Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

News, Views, and Gossip For poker news, views and gossip.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-22-2019, 02:42 AM   #9176
joepickems
banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Posts: 33
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by inmyrav View Post
1. I was more asking what is normal is the legal field. I'm sure potential profits vs. actual losses comes up all the time. Do the courts have a rule for this in Calf?

2. I'm not saying or suggesting she did anything that would expose her to liability on her own, but if Stones faces liability, and she helped organize that game, an argument could be made that she could have had some responsibility to make sure the game was run in a safe secure manner. I agree there are all sorts of potential conflicts, is that normal in a class action?
Veronica is worth jack **** so her 10/hr announcing while getting drunk is not really that important. So what she was promoting the cheating game. She knew what she was doing but for her to say Mike owes her anything is absurd.

I personally think ANY gambler who is asking for their money back is absurd too. If the casino wasnt "in" on it then he should have been asked to not play anymore and also "kill" the stream because of its security vulnerability
joepickems is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 03:04 AM   #9177
kiddo1987
centurion
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 144
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Are there any new developments over the past few days or are we all still awaiting the findings from the investigation(s)?
kiddo1987 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 03:16 AM   #9178
joepickems
banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Posts: 33
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by washoe View Post
It would have been possible.
You don't have to tweet. You can just observe and bust him when you have something later. He would have continued...

Now you have just a bunch of nothing. (No hard evidence)
Noone deserves anything back and nobody deserves to catch him in the act. I would have gotten a bad vibe from the table and would have cursed mike out. I'm surprised everything was so under control. most likely because there were plenty of other ppl at the table(s) who knew what he was doing and was avoiding him like the plague
joepickems is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 03:34 AM   #9179
joepickems
banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Posts: 33
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake Stanton View Post
when i read about this story all i can vision is, "moneymaker created the poker boom" and "postle killed poker"...
Moneymaker is a co-consirator for promoting this cheat by being a "featured" guest and making it seem like everything is on the up & up but he knew damn well that the casino was ripping everyone else off.

Nothing to see here! and this type of "advantage gaming" is seen throughout casinos. and its lame the way it looks playing poker. the other table games look more like a boss cheat!
joepickems is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 04:16 AM   #9180
Imonibus
stranger
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 2
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

The lawyer defense is the biggest LUL I've had in a while, to be honest: "When I play poker I lose almost every hand, so I know such streaks are possible."

Fortunately, in the document provided for the court there's a lot of details included on how professional poker works and how Mike Postle could have cheated.
Imonibus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 04:25 AM   #9181
MDR
banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 162
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by FellaGaga-52 View Post
Good point. In the interview where he says "It's so easy when you can see the cards," he's doing something classic. Narcissism is infused with wanton lying, and this is another level of it. It's a disdain for truth, where you actually admit/confess what is true in a way that can't be believed. Multiple levels of dishonesty, inherent.

The great Bill Cosby, in his 60's comedy routines, had a thing about drugging women and having sex with them. On the microphone, in front of the audience. Just like this guy.

There's nothing new under the sun, just the honest character of the integrated human being, and the jaded, insincere callous dishonesty of the alienated shell/mask of a human being. And of course some levels in between. When it's pure, it's pure.
Completely agreeing with you. When people that are cheating like Postle or others witch are harming people with intention, their reasoning is that since they tell you straight to the face, you are the sucker if you fall for it.
MDR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 06:52 AM   #9182
washoe
veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Posts: 2,638
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MDR View Post
Completely agreeing with you. When people that are cheating like Postle or others witch are harming people with intention, their reasoning is that since they tell you straight to the face, you are the sucker if you fall for it.
def a narc. and def. trying to manipulate reality. Only thing is he is not good at it.
washoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 10:54 AM   #9183
harkin
Pooh-Bah
 
harkin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Tahoe
Posts: 3,998
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Imonibus View Post
The lawyer defense is the biggest LUL I've had in a while, to be honest: "When I play poker I lose almost every hand, so I know such streaks are possible."
When I heard that I just presumed the target audience was prospective jurors who were bad at gambling.
harkin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 12:50 PM   #9184
persianpunisher
veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 2,416
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Who’s this Mac guy that’s representing the players in the Postle case. Offering a 2nd free dinner on Twitter... seems like some sleazy time share tactic. Is he friends with nick vertucci?(sp?)
persianpunisher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 02:26 PM   #9185
kiddo1987
centurion
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 144
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by persianpunisher View Post
Who’s this Mac guy that’s representing the players in the Postle case. Offering a 2nd free dinner on Twitter... seems like some sleazy time share tactic. Is he friends with nick vertucci?(sp?)
What’s wrong with Nick?
kiddo1987 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 02:50 PM   #9186
lawdude
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 10,305
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by inmyrav View Post
1. I was more asking what is normal is the legal field. I'm sure potential profits vs. actual losses comes up all the time. Do the courts have a rule for this in Calf?

