting people on hand ranges. In fact throughout this entire stream he is constantly referring to Mike with overwhelming superlatives- "honestly just a really nice person and an overall good guy all round" "phenomenal reads" "plays he makes are just from another freaking planet"
https://youtu.be/mBTJkgd7YsQ?t=8108

ANOTHER EVENT: In fact after mike spends some time away from the table seemingly talking to somebody, he is so confident in his plays that he has cured his apparent ADD and the phone goes in the front pocket.


Hand 9: Interesting hand here our boy has BET INTO A SET with middle pair. https://youtu.be/mBTJkgd7YsQ?t=8591

Hand 10: Our boy folds to an 8 high semibluff https://youtu.be/mBTJkgd7YsQ?t=9502

Phone Update: This is weird because either he took it out of his top pocket without me seeing (even though there appears to be an outline of it in his top pocket) or this guy has two phones. Could mean absolutely nothing but Im just following that phone at all times. He probably just took it out off-camera.


HAND 11: POSTLE DOUBLE BARRELS INTO TOP PAIR on flop with air. (also squeezed with K6o into JJ in the Big Blind here). Gives up on river. Justin notes that this line is "super rare" for him to give up on the river.


https://youtu.be/mBTJkgd7YsQ?t=13187


Hand 12: POSTLE DOUBLE BARRELS INTO A SET.

https://youtu.be/mBTJkgd7YsQ?t=13410

HAND 13: He wins a decent sized pot paying off the river with a small boat vs a bluff which interestingly he does not re-raise the river with. No Godmode here.

Overall Mike was up small this session, and legitimately, there were just some big pots that went his way. In fact had he lost that last hand where he was pretty unhappy calling off the river, hed have been down. The biggest takeaways were Justin constantly lashing superlatives everytime he gets the chance with Mike. Justin is in view of the camera the entire time and Mikes phone is away for the vast majority of the stream. Also Justin confirms how long he is gone to Vegas for between May 25th and July 16th- just for timeline purposes.
Good work, however (& I might be missing something in your detail) Justin does NOT need to be in the booth at the same time Mike is God-moding....because when you see the booth image and table image at the same time they are 30mins apart.

To illustrate this, using a 60 minute timeline from 0 to 60 (and assuming 30 minute booth delay is consistent), this means that Justin can be in backroom helping Mike between 0 and 30mins.....then Justin can go into booth between 31 and 60mins, and see how his (allegedly) assisted hands worked out from 0 to 30mins

Like I said, I might have misunderstood the "Justin & Mike on screen at same time" element of your post, so apologies if this is the case
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:15 PM   #1291
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by scant View Post
Just chiming in to say I have never played with Mike P EVER at Thunder Valley which is literally 15 minutes away. Even with big games running I've never seen him.
Yeah, I second this. Never seen him playing any cash really anywhere in Northern California the last year or so. I know he goes to Reno a lot, this is from talking to him.

Actually the two streams I've played with him he specifically drove back from Reno to play the stream, according to him.

I'd be interested to hear if he plays anywhere there. Peppermill would be my only thought.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:15 PM   #1292
GamblinRick
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Here we go:
https://twitter.com/StonesGambling/s...564510720?s=20
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:18 PM   #1293
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

https://twitter.com/StonesLivePoker/...05053884792833

Stones is suspending their stream until further notice and expanding their invesitgation.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:19 PM   #1294
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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It seems expert testimony would be all that is necessary. I wanna know what expert would go on the stand to testify that the data gathered is somehow not proof of cheating.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:22 PM   #1295
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by GamblinRick View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ejames209 View Post
https://twitter.com/StonesLivePoker/...05053884792833

Stones is suspending their stream until further notice and expanding their invesitgation.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:22 PM   #1296
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by OMGClayDol View Post
heh, you think you are disagreeing with me but you just proved my point...
the fact those hands are suspicious are because of the other hands combined. e.g. you're essentially saying his play is inconsistent (e.g. maniac bluff/stack off but then nit folding kk pre). if he just did ONE of those hands, it might be surprising, but not even close to proof someone is cheating, let alone suspicious. there are tonnes of hands on youtube where ppl did way sicker plays.
but again, obviously combined together it is overwhelming evidence.
if you still don't get what i mean, imagine if you just saw him fold KK, with zero background to this story or any of the other hands. you might think it's a sick fold, but will it even cross your mind that he is cheating/superusing??
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiiziwiig View Post
what he means is, in isolation/vacuum, each hand/session could be explained through variance/hitting the deck/sick read. It is all sessions and hands combined that make it statistically impossible, playing 99% of all hands perfectly as though the cards were face up. A single hand is not irrefutable evidence that he is cheating. on a stream like latb, we might see gman or andy in one or two insane hands a night. with mike, its hand after hand, session after session for months or even an entire year+.
yes sorry i am the dumb one....too much brandy..
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:23 PM   #1297
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by Dream Crusher View Post
FYI, I just noticed this list is missing a stream. It was probably missed because Postle doesn't show up until the 3hr 30 minute mark (seat 5): https://youtu.be/C_pfxYldsfM?t=12600

This is July 6th, 2019.
Thanks, I'll be sure to update that tonight. I might get started on 2018 too.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:25 PM   #1298
wiiziwiig
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

just wanted to show an actual mid-high stakes pro, Christian Soto, commentating on Mikes play on Stones, its his first time watching Mike play. he's surprised by the play, then tries to justify it with logic and reasoning.

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Old 10-02-2019, 05:25 PM   #1299
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Haha so Stones is either in the pantheon of incompetent poker organisations throughout history or they've found that they suspect an employee (or employees) is in on it. Would like to see what their previous investigation was. Also shout out to the guy commenting constantly on the Mike supporters Twitter posts asking whether their examples of Mike losing were ever on stream (going to take a big leap and say no)
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:29 PM   #1300
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re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

I'm maybe halfway through the thread...

I think even if you can find 2 or three sessions where he was down several buyins, I'd still be with the overwhelming evidence that he does cheat. I mean he could play like a somewhat not godmoded player, run bad in some 50/50 all ins or whatever and be down a few stacks and have a bad session.

Those sessions wouldn't convince me at all that he isn't 100% hacking, I'd still be convinced...but I'm amazed at the fact he didn't chose to have any of those type sessions, and people are at all skeptical of his cheating. Like he can't point to one session where he wasn't a supergod of poker (like phil ivey^2). Every session he was.

I would literally bet my entire life vs a dozen donuts that he's cheating if I could. Comes down to proving it. Maybe even a single large artisanal type of donut. Mmmmm donuts.

If he's not cheating he can actually read people for the exact cards they hold, like Matt Damon after the river in rounders in one scene. But he can do it all the time. So that's a possible explanation, maybe the likeliest.
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