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Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players

07-21-2011 , 04:18 AM
I'm grunching but why do these threads always get so many posts? OP literally said nothing of interest, no **** the best live players are going to be better at playing live poker (on average) than the best online players just like the best live players will most likely go broke playing the best online players in an online setting. You mean to tell me there's more information in live poker, that live players are more accustomed to noticing and exploiting? WOW!

The best live players can include online players, and vice versa. Ivey is amongst the best online players, and similarly it's very likely someone like ike is in the top 50 live cash players.

....

None of this is news.
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 04:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by prodonkey
I'd rather ask why do the online pros that come from having 20 seconds to make a decision always seem to take forever playing live?
Ya, know I've seen people ask this one here a lot.

I don't play anywhere near the level of the people they are normally talking about.


But I generally play 9 to 12 tables of 100NL and/or 200NL online and live I'll play 2/5NL (or 1/2NL if I'm waiting for a 2/5 table):

On some decisions at the live game I will think for a while. Definitely longer than I could spend on most decisions online. Why? I've thought about this a tiny bit. Maybe (in no particular order):

1.) I can. I have more time now and I can use it if I want to.

2.) I'm not as used to live play. The play of the average online player and the play of the average live player is different. I'm more used to the average online player. Just taking a little bit to think through what would generally happen in live play here. (Of course unless I know enough to have a more specific read on the individual.)

3.) In a bunch of situations I have to count the size of the pot (I often try to keep track of it throughout the hand) and then determine my pot odds depending on the size of a bet I am facing. I may count multiple times to make sure I'm right.

4.) Similar to 3 I may just want to count the pot to decide what bet size to make.

5.) Also similar I may want to try to determine how large the stacks of my opponents are. Gotta count (estimate).
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 04:28 AM
Have you seen jungleman or isildur play alot live? no. durrr, Phil Ivey and Phil Galfond also played alot online b4 black friday. Galfond maybe still does
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 05:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by avaholic
Live tells are important.



EDDtown, since you taught Claudia all she knows, would she be able to pick up on this tell?



So glad I stumbled onto this thread. I have lol'd at more posts ITT than in any other thread I have ever read and this post is my favorite.

Also, Daliman, thanks to this thread I found the other thread about the match with EC10 or whoever, that thread also delivered, congrats on winning! I wish AEJones would take you up on your HH analysis, would be so awesome.
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 05:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by loveinvain


So glad I stumbled onto this thread. I have lol'd at more posts ITT than in any other thread I have ever read and this post is my favorite.

Also, Daliman, thanks to this thread I found the other thread about the match with EC10 or whoever, that thread also delivered, congrats on winning! I wish AEJones would take you up on your HH analysis, would be so awesome.
Thank you, sir. Yes, those were the days. Actually casual acquaintances with both EC10 and AEJones now, (more with AEJ).
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 05:47 AM
Since joining 2+2 I have cancelled my cable contract and not watched any tv for 2 weeks. I must be reading about 5 hours worth a day(sad I know). I would like to thank a few people for the entertainment you're giving me(I think naming them would be unfair and rude).
None of what I'm saying is a joke or sarcasm. Thank you all, keep up the good work.
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 05:53 AM
CLIFFS:


EDDtown: Live players are better playing live
samoleus: HU?
EDDtown: Why argue? I'm done with this thread.
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 05:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daliman
Thank you, sir. Yes, those were the days. Actually casual acquaintances with both EC10 and AEJones now, (more with AEJ).
That's nice to hear. I'm sure there are many stories like this - people swinging their dicks at each other online and they meet IRL and get along just fine.

BTW I remember you from the STTF days when I was more active, I remember you and curtains arguing and stuff, now those REALLY were the days LOL.

You always seemed like a nice enough guy to me, come think of it, pretty much everyone in the STTF seemed nice enough. If you ever find yourself in Estonia (admittedly not very likely), I'll happily buy you some beers.

Be well.

Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 05:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cafe Noir
CLIFFS:


EDDtown: Live players are better playing live
samoleus: HU?
EDDtown: Why argue? I'm done with this thread.
And I LOL'd once again. This thread really is the nuts.

What I really love about samoleus's offer is that he phrased it so nice and polite, probably too much to hope for that this actually happens.
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 06:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by loveinvain
That's nice to hear. I'm sure there are many stories like this - people swinging their dicks at each other online and they meet IRL and get along just fine.

BTW I remember you from the STTF days when I was more active, I remember you and curtains arguing and stuff, now those REALLY were the days LOL.

You always seemed like a nice enough guy to me, come think of it, pretty much everyone in the STTF seemed nice enough. If you ever find yourself in Estonia (admittedly not very likely), I'll happily buy you some beers.

