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Old 10-06-2019, 04:18 PM   #4851
chipset
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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There are ways around having to define a firewall rule that would otherwise prevent unsolicited incoming traffic from reaching an internal node, the easiest being having the app on the protected network initiate an outgoing connection - many router-based stateful firewalls are designed to allow such traffic to occur.
True, hence the reverse proxy comment. Something like NGROK running could do it. But, there’d be evidence on the machine running it, so looking at the system logs, registry, etc., would show any software that was installed.
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Old 10-06-2019, 04:20 PM   #4852
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by PraguePoker View Post
Someone said earlier that the Stones Live stream was on its own network within the casino. Which makes sense, since the guys who run security at the casino were probably hesitant to allow something like this on their network.

I wonder if that's how Mike's accomplice knew he couldn't be easily caught? Nobody outside of his team would know what was going on across that network.
If that’s the case, it could potentially be easy to determine who did it. It depends on the level of logging, but protocols and system accesses could be logged. Looking for non-standard ports, especially to the server, and client names would make it trivial to see if that was the attack vector.
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Old 10-06-2019, 04:24 PM   #4853
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by Kitty Viola View Post
After watching just a little of this "commentary" I am convinced that most of the commentators were picked specifically because they know very little about poker, so they wouldn't question all the ridiculous plays by Mike.

So tilting to watch Mike play some hand in an unfathomable way for thousands of dollars while the commentators are not even paying attention, talking about what they had for lunch or someone's new haircut or whatever.
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Old 10-06-2019, 04:31 PM   #4854
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by chipset View Post
If that’s the case, it could potentially be easy to determine who did it. It depends on the level of logging, but protocols and system accesses could be logged. Looking for non-standard ports, especially to the server, and client names would make it trivial to see if that was the attack vector.
A constant VPN connection involves a non-trial amount of continuous data transfer. If Mike accessed this over LTE instead of the Stone's WiFi network then his cell-provider likely has timed records of his running data usage and maybe even some granular IP records.
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Old 10-06-2019, 04:32 PM   #4855
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

So we know 100% he cheated
we know 99.9% he had help

How does this hold up legally, what will be the consequences for him ?

I have so little faith in justice system do i'm kinda feeling bad that this may nog become serious for him. But I really hope the justice system does work and they get their justice served.
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Old 10-06-2019, 04:37 PM   #4856
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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So we know 100% he cheated
we know 99.9% he had help

How does this hold up legally, what will be the consequences for him ?

I have so little faith in justice system do i'm kinda feeling bad that this may nog become serious for him. But I really hope the justice system does work and they get their justice served.
In my opinion, unless something new comes out, he will lose hard in Civil Court, but dodge criminal charges. People are heinous with stats and math, so even though we know the winrate is incriminating, a jury of 12 aren't going to be able lock a person up just due to this.

The best chance is that Law Enforcement gets involved (which they haven't, from all accounts) and someone confesses and/or flips.

There are also secondary charges, that unfortunately will have collateral damage. Mike admitted to what's tantamount to structuring by having others cash out his chips to keep under the $5k limit, but that would implicate some people, including his victims. I'm not sure any want to see that.

The best possibility for criminal charges would come from unreported earnings, now that a lot of his numbers are out there, he's made incriminating statements about his online winnings, and he has made clear statements about his livestream winnings that could be easily compared to his returns.
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Old 10-06-2019, 04:41 PM   #4857
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Live poker players, especially as you move up in stakes, are very observant people. Assume MA was cheating through two means

1. Cell with VNC access to the graphics interface.
2. Someone signalling him through a device.

Left hand always hidden between his legs in his crotch and eyes always darting down between his crouch is a bit strange no? Live players generally always keep an eye on their opponents, their mannerism, and their eyes. Maybe AP always wearing a hat deflects this, but still.