2. I'm not saying or suggesting she did anything that would expose her to liability on her own, but if Stones faces liability, and she helped organize that game, an argument could be made that she could have had some responsibility to make sure the game was run in a safe secure manner. I agree there are all sorts of potential conflicts, is that normal in a class action?
1. Nelson v. Reisner says that when the defendant's conduct makes it difficult to set damages, any reasonable estimate is fine.

So if it's impossible to calculate what these players really would have lost, the amount Postle took away from the game is probably viable as a damages number.

2. I don't see any basis for any sort of liability, even if she brought people to the game. She didn't KNOW of the cheating, she only suspected it, and she had received assurances from management that she was entitled to rely on. Plus, she played in the games herself, which indicates she did rely on those assurances.

But, again, I do hope that everyone who joined in that lawsuit was encouraged to obtain independent legal advice. I know there's several things that I would inform any client or prospective client about before advising him or her to join that suit. It's an ethical minefield if the plaintiffs' lawyers just signed people up without advising them to seek independent advice.
lawdude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 03:07 PM   #9187
Philbo
enthusiast
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 54
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Stone’s said in the Sac Bee that preliminary results of their investigation were going to available early last week & haven’t seen anything yet. Any locals have any updates? Has Justin been back yet?
Philbo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 03:31 PM   #9188
persianpunisher
veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 2,416
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by kiddo1987 View Post
What’s wrong with Nick?
He runs a predatory real estate program. Take 5 minutes to research his academy.
persianpunisher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 03:36 PM   #9189
sirdogstar
newbie
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 39
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Philbo View Post
Stone’s said in the Sac Bee that preliminary results of their investigation were going to available early last week & haven’t seen anything yet. Any locals have any updates? Has Justin been back yet?
A delay in announcing results indicates to me a greater chance that they found something incriminating in the system. Stones would be incentivized to announce a clean audit quickly if they had one.
sirdogstar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 03:59 PM   #9190
lawdude
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 10,305
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by sirdogstar View Post
A delay in announcing results indicates to me a greater chance that they found something incriminating in the system. Stones would be incentivized to announce a clean audit quickly if they had one.
Could also mean that principals are lawyered up and not cooperating. With at least the possibility of criminal charges hovering out there, people may not want to talk to Stones investigators.
lawdude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 04:12 PM   #9191
Philbo
enthusiast
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 54
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by sirdogstar View Post
A delay in announcing results indicates to me a greater chance that they found something incriminating in the system. Stones would be incentivized to announce a clean audit quickly if they had one.
Don’t disagree, little more complicated tho. Obviously, if nothing wrong was going on, it would be in their interest to get that out there as soon as possible. However, to make a statement like that takes a lot of work. Need to go through everything. If they say everything looks OK & then later something incriminating pops, they look like real jerks.

If I’m guessing, suspect they expected to be able to point the finger at certain people last week. Numerous reasons why they haven’t done that yet tho. Including but not limited to the gaming board asking them to hold off until they are ready to move.

They made a mistake giving a timeline.
Philbo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 04:58 PM   #9192
Austin Idol
newbie
 
Austin Idol's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 42
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by kiddo1987 View Post
Are there any new developments over the past few days or are we all still awaiting the findings from the investigation(s)?
Not sure which investigation you are referring too.

If you are referring to the Stones Investigation of itself - which they said they would update the public if needed... This investing is being conducted through the Stones Attorney. This investigation is a privileged investigation that is a work product of the Attorney and its client, so no information will ever be released or made public or can be subpoenaed, because it is Client Attorney privilege information. Probably Never Known

I saw some comments from people waiting for info on this, but it may never come out unless the Client (Stones) wants to release it. this is the reason corporations have Attorneys perform or hire out investiongation, because , what ever is found or discovered is kept secret under attorney client privilege.