Be well.


I also remember those STTF days.
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 07:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDDtown
Casey, your the reason I still come to these forums anyway, always some naive smartass thinks he knows it all out to pull out an insult. If you had half the 20th I Q of your number of post maybe you could make some assumptions of your own based on logic of my post.
LOL sounds ALOT LIKE OP
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 07:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pinkpantherr
LOL sounds ALOT LIKE OP
Meh, OP probably didn't take into account that Casey may have been triple range merging his intelligence.
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 08:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDDtown
Anyway done with this thread...
So you are not accepting samoleus challenge? Despite the fact that he rarely plays live and as such you should be able to crush him regardless of his online skill?

1) Make delusional claims
2) Get challenged
3) Leave thread ignoring the challenge
4) ????
5) Profit
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 11:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by avaholic
Live tells are important.



EDDtown, since you taught Claudia all she knows, would she be able to pick up on this tell?

wp
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 12:03 PM
love how he writes that whole thing, plans on proving it by listing the top 10 players in the world then realizes he is wrong so just doesnt list them
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 12:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shavedcoidpurse
love how he writes that whole thing, plans on proving it by listing the top 10 players in the world then realizes he is wrong so just doesnt list them
I assure you, he has not realized he is wrong.

I will start off his list for you, however:

1. Gabe Costner
2. Claudia Crawford
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 01:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by recipro
I agree that there is a secret group of amazing soul-reading live players that never become famous. They play in private games and underground card rooms only. We're talking games that only Tony G can get into.

They would crush any online pro or famous TV pro, easily. I would bet a lot of money on it. (But I don't know who they are because no one does--they are secret.)
AWESOME post
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 01:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by loveinvain


So glad I stumbled onto this thread. I have lol'd at more posts ITT than in any other thread I have ever read and this post is my favorite.

Also, Daliman, thanks to this thread I found the other thread about the match with EC10 or whoever, that thread also delivered, congrats on winning! I wish AEJones would take you up on your HH analysis, would be so awesome.
link please?
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 01:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by samoleus
EDDtown,

I think your points in this thread may well be very good ones - and as an almost exclusively online player, I suspect that I might be making a big mistake here with the following offer.

I can tell you that in the last four years or so, I have only played live a total of about 20-25 sessions - and most of those have come since Black Friday. Furthermore, I can tell you that I have NEVER even been to Las Vegas since becoming a poker player. If what you are saying is true, then you will have a huge edge over me, because I truly can't pick up much in the way of physical tells when I play live. Despite that, I am willing to offer you a challenge.

I will play you heads up live for any stakes that you wish. I will play deep stacked (say 300-500bb?) which is of course more in line with the live play that you have so much experience with (as opposed to my 100bb online experience). If the stakes are high enough, I will travel to anywhere that is convenient for you to set up this match. We can play for a predetermined amount - or if you prefer, for a given amount of time.

Again, I emphasize that I have hardly ever played live - so if your statements about live tells and reads are correct, then you will have a huge edge over me. Nonetheless, I am willing to take on the challenge: perhaps it will be a learning experience for me. If you are willing to take me up on the challenge, please send me a message. I only come on to 2p2 once every few days at the most, so please forgive me if I don't respond immediately. I am looking forward to hopefully playing you.

Niman

Quote:
Originally Posted by EDDtown
I would play you if I ever ran into you, I live in biloxi MS . But its not about ego with me or even the money for that matter so I would never make a trip just to play someone. I would just tell you that if your ever in town or run into me in vegas to hit me up & we will play.


I don't even like playing HU live because its too slow , would have to have multiple dealers. I also will only play moderate stake in casinos. I would play much bigger outside of a casino with a normal deck of cards. I posted a thread earlier about why, There is technology in the casinos now that can be used to cheat. Infared lasers

Quote:
Originally Posted by samoleus
EDDtown, if you are willing to play for high enough stakes, I will come to Biloxi or anywhere else that you like to play. Because of the obvious dangers of infrared lasers used to cheat in casinos, we can either play in a casino of your choosing or hire our own dealers (perhaps through a neutral third party?). I'm not sure what you mean by HU being slow, but surely it will be worth your while if we play for high enough stakes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by samoleus
I literally have never been to Vegas since before I knew the roles of poker. ... I used to play live twice a year when the WPT came to Foxwoods, but I stopped doing that about four years ago and had not played a single live hand in over three years until Black Friday.