Every cardroom has their communities and cliques. I am assuming most of the players on stream are regs given the stakes (1-2-3, 5-5). Just am surprised if this never came out MA would have robbed them blind if he was cheating and none of the regs would have been the wiser.
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Old 10-06-2019, 04:45 PM   #4858
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by pocket_zeros View Post
A constant VPN connection involves a non-trial amount of continuous data transfer. If Mike accessed this over LTE instead of the Stone's WiFi network then his cell-provider likely has timed records of his running data usage and maybe even some granular IP records.
I'm really wondering if they set up a completely separate network for Stones Live from the beginning. Everything was kept isolated from existing Stones systems.

I would think the Stones IT security guys would be reluctant to allow access to a show that is streaming live from within the casino, and where they couldn't easily audit what was happening, new people coming to manage the show, etc. I can see them saying, "We approve their security setup on the condition that it never touches our network or our servers. They bring in their own servers, routers, networking equipment, etc."

In that case, there was never the need to get on Stones WiFi (their public WiFi available to everyone in the casino), because with this new live stream broadcast, they had all they needed, including WiFi access for anyone participating in the streaming broadcast, including players, completely separate from what others had in the casino. In other words, a separate, isolated operation, accountable only to themselves...

A lot of speculation above, obviously.
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Old 10-06-2019, 04:49 PM   #4859
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

What's the chances any useful logs were deleted? My concern, without knowing much about the specific software used, would be whoever was working with Mike deleted the logs on a somewhat related basis. Hopefully getting access to those logs is complicated and not possible, but if those logs are gone, is it possible Mike gets off scott free?
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Old 10-06-2019, 04:52 PM   #4860
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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What's the chances any useful logs were deleted? My concern, without knowing much about the specific software used, would be whoever was working with Mike deleted the logs on a somewhat related basis. Hopefully getting access to those logs is complicated and not possible, but if those logs are gone, is it possible Mike gets off scott free?
Given that Law Enforcement hasn't gotten involved, the servers haven't been confiscated, no subpoenas or anything, about the same odds that Postle is cheating.

I'd be surprised if laptops and phones in question aren't already at the bottom of the river.
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Old 10-06-2019, 04:53 PM   #4861
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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The smart thing to do was just act oblivious as ****. Say you are usually terrible and that you somehow have gone on an insane run this year. That was the best route. Not claiming you are a god lol.
I disagree. Like Joey correctly points out, the only statistical possibilities is that he is cheating or that he really is the most godly poker player who ever lived. That is the only explanation and needs to be his defense.
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Old 10-06-2019, 04:53 PM   #4862
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by ChipWrecked View Post
Has to be more locals ITT who haven't been rendered busto by family court and are still in the game.



He's taking about FLB, Rancho and Magnolia being where he's done all this crushing? Wtf? Does FLB (a bowling alley) still spread games? Aren't we talking maybe 10 tables total here?



Who ITT has observed him crushing it at Capital or Thunder Valley (understand he has a handful of cashes there over the years)?
Flb has 1 game running usually

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Old 10-06-2019, 04:55 PM   #4863
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Old 10-06-2019, 04:57 PM   #4864
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Here is some more evidence that possibly points to Lance (if it is indeed him in the pictures below) being an accomplice.
When I initially skimmed through the session from December 17, 2018, I didn't notice any crotch-staring, or extreme god-moding. Postle folded pre quite often, lost some pots, and won a big one when he rivered a boat and got bluff-raised by someone else.
Then I saw the ridiculous bluff-raise with AQ on the river when the lawyer binked a weak pair of 7s.

But what happened shortly before that obvious Godmode hand?

This did:
A bearded man in a Run It Up (?) hat walks in and stands near Mike and the dealer:

He appears to take a headset from the dealer, places it on his own head, and then gives the dealer another headset:

Then he disappears from view.

Shortly afterwards, Mike moves back from the table and excitedly checks his phone:

It's possible he was checking sports scores, but equally, he could have been getting the go ahead to receive hole-card information, which could - in this case - be as simplified as whatsapp messages like "Lawyer has T7cc".