If you are referring to the California Bureau of Gambling Control investigation - well that could be a while - a long while. I researched state statues and could not find any mention of when investigations needed to be completed and reported, so the timeline for this is Unknown.

I would like to hear about some info about what the Plaintiffs Attorney is investigating and what info they have received, if any, from Stones and other defendants through their discovery requests. Unknown.

If you are referring to Joe Ingram investigations, well time will tell. He seems pretty burnt out at the moment. But that does not stop Big Papi, he can drop a vid or start a stream at any time.

This ongoing investigation info is what we all want to know - but it looks like it will be along time before we get anything, especially, now that this is public and lawsuits have been filed, we will get the standard "we don't comment while an investigation or lawsuit is pending"

Don't think I am all doom and gloom - I would love to hear another interview of Mike P. with some new stories about how he is a crusher ( I have not seen receipts ),

how he plays other games al the time ( I have never heard of him playing other games recently off stream, and I hear when the stream is finished, he insta racks his chips )

and I would love to hear him talk about not winning as much money as reported ( but never denying cheating, or explain crotch theory, or how it is he can read souls )

and how he doesn't need the money so he does not play higher stakes (especially when he played online at the highest stakes and was the biggest winner on UB )

such a crusher that only dreams are made of - and in this case - it was not a dream - it was an illusion.
Austin Idol is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 05:16 PM   #9193
nickjehz
veteran
 
nickjehz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: OhSnap!
Posts: 2,112
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

we (as in me ) need some kind of cliffs.. Whats the latest? is he in jail jet?
nickjehz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 05:29 PM   #9194
lawdude
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 10,305
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

This is a good piece on potential defenses to the civil suit.

https://www.pokernews.com/news/2019/...seem-35686.htm

Now I will say that even though it is a good piece, several of the defenses he mentions are basically 0 percent to succeed. This guy is a lawyer (and apparently an excellent poker player), but he has the disease that a lot of non-lawyers have of assuming that if the defense has any answer at all, it will be magically believed by the jury. (So, for instance, no, it's not possible to explain all of Postle's hands in terms of things that good players might do occasionally-- 54 off all-in pre-flop and the JTo hand that folds when he makes top pair are 2 examples. And a lot of the evidence about crotches and hats is powerful not only by itself, but because it coincides with the time that Postle is in God mode.)

But several of the things he mentions really are likely defenses if a case ever reaches a jury.
lawdude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 06:25 PM   #9195
ChicagoJoey
Papi
 
ChicagoJoey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: I AM GTO
Posts: 15,434
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Found a hand Postle folds to a 3bet during the session I am going over this week lol


Last edited by ChicagoJoey; 10-22-2019 at 06:35 PM.
ChicagoJoey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 07:28 PM   #9196
Dadonk612
adept
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 1,011
Wink Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChicagoJoey View Post
Found a hand Postle folds to a 3bet during the session I am going over this week lol



Ooops prob should've balanced in that hand MP
Dadonk612 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 07:44 PM   #9197
YeahYou
Pooh-Bah
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 4,295
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

I'm sorry but anyone who thinks Mike's name being SMFC has anything or could potentially have something to do with him cheating is just out of touch with reality at this point. The thought process needed to come to that conclusion is so illogical I can't take anything else seriously.
YeahYou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 08:08 PM   #9198
Wolfferine
enthusiast
 
Wolfferine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Between a rock and a hard place
Posts: 79
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Philbo View Post
Don’t disagree, little more complicated tho. Obviously, if nothing wrong was going on, it would be in their interest to get that out there as soon as possible. However, to make a statement like that takes a lot of work. Need to go through everything. If they say everything looks OK & then later something incriminating pops, they look like real jerks.
If only they were so careful. This was posted on Twitter by Stones back in Sept.:

Wolfferine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 08:31 PM   #9199
Dick Tracy
old hand
 
Dick Tracy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Mid-West
Posts: 1,413
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChicagoJoey View Post
Found a hand Postle folds to a 3bet during the session I am going over this week lol

Only Dan Harrington would fold in that spot.
Dick Tracy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2019, 09:40 PM   #9200
Crane
old hand
 
Crane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,375
Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChicagoJoey View Post
Found a hand Postle folds to a 3bet during the session I am going over this week lol

I don't understand what point you are trying to make regarding this fold. You don't have to look at your pecker-cam to fold AJ to a three-bet in this spot.

What am I missing?
Crane is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:36 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2020, Two Plus Two Interactive