If the OP's statements about live tells is correct, he's going to be in a huge +EV spot if he takes me up on my challenge. If he believes what he has been saying, I can't imagine why he wouldn't play me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EDDtown
Anyway done with this thread, I had this conversation with Daliman a couple of weeks ago & saw it mentioned last night so I felt that someone with more knowledge on the situation needed to chime in, I keep hearing the same thing about online players being the best, They are better than the average live player & thus why they are winning against average live competition, but the best live players which are the ones that have studied body language are better than the best online players. It's actually pretty simple. Not sure why everyone wants argue it.

^^^ was EDDtown's last post ITT.


too good, needed to be quoted together.
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 01:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by J0hny
If Daliman would have not told that he indeed played live with that guy i would still believe this is a level.
I know. I've never been so happy to have Daliman come into a thread before!
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 01:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ucantcme63
link please?
Enjoy!

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/19...s-nose-166561/
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 01:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by loveinvain
thank you!


Enthusiastically,

ucantcme63
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 02:01 PM
Had to chime back in after seeing that pic of Claudia, HA. Have to admit that is pretty funny.


But you know whats even funnier, The intelliect & logic applied by the naive internet players on this forum, I've never laughed so hard in my life & some of the post you make.

I don't understand why there is such mystery with the common sense logic behind this thread. My results pretty much speak for themselves. I've been proving people wrong ever since I started playing poker.


I'm not even a tourney player & the first year I played tournaments I finished with the most final tables, I've mowed through fields of thousands of players including the 2nd biggest field ever & the 1st biggest field outside of the main event to hold chip leads in both with less than 1% of the field left, including a final table on the biggest 2k field ever. And 90% of my chips came from INTERNET PLAYERS. My whole strategy revolved around watching them & taking their chips because they were the ones splashing around in pots the most. Not bragging, but that's just how it is.

The stupid thing is that I used to play online, millions of hands online & at one point was #1 in full tilt frequent points after the site first opened, So I know 99% of what any online kid knows, plus I know all the other stuff they don't about live poker, because I've been playing it since before NL first blew up in the casinos. I'm definately seen more live hands than 99% of the players that have played in the past 10 years since NL cash started being spread in the casinos. I spent that part of my life studying it, So yea when I say I can play with anyone, I can back it up. I also put my money where my mouth is, just like when I said I would never wear an internet logo. That doesnt mean that I care to bounce around the country & play some online player HU, I don't care because I don't have to prove anything, Ive already did it. When I say that in 10 years of playing I've never played with anyone that I feel can extract more money out of a game when the cards run average, I'm just being honest.
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 02:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDDtown
Had to chime back in after seeing that pic of Claudia, HA. Have to admit that is pretty funny.


But you know whats even funnier, The intelliect & logic applied by the naive internet players on this forum, I've never laughed so hard in my life & some of the post you make.

I don't understand why there is such mystery with the common sense logic behind this thread. My results pretty much speak for themselves. I've been proving people wrong ever since I started playing poker.


I'm not even a tourney player & the first year I played tournaments I finished with the most final tables, I've mowed through fields of thousands of players including the 2nd biggest field ever & the 1st biggest field outside of the main event to hold chip leads in both with less than 1% of the field left, including a final table on the biggest 2k field ever. And 90% of my chips came from INTERNET PLAYERS. My whole strategy revolved around watching them & taking their chips because they were the ones splashing around in pots the most. Not bragging, but that's just how it is.

The stupid thing is that I used to play online, millions of hands online & at one point was #1 in full tilt frequent points after the site first opened, So I know 99% of what any online kid knows, plus I know all the other stuff they don't about live poker, because I've been playing it since before NL first blew up in the casinos. I'm definately seen more live hands than 99% of the players that have played in the past 10 years since NL cash started being spread in the casinos. I spent that part of my life studying it, So yea when I say I can play with anyone, I can back it up. I also put my money where my mouth is, just like when I said I would never wear an internet logo. That doesnt mean that I care to bounce around the country & play some online player HU, I don't care because I don't have to prove anything, Ive already did it. When I say that in 10 years of playing I've never played with anyone that I feel can extract more money out of a game when the cards run average, I'm just being honest.
Samoleus said he would fly anywhere (bounce around himself), all you have to do is agree to play and then wait for him. The fact that you have not even had the decency to respond to his challenge speaks for itself,

Big talk, but when push comes to shove, the big disappearing act. We've seen it all before, many times.

Put up, or shut up.
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote
07-21-2011 , 02:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by recipro
I agree that there is a secret group of amazing soul-reading live players that never become famous. They play in private games and underground card rooms only. We're talking games that only Tony G can get into.

They would crush any online pro or famous TV pro, easily. I would bet a lot of money on it. (But I don't know who they are because no one does--they are secret.)
Illuminati poker players itt.
Live play vs. Online & why the Top ten players in the world will always be live players Quote

      
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