I'm unsure if Postle god-moded the next couple of hands. I didn't look at them closely, because he folded early on. But then there was the insane AQ vs T7 hand, where Postle is winning all the way to the river, and then makes an audacious bluff-raise when the lawyer sucks out:


You can see the timestamps on those screengrabs, but the whole sequence starts at 1:24 with Lance's (?) entrance: https://youtu.be/4pSUbMEXHGM?t=5039
and the real craziness in the AQ v T7 starts at 1:33: https://youtu.be/4pSUbMEXHGM?t=5581
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Old 10-06-2019, 05:02 PM   #4865
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by MasterLJ View Post
Given that Law Enforcement hasn't gotten involved, the servers haven't been confiscated, no subpoenas or anything, about the same odds that Postle is cheating.

I'd be surprised if laptops and phones in question aren't already at the bottom of the river.
This is exactly correct. And if Stones Live Poker did have an isolated operation there, completely cut off from Stones servers and networks, well...

Let's just say I think Mike's accomplice was very well versed in both poker and IT, and was (is?) likely one of the key technical guys on the team. He was probably logging the minimum, and wiping everything. Certainly after this story broke.

I would really be curious what kind of auditing happened over the past 2 years, if any. What kind of logging software is used, hopefully as a requirement to operate anything within that casino?

Or if Stones IT security just said to the crew managing Stones Live Poker: "Keep your stuff off our network and away from our servers, keep your cameras confined to that small part of the casino over there, and you're on your own."
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Old 10-06-2019, 05:06 PM   #4866
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

OK I KNOW that we are already 100% sure that he cheated but someone should show this hand to Mike and ask him to justify it.

He won't do it. He can't do it.





1 - He calls a 3bet pre flop with JTo oop (2 overs)
2 - He calls a small flop bet (backdoors)
3 - HE FOLDS TO A REGULAR BET ON THE TURN WHEN HE HITS TOP PAIR

These actions can't coexist within the same play. There's no logic whatsoever.

There is no poker player in this world who would take these lines and fold the turn when hitting top pair.
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Old 10-06-2019, 05:06 PM   #4867
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by MasterLJ View Post
Given that Law Enforcement hasn't gotten involved, the servers haven't been confiscated, no subpoenas or anything, about the same odds that Postle is cheating.

I'd be surprised if laptops and phones in question aren't already at the bottom of the river.
Phone service provider has records and I'm sure texts would be incriminating enough - would be GG if a court signs off on it but convincing them isn't the easiest battle.
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Old 10-06-2019, 05:10 PM   #4868
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by ArtyMcFly View Post
Here is some more evidence that possibly points to Lance (if it is indeed him in the pictures below) being an accomplice.
When I initially skimmed through the session from December 17, 2018, I didn't notice any crotch-staring, or extreme god-moding. Postle folded pre quite often, lost some pots, and won a big one when he rivered a boat and got bluff-raised by someone else.
Then I saw the ridiculous bluff-raise with AQ on the river when the lawyer binked a weak pair of 7s.

But what happened shortly before that obvious Godmode hand?

This did:
A bearded man in a Run It Up (?) hat walks in and stands near Mike and the dealer:

He appears to take a headset from the dealer, places it on his own head, and then gives the dealer another headset:

Then he disappears from view.

Shortly afterwards, Mike moves back from the table and excitedly checks his phone:

It's possible he was checking sports scores, but equally, he could have been getting the go ahead to receive hole-card information, which could - in this case - be as simplified as whatsapp messages like "Lawyer has T7cc".

I'm unsure if Postle god-moded the next couple of hands. I didn't look at them closely, because he folded early on. But then there was the insane AQ vs T7 hand, where Postle is winning all the way to the river, and then makes an audacious bluff-raise when the lawyer sucks out:


You can see the timestamps on those screengrabs, but the whole sequence starts at 1:24 with Lance's (?) entrance: https://youtu.be/4pSUbMEXHGM?t=5039
and the real craziness in the AQ v T7 starts at 1:33: https://youtu.be/4pSUbMEXHGM?t=5581
Again, I'm biased when it comes to Lance (and that is Lance). But he gives the dealer a headset, and puts nothing on his head. It seems the dealer simply didn't have a headset, so he gave him his (he doesn't place anything on his head).

