Quote:
Originally Posted by George Rice
You can argue that, but I suspect you're wrong. Calling someone a cheat is questioning their moral character. That would effect their life outside of the immediate circumstances. For example, if I had a reputation as a cheater at cards I might find it hard to get a job where I would be required to handle money, or in law enforcement. I certainly couldn't get a security clearance with the federal government.
Or to illustrate it another way, are you positing that if I shot someone during a poker game for cheating in California I couldn't be prosecuted because I did it while I was gambling? I don't think you are. But that might follow from your stated reasoning.
Well, that's a criminal act, and the California policy is for civil claims, but let's say I shot you during a poker game, and then your estate sued me for wrongful death.
I would agree that would hold to be a controversy the court can hear. However, let's also say that we were both $25K deep in a NLHE game, and you had raised me all-in and I had called, all pre-flop. I then shoot you. And then the floorman rules your hand is dead because you are dead, and I win the pot. Let's also say we can establish your hand would have won the pot had I not shot you. I would maintain that your estate can sue me for wrongful death but not for the additional $25K that I only got because I won a poker hand because I shot you.
I would tend to agree with you that calling someone a cheat would go beyond just gambling. However, I was trying to demonstrate that you can argue both sides of this issue fairly adequately, and that it's not a stretch, given that California's policy is based in part on the concept that "we don't want to have to determine degrees of degeneracy/immorality" (that's from case law), so determining that someone who is being accused of cheating ONLY in the context of behavior that is already immoral/degenerate, how is that defamation in the eyes of California, accusing someone of cheating, to a California court, is just saying that amongst all the degenerate immoral scumbags, he's an extra level of degenerate immoral scumbag, and again, "we will not determine degrees of immorality".
So while I would suspect my argument would not be successful, I do believe it's not nearly as open and shut as one would think at first glance. It would definitely warrant a response from opposing counsel and oral arguments specific to that question.