12/17 is Monday, during Football season, and Postle is looking in the direction of the screens.

Lance did run the stream until March-April 2019, and helped set it up.

I do think anyone with access to the stream is worth being investigated for sure. Lance has incidentally been on stream a very small number of times, whereas folks like Justin almost make it a point to skulk around. And clearly the god mode continued after Lance was no longer producing the show for the bulk of 2019. Lance was also in town for June/July of this year when Postle was unable to Godmode.

I don't want to go too far into defending Lance because I know him personally and have my own opinions. If something damning comes up, it is what it is, but I'm not sure the two interactions we've seen of him on stream constitutes anything suspicious and you got the account somewhat wrong. Lance gives the dealer *a* headset, and walks away without one. Then a godmode raise happens ~10ish minutes later with Postle having the bulging hat. If he were relaying over the headset, he certainly wouldn't want to give his away.

EDIT: nevermind, Lance does put it on his head. Sorry, there are two isolated incidents, and going backwards I just saw the first one. First time, they switch headsets, Lance puts it on his head. A few minutes later, Lance comes back, gives the headset off his head and leaves without one. 10 minutes after that AQ godmode hand
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Old 10-06-2019, 05:13 PM   #4869
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Rancho the other day had no games in the afternoon. Dude is not building a major bankroll out of these places. Not cash games.
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Old 10-06-2019, 05:13 PM   #4870
PraguePoker
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by AmazingErvin View Post
Phone service provider has records and I'm sure texts would be incriminating enough - would be GG if a court signs off on it but convincing them isn't the easiest battle.
Can't believe they would be stupid enough to text, but anything is possible.

My guess is they confined everything incriminating regarding IT to servers that never went on the traditional Stones network, and hence they are wiping them now. That they ran their own network (Stones Live Poker) on top of their own servers, which was operated as a separate entity within the casino.

And Mike communicated with his accomplice (assuming only one) over Signal (if they were smart) or at least Telegram/WhatsApp (if they were less smart). But not by regular SMS.
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Old 10-06-2019, 05:14 PM   #4871
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

I should point out, that my pictures might actually exonerate Lance, and place someone else in the booth.
e.g. Lance was doing the graphics earlier in the session, and then he goes down to the floor to change the dealer's headset, and someone else is then doing the graphics for the rest of the session.
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Old 10-06-2019, 05:18 PM   #4872
Redgrape
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by noshots00 View Post
He's innocent, calling it now. None of his plays are that suspicious, just a good feel player with a loose style. Notice how a lot of his bluffs are on paired boards? Pretty standard stuff for a live pro. I wouldnt expect a player who reads 2+2 to understand this tho.
Lolol
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Old 10-06-2019, 05:25 PM   #4873
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

I think we've reached the point where some of the focus needs to be taken off of Postle and his accomplice(s). MP is completely remorseless and for whatever reason the Stones Live PR crew is covering for the obvious fraud that happened.

The most prudent course of action might be to open complaints directly to Stones Casino and the California Gaming Commission in regards to potential negligence.

In most cases where publicity will make an establishment's security look bad the owners will do everything in their power to keep it quiet. Not for nefarious reasons but because of optics. Banks sometimes don't report bank robberies to the news and casinos take massive scam losses all the time without it ever making the news.

People don't want to go into a bank that's been robbed and people don't want to play at a casino where players have been scammed. Don't expect immediate cooperation from people running Stones just because it serves some form of justice.
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Old 10-06-2019, 05:25 PM   #4874
chipset
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by pocket_zeros View Post
A constant VPN connection involves a non-trial amount of continuous data transfer. If Mike accessed this over LTE instead of the Stone's WiFi network then his cell-provider likely has timed records of his running data usage and maybe even some granular IP records.
It wouldn’t require a VPN connection, but if so, there’d need to be VPN server or client software installed on the server.

VNC also requires a lot of data, perhaps that’s what you meant.
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Old 10-06-2019, 05:26 PM   #4875
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Have there been any more comments from Mike since he was on Matusows podcast?
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